Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

On Wednesday night (26th September) at 10pm on Channel 4 there is first of a 2 part program in which several people; including actor Keith Allen, a former MP, a ex-solider and a nurse. Take the illegal drug ecstasy in laboratory conditions hooked up to MRI scans.

Apparently some of them will be given a placebo, not the real drug.

Will you be watching? :confused: If not why?

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I've kinda seen it advertised but didn't take much notice, didn't know what it was about until you explained, i've never experienced the drug myself so might be interesting to watch, i've only ever smoked the odd joint, i've no need for drugs...you should see me fly when i'm on coffee ;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

It may be of great importance to you, therefore you will be watching, it isn't of any real interest to me so I won't be watching, is that O.K. with you?

If not,

I'll get a sick note from my Doctor excusing me from having to watch what you seem to consider is compulsory viewing.
:p

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I'm with Less......but my note will be from my mother. Mother knows best anyway.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Not remotely interested, so aint gonna be watching.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I think there are better adverts on other channels so will be watching them instead

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Probably not be watching, I see enough people on drugs " really live", to see the effects.

Don't think it's ground breaking, similar has been done before. Whatever floats yer boat I suppose.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Will not be watching, because I have a life and I cannot stand Keith Allen, who is up his own @@@@

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

He never learns another Drugs thread

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

All drugs arn't the same...

There are 25 people taking either A or B - one is the real thing the other is a placebo (in other words a fake pill with no effect). They are then given a 90 minute MRI scan, which is I think is an enclosed machine so no moving around.

Then I think it's a week later given either the real thing or placebo, the opposite of what they had the first time and tested again.

Personally I think it's fascinating.:D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

But do you like his daughter? :D:rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well you would you've got the experience;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well I won't be watching as I have no interest in taking drugs legal or otherwise.Unfortunately I have to take strong painkillers for a medical condition(morphine.liquid and tablet):(:(

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well I for one will be watching these programmes (there are two, one Wed and one Thurs), Keith Allen or no Keith Allen. It looks to me to be more science than sensationalism and as a scientist I shall be interested in the results and conclusion. I've never taken recreational drugs nor am I likely to but I'm still interested in learning more about the subject. It's all to easy to close the mind to such things but a few more facts can't be a bad thing before considering the evidence, even if it doesn't change one's mind.

I don't envy the participants if they have to spend too much time in a MRI scanner - not an altogether pleasant experience.

From the TV guide:

Two live programmes which follow volunteers as they take MDMA, the pure form of ecstasy, as part of a scientific study... The first live programme unravels the mysteries of MDMA, revealing how the drug affects the brain. The six-month long neuroscience study, designed by two leading experts on MDMA, uses functional magnetic resonance imaging (fMRI) to examine how MDMA affects the resting brain in healthy volunteers. The programme also looks at the potential side-effects and dangers of taking MDMA and includes a discussion with an expert who disagrees with the study and is sceptical about its purpose.

The second live programme investigates the implications of a scientific study of the effects of MDMA, including potential clinical uses such as whether it could offer a breakthrough in the treatment of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. The programme discovers what recreational users can learn from the trial before discussing MDMA's classification as a Class A drug and possible long-term effects.

The Daily Mail is concerned that the programme may encourage drug use but I think it's a brave attempt by Channel 4 to throw a bit more light on the subject.

Drugs Live: The Ecstasy Trial: Pioneering science -- or a cynical new low from Channel 4? | Mail Online


Actually I'd have quite liked to have taken part...

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

oh well being a peasant i will stay wi me closed mind.:rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Very well said Sue. :D What I don't get is why is finding out the facts about something so offensive to people like the Daily Mail? It seems to them it's OK to spread possible misinformation to put people off, rather than have a proper scientific investigation and clarify the facts.

MDMA was legal in the USA till about 1985 and in the late 70's and early 80's was used by hip Psychotherapists in that country and people reported miracle results in breaking down marriage problems etc. As the drug gets people talking in a way they would not without taking it. It was made illegal around late 85 and Psychotherapists were not allowed to use it anymore.

I havn't tried to get any, but from what I've picked up from the Internet and news reports etc - it's very hard to get pure MDMA now, the drugs dealers call it MDMA but it's not pure, it's cut with other things - which is actually more dangerous. Also the chemical MDMA is made from, is taken form trees that grow in the Rainforests of places like Brazil, Malaysia and the drug enforcement agencies are very successful at stopping gangs getting their hands on it. Either stealing it from legit chemists or they pay local tribes to break down the trees and extract the chemicals on site. Either way drug enforcement, are stopping the gangs who make the drug getting their hands on the raw materials. But that doesn't stop the gangs using other chemicals and calling it MDMA anyway.

You are right about the MRI scanner I certainly wouldn't want to spend 90mins in one, especially under the influence, when body movement is restricted.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Its not offensive to me in the slightest, i'm just not interested as i already said,:rolleyes: But after denying it all these years, i'm beginning to wonder seriously if there is a clique on accyweb.:rolleyes::D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I regard synthetic drugs as a form of pollution of the mind and body.

My interest is with natural plant chemicals.
I have just watched a documentary about -
Ayahuasca - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The Man Who Drank the Universe on Vimeo

If I didn't have an old wrecked body I would like to experience that.

It provides healing as well as spiritual enlightenment. There is a woman shown as having severe Parkinsons symptoms before, and smooth rhythmic movement after.

DMT is produced naturally in the body. Taking this herbal brew adds more, and lets it linger to produce an effect.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well cannabis, heroin and cocaine all come from plants as well...

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I am aware of that, but they have been 'processed'.
I have experienced home grown natural cannabis , but none of the adulterated junk.

Unless you regard tea brewing as a 'process' the Ayahuaski is natural.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Have you read Graham Hancock "Supernatural; meetings with the ancient teachers of mankind." In which the book starts with him taking that drug; Ayahuasca.

Ibogaine is one I read a lot about.
Ibogaine - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Apparently they use it and it's highly effective for curing heroine addiction over night - it sends the user into a dream world in which they meet the cause of their addictions.

The experts say that the pineal gland which we all have produces DMT and that is why we all dream, though some of us don't remember them, DMT was available as a recreational drug - though I've never tried it.

It makes sense that when we were still hunter gatherers we must have started taking these magic mushrooms and other herbs and plants, by accident and then deliberatly knowing it would effect our minds.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I have read Graham Hancock's first novel Entangled, which he says is based on his ayahuasca experience.

It had a theme of time travel and metamorphosis/morphing but as a novel was disappointing - it didn't have an ending.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Never read it. The one I mentioned is factual and asking the question what made mankind suddenly develop art and culture about 50,000 years ago.

I read most of the Carlos Casteneda books.:)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I'm with you on that one Beni, its bad enough take tabs etc for medical conditions never mind just for kicks:(:(

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well I wont be going out of my way to watch it. If there is nothing on the TV...perhaps. But thinking about it. I have seen people take this in my youth and Its annoying.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Have you never? :) Anyway it will all be very scientific, they won't be dancing around to music, I wouldn't think.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Not like the old days hey;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

More than one I suspect...:p

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

No:rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I had hoped this thread wouldn't turn into a "have you had it" kind of thread. But. Now that we have crossed that line....

Scientific or not. I've already seen the effects of it. I don't feel the need to watch strangers take it.

If they wanted it to be real scentific they should give them various ones from the street, totally random and document the possible horrible effects that MDMA and whatever horrible things they might mix with it(like ketamine) has on people. It might open some eyes.

Have I took it. Not at all. Never would. There are a few factors to why I never.

• I can't stand rave music
• I don't like dancing
• I am not a "touchy-feely-huggy" person
• Seeing other people and the various ways they acted(one guy just laid on the floor in the bathroom and threatened to kill anybody that entered)

Well no thanks

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

As I haven't had that dubious pleasure, that is why I am going to watch it.

There may be a whole series in there, but it does take cash to carry out these experiments and trials. This one took six months and involved use of expensive equipment.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Now that possibility would never have occurred to me, only being a peasant, Must be great to have a scientific mind.:p

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Thing is the drug was around before Rave music, it only became associated with that scene, so just because it has doesn't mean that is all it is. As for the guy who lay on the floor making threats - there are a multitude of reasons why he behaved that way.

Also just because criminals cut the drug with other things such as Ketamine, which I heard damages the bladder after long term use, doesn't mean much. The program is to research pure uncontaminated MDMA - not stuff off the street, cut with god knows what!

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Professor Nutt/Imperial College London http://www1.imperial.ac.uk/medicine/people/d.nutt/ is involved I think it may be his baby, as that is what his department do on a regular basis; investigate and reasearch the effects of various drugs on people to see if there are any benefits to be gained from them etc.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I have a feeling they will have pure MDNA. The effects of which would probably differ substantially from what was being sold when I was 18(1996)

If the act of taking the drug is Illegal. Wouldn't they have to be in a country where it is legal to perform this test? I would be interested to read your take on it. The MRI results etc.

Coincidence-- I was watching an episode of QI earlier and it came up on there on there...

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Yes in 96 it was all different to what it was in 80's and early 90's.

Certain researchers like Prof Nutt are licensed by the Government to carry out such experiments/research in the name of Medical Research etc. So it is legal.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

He puts his case here:
Is it right to take ecstasy in a TV trial? | David Nutt and Julia Manning | Comment is free | The Guardian

And it's not to late to join in the debate:

Got a strong opinion on MDMA? Keen to share a story about the drug? Renegade Pictures are looking for audience members for Drugs Live: The Ecstasy Trial  a groundbreaking scientific series presented by Jon Snow and Dr Christian Jessen, with Professors David Nutt and Val Curran.
You might have taken MDMA before, be anti-drugs or just interested in the politics& we're keen to hear a broad range of views.
If you're interested in joining the live studio discussion and are available on 26 or 27 September:
*Send an email to drugslive@channel4.com, with your name, telephone number, age, dates available, location and tell us why you want to be involved.
*Add "Audience" to the subject line.
Drugs Live: The Ecstasy Trial takes place over two shows on 26 and 27 September. It follows carefully vetted volunteers as they take MDMA as part of Professors Nutt and Curran's scientific study.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I would like to put forward that Less, Jaysay and Cashman all volunteer to be participants in the audience

:do-one:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well let's watch the programmes first and see what we can come up with.

Chemistry and pharmacology often come up with compounds that end up having a totally different use from that which they were first synthesised for, that's one of the fascinating things about research. For example, thalidomide, which had such terrible effects when used to treat morning sickness in pregnancy in the 1950s/60s, is now used to treat leprosy and as a cancer chemotherapy treatment.

I'd love to be starting a career in science again knowing what I know now, so many exciting things have emerged in the last forty years.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Why when i clearly said i aint really interested, yeh trying to bore me to death?:rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

For my amusement. :p

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

About 6 years ago there was a big hoohah about anti-depressants not working, there were reports in all the papers like the Independant claiming this as fact.

There was also a program on TV around similar time that gave evidence that a lot of people commit suicide after being put on anti-depressants such as Seroxat, by GP's in America and this country.

These issues now seem to have been swept under the carpet.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

The point is society bangs on about MDMA as being dangerous yet our GP's are prescribing drugs on a daily basis that dont' do what they are supposed to do and in many cases make people worse and can make people suicidal.

Warning: Antidepressants May Lead to Suicidal Tendencies

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Me neither;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Head Nail Hit;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Think you must have a thing about this Prof Nutt, you keep harping on about him, would his hero worshipers be Nutcases:rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Ya i'd make a quick exit to mate:)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well I have been retired from the NHS for 10 years and it was known about then.............the interesting word in the link is MAY.
Some anti-depressants help some people.......like some anti hypertensives work better on some patients.
In medicine there is no 'one size fits all' no matter what the drug companies might have you believe.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Ya Margaret nobody knows that better than me:rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

As Sue says, there are drugs out there which were formulated for one purpose and they were useless for that purpose(for whatever reason.....i.e, they didn't do what they were supposed to, or had other effects that were damaging.etc, etc) but were found to be useful in other areas of medicine...maybe at different doses or formats.
I have nothing at all against MDMA being used for medical purposes...under supervision/prescription, but am against it being taken for recreational purposes......where the person using it has not been assessed by a medical practitioner. In this respect it is an unknown quantity...you just do not know how the person will react to it. The other difficulty with recreational drugs is that they support a whole raft of criminal activities....and because the pushers want to make more money the drug is adulterated with all kinds of substances...which in themselves may be harmful when taken.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Yes that Panorama prog about Seroxat was a few years ago now.

Several points can be made about that drug and others that are used for similar conditions. Some apply to other drugs in general as well

• Even the largest and best structured clinical trial cannot hope to discover all side effects in all people. Only use of a drug in the wider community can find these out
• Would you rather have depression or take a pill to try and help it? The taking of any drug carries risks and consequences
• You don't hear from folks who have used the drug successfully
• While people may expect the drug to be an instant fix, these things take time to enter the system. This may account for the initial occurrence of anxiety, suicidal tendencies etc which may be caused by the drug or by the underlying condition which has not yet been affected by the drug. These effects should clear up as the drug is continued
• For similar reasons the drug should not be stopped suddenly but come off gradually so that its effects on the mind and body can be controlled
• Some of the unwanted effects of the drug may be due to reactions with other medications or treatments
• Other antidepressants have side effects too, it would probably be impossible to design a drug that was totally free of them
• As the link in Kes's post suggests, other substances have been linked to increased suicide risk as a side effect

So the drug continues to be prescribed and appears to have fewer side effects than older antidepressants. Only further research and trials may lead to anything safer and better tolerated.


On a personal level, and slightly off the subject of mind altering drugs, some Accywebbers may know that at the moment I am undergoing a course of chemotherapy. The possible known side effects of the drugs used were pointed out to me at the start and it has been interesting to note how and when these occur during treatment. As I mentioned above in respect of Seroxat, the drugs take time to work their way in to the system and the side effects show up when this has happened. They may be unpleasant and unpredictable but at least they show something is going on and anything unusual will be reported and added to the volume of data known about such substances. So our knowledge increases.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Seroxat was also used in a trial of Breast cancer sufferers who were on Tamoxifen.
a lot of the ladies on Tamoxifen reported serious menopausla symptoms.......seroxat was used to diminsh these effecst with good results.
Spot on Post Sue.
We continue to learn by people using these drugs....under medical supervision.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

People have been using psychotropic drugs since the dawn of time and it has been argued that altered states of consciousness have led to the birth of religions and culture.

The fact that science today can come up with new substances with these properties means that there will always be new experiences to try and there will always be people who want to experiment with them, as there have always been.

Surely the fact that illegal drugs support criminal activities is an argument for removing this connection by removing bans. Then substances could be sold under controls such as apply to alcohol and tobacco and the pushers would not have the upper hand. Then individuals would be free to decide for themselves whether or not to partake of any particular drug - as they do with alcohol and tobacco. The harm they may do to themselves, or not, would be up to them.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I would like to see you (and the other 3) tied down on TV and injected with recreational drugs! :p:D:D:D:D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

You do put forward a good argument for Euthanasia.:D

Somehow I suspect that if you are like that cat you must be on your last life by now, so post carefully.
;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I'm not entirely sure that legalising them would remove the criminal element.
The government would slap a tax on these recreational drugs...and then there would be those(criminals) who would try to sell them from illicit sources.....people would buy to circumvent the system, and so that they didn't feel like they were paying tax...I think most people like to feel they can steal a march on government taxes......duty free cigarettes are a rpime example of this.......I know people who have come back from Spain(or any other overseas destination with suitcases full of cigarettes/tobacco and booze.

The only advantage I can see for legalising recreational drugs is to improve the purity.......and regulate how they are sold. I'm still not in favour.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I think it's a very difficult problem really. If they are legalised then people will take that as a sign it's alright to take them, but society doesn't want to give out that message.

Then if it is legalised what does that mean? That sources where they come from now will still be in place? Or will the gangs in operation now be stopped by the Police - so that problem would not go away over night! Or will the government allow private companies to manufacture them for quality control. That could mean higher prices. Higher prices then could mean that criminals still have a market for cheaper drugs, that are impure - then kids still will die from taking stuff that is not pure. So it just becomes a savage circle - with no solution.

I really don't know what the answer is?:confused:

Anyone seen this film "Altered States" about a Professor experimenting on himself taking magic mushrooms in an isolation tank. Directed by Ken Russell :)- I saw it in the early 80's at the pictures - here is the trailer.

Altered States - Trailer - 225 kbps - YouTube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&fe...&v=40FiMy-ak0k

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

so the situation is still fraught with problems whatever approach is taken.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

That just about your barrow moron

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Think its actually dead but just doesn't realise it yet Less;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Thanks for the karma message! ;) unsigned! I was joking. :rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Not come across that one - seems to have a bit of a sci-fi slant...

This is another (in)famous one - celebrated in cult circles for its bad acting...

Reefer Madness - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Reefer Madness Trailer Great marijuana movie - YouTube

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

That's from The Hitchhikers Guide to the Galaxy - the answer to life the universe and everything = 42! ;) Do you know why? I don't? :rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Reefer Madness was a propaganda film to spread fear and panic about the damaging effects of marijuana in the USA.

Altered States is more like a adventure movie, that probably lead people to dabble in hallucinogenics - the main character turns into an ape and ends up running round the zoo killing animals. Very far fetched but interesting 30 years ago. :)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

There you go jumping to conclusions, it's unsigned, it could have been someone deliberately mis-spelling the comment to make you think it was Jay!


:D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Didn't think I needed to sign it, your not a good comedian;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Na Less the only thing I'll own up to is I forgot to sign it:D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Had this on in the background whilst playing games on my lap-top. Think it will give the wrong message completely to anybody who feels inclined to try these drugs recreationally. The participants are being strictly given so much ecstasy whilst recreational users are mixing other drugs with it.
IMHO the money being used for this research could be put to much better use

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Absolutely spot on Bernie:mosher:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

So you had it on in the background while playing games. Which means you weren't paying full attention. There are a lot of murders and rapes going on - so why show these actions on TV which surely, following your logic, showing rapes and murder on TV, which they do all the time, will encourage more people do rape and murder!

The point is - just because something may give people the idea to do something - should we effectively ban it?

Have your say! Take part in the Channel 4 on line survey now:

Drugs Live: The Ecstasy Trial - Features - Take our Drugs Live Survey - Channel 4

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Anyone can add their views to this survey. The results will be broadcast on the programme tonight.

Drugs Live: The Ecstasy Trial - Features - Take our Drugs Live Survey - Channel 4

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Hi Sue, That's twice today on this forum that someone has posted what I was thinking or posted what I posted at the same time. On the Nigel Farage thread it happened and here you just posted this link as i did!

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Ha ha Kes beat me to it. Unfortunately missed the first half of the prog and can't catch up on 4OD but will be watchng tonight.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Great minds think alike! :)

I thought it was badly made and did seem to pander a bit to the teenagers who may want to take the drug and be "cool!" But I suppose it was trying to cover all bases.

Also there didn't seem to be a point in giving them either a placebo or the real thing. I thought that was trying to catch them out?

Also again there seemed to be conflicting opinions about how damaging the drug can be which I found ridiculous that at this stage there are still Professors contradicting each other.

However hopefully things will be a bit more clearer tonight.;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Great minds think alike, how dare you insult susie like that:D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I was sort of listening but don't really need scientists to tell me about the effects that recreational drugs can have on everyday lives as I have been affected by a family member having an addiction (now conquered) to such drugs. So IMHO "YES" these drugs should be banned, don't know your personal experiences or circumstances and am not going to go into to much detail about mine,suffice to say it would have torn many families apart. I stand by my opinion that the money could go to much more worthwhile research.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

The point I made is that murder and rape are shown on TV on drama's several times a day on various TV channels we have these days - now some say that this causes a small minority to be violent and copy those crimes - again this point is something there are opposing strong opinions about. Just like the legalising drugs question.

Your saying that they shouldn't show this program on TV not only because it's a waste of money, but because kids will copy it and might try ecstasy because of it. When there is massive increased violence and stabbings etc - which could be linked to violence on TV and video games and so on!

So why is it OK to show all this violence on the cop drama's and horror films. But a little bit of drugs is wrong? :confused::rolleyes:

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Ya in a civilises society

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

So why all the violence in our society - shootings and attacks , which some say is caused by increased violence shown in films and computer games and so on in TV/films and Hollywood ! I find that nearly every Hollywood film that comes out is violent, I personally find that offensive - but what can I do about it. :confused:

Is this a civilised society? (PS your spelling is wrong!)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Um ya looks like yours is as well then;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

It has been argued that civilisation arose through drug use

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Chemical-Mus.../dp/0312352492

Everybody musta got stoned - Isthmus | The Daily Page

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Mushrooms-My...ref=pd_sim_b_1

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Not my civilisation it hasn't

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Civilize or Civilise, according to the Oxford concise English dictionary gentlemen. ;)

1. To raise from barbarism to an enlightened stage of development; bring out of a primitive or savage state.
2. To educate in matters of culture and refinement; make more polished or sophisticated.

And you pair are arguing the toss ??? :D

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

A lot of violent criminal behaviour is rooted in drugs.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Are you counting Alcohol in that statement Anne ?

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Got personal opinions. Go on the site and post them there. Perhaps that will do something constructive. Here it is just going around in circles, so perhaps this thread could stick to the discussion of the TV program and not post personal opinions about drugs. That can only lead to arguments and stuff. Seen it, done it and got bored by it.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well I thought the most annoying thing about tonight's (Thurs)programme was the long advert breaks: they were always having to interrupt the flow of discussion to cut to the adverts. And the programme because of its format was very bitty and too chatty - I don't think keep cutting to twitter and email comments and keep rushing about the studio does anything to promotea sensible discussion.

Anyway - and I would say this wouldn't I as it reflects my own thoughts - the most sensible comments came from Evan Harris, doctor and ex-MP who said he took part in the trial because it was important to investigate the science of the possible use of MDMA to treat post traumatic stress disorder. He said the scientists could do all sorts of trials but the government would probably ignore the findings which is a depressing thought.

It's happened before [from Wikipedia]:

In February 2009, the UK Advisory Council on the Misuse of Drugs issued A review of MDMA ('ecstasy'), its harms and classification under the Misuse of Drugs Act 1971, which recommended that MDMA be re-classified in the UK from a class A drug to a class B drug.

The government's veto was criticized in scientific publications. Colin Blakemore, Professor of Neuroscience, Oxford, stated in the British Medical Journal, "The government's decisions compromise its commitment to evidence based policy". Also in response, an editorial in the New Scientist noted "A much larger percentage of people suffer a fatal acute reaction to peanuts than to MDMA.... Sadly, perspective is something that is generally lacking in the long and tortuous debate over illegal drugs.

Anyway Prof Nutt said that the end that they had got funding for more trials, and that the MRI scanning data had revealed useful and previously unknown information about the effects of the drug on the brain.

And I don't for one moment think that the programme would tempt anyone to try this drug for the first time. There was no sensationalism, and a couple of profs said how dangerous they thought it was.

An interesting point was made about the drug as bought on the street: the researchers analysed the ecstasy that had been seized at a festival, Glastonbury I think - one third of the tabs contained no active ingredients at all and the rest were cut with various things, some harmful and some inert, but the average MDMA content of the tablets was almost exactly the same as the amount given to each of the volunteers in the trial.

My conclusions - a worthwhile programme, not easy to watch because of its style, probably watched mostly by folks who were sympathetic to its aims, and sadly not watched by many who jumped to conclusions about it before it was shown who might actually have found it interesting and learned something from it.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

An amusing aside: in one of the advert breaks they were promoting a product called Feliway which is a plug in device which emits a substance which is supposed to help control unwanted behaviour in cats. The ad ended with a dopey-looking cartoon cat purring on the arm of a chair and a line of text saying "behaviour therapy may be required".

So it's OK to drug your pussycat up to the eyeballs but you're not allowed to do it to yourself?

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Was that a joke about the cat needing "therapy!";)

Somebody on Twitter mentioned that they had an ad for "Special K" in one of the ad breaks - which is another term for the drug Ketamine.

All in all I think it was a very worth while program. The 2nd one was better of the two as it resolved some questions. There were clearly mixed experiences but isn't that the case with all drugs? Some people have adverse reactions to alcohol. This is also the case with prescription drugs, some people react adversely to some types.

Problem with MDMA is that it came to notoriety in relation to rave culture and thus has been tarred with a negative brush. If it had never been a rave drug and was being used in trials for use in therapy there would be no controversy!

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I'm not arguing Dave, just that birdie said I'd spelt something wrong yet he'd spelt it just the same way, I always thought that using z in a lot of words is Americanisation, we tend to use s instead of z in a lot of things, across the pond Americanisation is spelt Americanization for example;)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Almost 2 million watched Drugs Live TV show that 'lends a dangerous air of acceptability to the drug' | Mail Online

It would appear I'm not the only one who thought is program was a load of tosh, and a very dangerous road to go down, portraying drugs like ecstasy as okay

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

did it portray ecstasy as OK ? I didn't watch it

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well obviously I didn't watch it Restless, but it sounds like they did

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Answer to that is yes and no. Read my post 88.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Well it seems that drug use is falling, despite the DM's scaremongering about programmes like Channel 4's this week...

Illicit drugs appear to be 'going out of fashion' as figures reveal record decline in usage | This is Money

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I thought the theme music was a bit too "ravey", suggesting it was aimed at younger people. The music could have been more series.

It didn't portray it as OK really - there were a couple of Professionals who were adamant that it wasn't OK! Which is suppose is to conteract the 2 who throught it wasn't as harmful as we have been lead to believe. It covered all bases and gave an over view - positive and negative of the drug.

As I said it before, this drug hadn't played such a large part in the rave scene then I don't think we'd be even discussing it in this way.

Latest research is suggesting that tried and tested sleeping pills and tranquilisers may cause dementia!

Dementia risk from sleeping tablets: Pensioners on pills taken by 1.5m are 50% more likely to be hit, warns Harvard study | Mail Online

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

I agree with you about Keith Allen (and did before you wrote it) however in the program he was very arrogant and claimed the drug didn't work for him as he'd done it so many times before over the years.:)

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

Fortunately he was on screen for a very short time... No apparent celeb cult in this programme. Real people including a doctor/ex MP, a priest and the deputy editor of New Scientist, total participants 25.

Actually didn't notice the music as such, probably because I was already irritated by the frenetic tone of the programme, cutting here and there and leaping about the studio, probably as you say to appeal to a younger crowd.

Re: Drugs Live; the Ecstasy Trial.
 

He was on for a short time but his opinion was scrutinised. The ex MP also seemed a bit stiff and resilliant to the drug as was the soldier.

Also there was a bit that informed us how MDMA is made and made it sound really simple. I found this page posted of instructions of how to make it and the chemicals and equipment needed.

Doctor Drool's MDMA Synthesis - [www.rhodium.ws]

No way would your average individual be able to achieve this. But the program suggested it was easy.

Also Snow seemed a bit doddery and at one point seemed to be shaking his head for no reason, perhaps he'd been slipped one? ;)