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The problem with MP's is nto their salaries, their homes, or their pensions.
The major problem we have in this country is that most MP's are aligned and controlled by a major political party. in other words they are career MP's and they belong to the party not to their electorate.

Get rid of the career MP's (virtually impossible with our system) bring in MP's who really live in their constituencies and who trully represent their home towns and all the rest will work itself out.
The same is also true at council level

however, one thing we should not do is reduce the number of MP's, this will only give them larger constituencies and less time for local work (trust me I live in Blackburn I know how imp0ortant it is that a MP has time for his/her constituents)

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I think the relentless assault on MP's by the press recently isn't very productive. If people are genuinely fiddling expenses, then fine, but the media make such a deal of it that people think they're all at it. The vast majority of MP's don't go into it for the money, they could be earning a lot more in the private sector.

Busman who is your employer? I might be wrong but I thought you had to be given holidays plus holiday pay for all bank holidays including being paid a normal wage on bank holidays if you have to work.

One person to represent 68,000 people doesn't seem enough to me! If MP's didn't have staff I'd be calling for more of them not less.

Our system is much cheaper than the US, despite as you say, us having some 200 more elected representatives and some 700 more members of the other house.

I have to agree with you on wage increases. It should be an independent body who decides how much they deserve, not the MP's themselves.

I hope David Davis wins the Haltemprice and Howden by election, highlighting the problems with an ever intrusive state.

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It is my opinion that we need more mp's like this, I think many go into politics with good ideas, and end up having to toe the line to stay in a job, the perks are the incentives to 'drop' some of thier good ideas and do what many other mp's do, cream it!

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When you think that Greg represents around 60,000 people, which is about the norm, I'll bet he thinks he could do with a leg up not heaping more representation on him by say merging with Rossendale. On the whole I think MPs give good value for money, the press do seem to go OTT sometimes when it comes to slagging of parliament. People always think that MPs have an easy life when they see the ommons Chamber with very few people taking part, but most of the work an MP does is on in th Chamber but in committee and of course the constituncy.

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I don't, I would love to see his self-indulgent little stunt backfire on him. Everyone knows perfectly well about the controversy over the 42-days rule, so Davis is doing nothing but pandering to his own ego and wasting the taxpayers' money in the process.

As for his colleagues in the Commons, yes, there does seem to be a large proportion of them who have their snouts firmly in the trough. Their latest little wheeze over declaring their London homes as their family home is a prime example of this. Having said that, I'm sure there are MPs who don't put their own self-interest first and, to be fair, Greg Pope seems to be one of them.

However, what stopped me in my tracks was David Craig's assertation that 84% of the laws that govern us are now emanate from the EU. If this is true, then a large part of our MPs' workload has been lifted from their shoulders and their renumeration should reflect that fact. However, even more important than this, it would seem to signal the end of the UK as an independent, sovereign nation! :eek:

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The Wintertons spring to mind......they are both MP's and they have claimed money to which they were not entitled. They claim that it was an error....if they make this kind of error shouldn't we question their ability to represent their constituents.
And if one of us claimed something in 'error' wouldn't we be expected to pay the money back?.....but these honourable members can keep the thousands that they weren't entitled to.

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Businesses are down sizing left, right and centre. Both houses of Parliament should follow suit.

If MP’s really did represent their constituents in Parliament and were not hog tied by party politics, their constituents would not be seeking so many meetings with their MP.

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Excuse me? Businesses are down sizing, yes I'll go along with that, we've had the boom here comes the bust.


If the whole of Accrington becomes unemployed there are still going to be the same number of constituents that will need to be represented for the area, unless you have a drastic solution that will 'finally' solve it for us.
:eek:

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It would be simple to say that NOBODY should be allowed to contest a seat unless they had lived there for a minimum of 5 years. Why local parties adopt candidates with no interest in the seat whatsoever amazes me.

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Don't forget the Ball's Margaret, I mean Ed and the lovely Evete Cooper that is, just like the Wintertons onl the BBC don't make a song and dance about them:rolleyes:

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Can't agree more wadey, I seem to remember that Greg said he was going to move back into Hyndburn if elected, that was 15 years ago.:confused:

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Oh! How I agree with you.

I would extend that to Local Authority Councillors and also County Council Councillors, where Councillors must have lived in the ward/district that they intend to represent for 3 years.

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Jaysay, they only sprang to mind because they are the latest in a list of too many.
I wish more of these people had to live on a basic state pension for......let's say a month...just so that they could get a taste of the real world.
They don't know what hard work is.

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The problem with getting an MP to live on a pensioner’s income for a month is that there is an ending window to look forward to and they could probably rough it in the full knowledge that there is an end.

We pensioners don’t have that option. Our only ending is a very unlikely lottery win or a visit from the grim reaper.

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Yes, you are right...they do have a 'get out'...but perhaps it would make them a bit more sympathetic to the cause.......and i know sympathy doesn't pay the gas and electric bills....but they would know what it felt like to have to scrimp a bit......and it would make me feel better.:D

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To really understand the pensioner’s and low paid person’s plight you have to live it period. A snap shot, even a month long, soon gets forgotten. But it would be better than nothing I guess.

It’s a bit like suffering a severe and painfully injury or illness. Once better the actual pain is forgotten, although you do remember that there was pain.

Now which rich MP would like to change places with me?

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No the Ball's are the latest ones just last week, but the media don't give them the same coverage

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Oh, I must've missed that one.
I'd swop places with that one who called us all 'miserable'....I could be really miserable on his salary and allowances.

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There is one other point that seems to have escaped the notice of, or at least a comment on MP’s, by the contributors to this thread.

Many MP’s have secondary jobs in the form of consultancies and/or directorships.

My question is simple. Do we want part time MP’s? Because that is what some people have got.

Surely representing thousands of constituents has to be a full time job. And if it isn’t then an MP could handle a larger constituency and a larger constituency would mean fewer constituencies and thus fewer MP’s to make it a full time job.

Apart from a truly independent MP’s salaries and perks review body, no MP should have a secondary job (paid or unpaid). No man or woman can have allegiance to two masters and we, the public, have to be the only master that an MP has.

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Of course, we don't wish for part time MP's Jambutty, however, only candidates that have risen in the world of business, commerce and other professions as such are capable of running the country. Naturally, they do not always wish to give up their business interests, but when they do, their own interests do suffer. I do not resent one penny MP's earn .. have seen it first hand, and is expensive to become one .. yes, have to have accommodation in London (can you imagine the cost of that!!).

What annoys me more is the pedestal we put footballers, celebrities on, and the stupid vast sums of money they are paid. :mad:

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Over 1000 politicians for 70 million people does seem rather out of line ... for those who might be interested, Canada, with a population of 33 million, has 305 members of the Federal Parliament ... this seems pretty reasonable, although there are vast differences in the constituency sizes ... in area, if not in population. Peter Milliken, who represents Kingston and the Islands for the Liberal Party has a much easier time of it than Dennis Bevington, who represents the constituency of the Western Arctic for the New Democratic Party ... imagine representing an area way larger than England! On the other hand, each of the ten provinces has a Provincial Parliament which takes care of matters which fall under Provincial jurisdiction ... Health, education, highway construction and maintainance, supply of power, welfare etc. The Province of Ontario for example, has an annual budget of close to $100 billion .... I suppose if you count in the politicians who look after your counties and the cities, you have a lot more than a 1000 ... but maybe it's the quality of the work they do that should count, not the number of people doing the work.

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You agree with me that we don’t wish for a part time MP then turn right around and boldly state that you don’t resent one penny that MP’s earn, implying that were it comes from is OK by you.

A bit of a contradiction isn’t it?

I agree that MP’s should be drawn from business and commerce with some of life’s experience behind them. But to continue in their business and running the country at the same time will undoubtedly create a conflict of interest sooner or later.

If a candidate belongs to a political party, isn’t the expense of standing for election covered by party funds? It is only an independent candidate that has to fund his own election expenses and even then s/he will undoubtedly be sponsored by donations.

The MP’s cost of accommodation in London is paid for by the taxpayer, in the form of those allowances.

Although I agree with you in your last sentence statement, it is an irrelevance to this thread.

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No, Jambutty you have misinterpreted my post. I do agree that MP'ing should be a full time job, but extremely difficult to rid yourself of the business/professional interests you may have developed, and would pay them enough money to do this. Difficult to be pulled in all directions most of the time.

In other words, I am one of the minority that would pay them enough to concentrate more on running the country and to leave their other interests in safe hands.

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An additional comment on the thread opener: the 435 members of Congress in the US is a misleading figure. Like the Canadian figures, you have to take into account the State Governments, such as the one Arnie heads in California ... and all the local govts. and offices .... they even elect their Sheriffs and dog catchers ... if you add all these elected people to the 435, you come up with a hell of a big number. And you have to remember that in the United States, the Executive branch of the govt. is separate from the Legislative branch. And it is massive ... and largely unelected, altho' major appointments must meet congressional approval. I may not be completely correct in this, but I think I'm close; maybe one of our American friends will help us out. Probably won't be Barb, 'cause she seems to thing that the greatest threat facing America is the American government.:rolleyes: ... oh, and liberals.:hidewall:

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MPs are voting on what sort of pay rise they should have today. Wouldn't you like to be able to vote on your own pay rise?

Their current salary is £61,820 pa. On top of that, they're entitled to an allowance of £22,110 (which the vast majority of them claim). This is tax-free and is equivalent to earnings of £36,850, adding up to a package which is equivalent to £98,670. Plus their generous pensions, free transport and lots, lots more...but obviously, it's not enough for them!

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One news item today is that the MOD has signed contracts for two new aircraft carriers at a cost of £4 billion. They will be built in four shipyards around the UK and will provide work for some 10,000 people.

One will be named HMS Queen Elizabeth and the other HMS Prince of Wales.

This raises two issues.

The UK is NOT A WORLD POWER so we don’t need two new carriers even though we are an island nation. It could even be argued that we don’t need even one new carrier. Our current navy is large enough to defend these shores. Our current troops need proper equipment to enable them to carry out Blair’s Folly with a reasonable degree of safety and that £4 billion would be better spent on them.

The other issue is why those names? Traditionally British aircraft carriers have been named Invincible, Indomitable, Indefatigable, Illustrious, Ark Royal, Victorious, Albion, Bulwark, Hermes, Centaur, Audacious, Royal Oak to name just a few. Over 50 years ago there were two carriers being built due to be named HMS Queen Elizabeth and HMS Duke of Edinburgh but both were cancelled in 1966. They should have cancelled the monarchy at the same time.

The choice of those particular names is nothing more than a means of perpetuating the myth of the monarchy. In fact if you look around you will see that over the years we have been quietly brain washed into accepting the monarchy. Golf courses called Royal something. Hospitals named Royal Infirmary, Blackburn Royal, Queens Park Hospital. Royal Mail. The word royal, king, queen or prince crops up all over the place in place names. In fact our whole culture is littered with reminders of the monarchy.

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Would agree that the money could be better spend ... altho' the 10 000 who will be working on them would disagree ... the names are OK ... this would not be the first HMS Prince of Wales, the last one was sunk by the Japs on Dec 10, 1941. I like the names better than, say, USS Ronald Reagan, or the USS George H. Bush.

And you are not the only ones whose culture is "littered with reminders of the monarchy". In Kingston you can curl at the Royal Kingston Curling Club, drink at the Royal Tap Room, or the Prince George ... our main street is Princess Street, we have Queen Street, a King Street, a high school called Queen Elizabeth Collegiate and Vocational Institute, the local University is Queen's University, and the main residence dorm is Victoria Hall. Canadian warships are all HMCS, (we even have an HMCS Kingston), the local reserve regiment is The Princess of Wales Own .... we have the RCAF .... the list goes on and on .... Oh, and our city is KINGston.;)

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Seems the vote to reform expenses was lost. One Labour MP told David Cameron to 'f*** off' because Cameron and his front bench backed reform.

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The Mail have published a list of MPs who voted to keep the existing expenses system
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...-expenses.html

glad to see that Greg Pope didn't

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thanks fer the link margaret, interesting reading, all that voted to retain should be ashamed of themselves,but somehow i doubt they will, same as cyfr, who is playing slag the opposition again.:rolleyes:

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I see that my MP, Janet Anderson, wants to keep on the gravy train.

She wouldn’t have got my vote next time anyway but this makes sure.

It would appear that they voted to keep the existing expenses AND reject an independent audit.

It would be interesting to see the actual wording of the vote options. Because there is more to this than meets the eye.

As I understand it one option was to have an expenses allowance but not have to declare how it was spent. If that is correct where does that put Greg Pope and all those who voted against?

I don’t think that there was an option to discontinue the expenses.

So the way this item has been presented by the media could give the wrong impression.

I also notice that the call for fewer MP’s is gaining ground in a comment letter.

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The reason she probably voted to stay on the gravy train JB is that she won't be at the station after the next election;)

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He didn't vote against it either. He didn't vote at all. I hope there was a good reason for him not to vote for expenses reform.

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Could be the same reason many people dont vote in elections andrew, apathy, doesnt matter who we vote for, the elected party always look after themselves first and voters last, perhaps greg feels that the options were going to make no difference to the current carry on, I stronlgy suspect mp's would still be creaming it whatever the outcome was.

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The Liberals are best Derek, their best representation on any body is three, one to vote for, one to vote against, and the other to abstain, sorted:D

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Slag the opposition? I'm by NO WAY ashamed for highlighting someone being abusive at Cameron just because he voted to reform expenses because he sees there are problems with it! I thought that's what people wanted, more transparency, I certainly do. Instead we've ended up with no change at all.

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Quite jaysay, but isnt that pretty much what the other 2 do, one half for, one quarter against, one quarter abstention?, liberal vote the way you say to fit in with one of the other 2. ;)

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It was meant to portray what a waste of space the Liberals are Derek:rolleyes:

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I got that Jaysay, I was trying to portray what a waste of space the lot of them are. lol