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Rowlf 19-08-2015 21:56
E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
It is apparently being suggested that E cigarettes should be given on the NHS. I for one am appalled . At a time when we are told money is tight the very thought of funding something like this when children are having drugs denied them is for me a step too far.

Margaret Pilkington 19-08-2015 22:14
re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Illnesses caused by smoking cost the national health service a lot of money.
That is not the only cost which needs to be considered, there is the cost to,the nation of lost working days, there is the cost to families too when someone in the family suffers from an illness caused by smoking.
I have been retired from the NHS for thirteen years now.....when I was working there were prescriptions being given for Nicotine Replacement Therapy.....they were unpalatable and did not work very well.....so what is the difference?( and they were expensive too at that time)
The long term costs of not helping those who are ruining their lives(and maybe the lives of their children) outweigh the costs of not doing so.
Do you feel so strongly about drug addicts being given methadone to help them quit their drug habit....or the alcoholics who get an extra allowance to feed their habits.
Maybe we should look at those who take NHS treatment without paying for it....or those who pay nothing in. But use the services.
This topic has been given some coverage in the benefits thread.
Getting smokers to quit is not an easy task, this is just another tool in the arsenal that may prove more effective in limiting long term health problems caused by smoking.

Accyexplorer 20-08-2015 06:42
re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
I predict 10-20yrs down the line folk will be getting the same illnesses from these electric devices as they do with tobacco.
Personally,I'm happy paying £5-£8 a week to kill myself so I won't be taking the NHS up on their offer.
The best way to quit is "cold turkey" as Margaret mentioned in the benefits thread.

JCB 20-08-2015 07:28
re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
I gave up smoking fags nearly 3 years ago , after smoking for 50 years .

The main reason I stopped was the cost , but subconsciously there may have been a fear of damage to my health .

I have saved thousands of pounds .

I went onto e-cigs , and I haven't missed a fag one little bit . In fact I prefer my e-cigs to fags .

As for NHS funding for those who want to replace fags for e-cigs......Well , if there are some who genuinely can't afford the initial outlay in transferring to e-cigs , I have no problem with the NHS helping them .

When I first heard of this report I was a bit miffed.....thinking that if they can afford to buy fags they can afford to buy e-cigs . But on reflection I can see that there are some who would have problems buying the starter kit . There are some really poor people among us , and unfortunately they may need help . We don't live in an ideal world .

DtheP47 20-08-2015 08:38
re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowlf (Post 1148283)
It is apparently being suggested that E cigarettes should be given on the NHS. I for one am appalled . At a time when we are told money is tight the very thought of funding something like this when children are having drugs denied them is for me a step too far.
At around £8.00 a packet yearly costs to smoke for a 20 a day habit heads somewhere up to £3000 a year.
That figure should be reflected in the e-cig prescription charges.

Neil 20-08-2015 09:20
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
The Welsh are proposing to ban the use of E-Cigs in public places because they think it normalises smoking and will encourage others to start

cashman 20-08-2015 09:59
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by JCB (Post 1148291)
I gave up smoking fags nearly 3 years ago , after smoking for 50 years .

The main reason I stopped was the cost , but subconsciously there may have been a fear of damage to my health .

I have saved thousands of pounds .
.
Exactly the same, i stopped 3 yrs ago this month after oer 50 yrs smoking, and for the same reason, but i cannot agree wi providing on the NHS, if yer daft enough to start smoking.

Michael1954 20-08-2015 10:51
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
I use nicotine chewing gum. I pay for them myself, not on the NHS. At the rate I previously smoked (40 a day), the gum costs a lot less than what I was spending on cigarettes.

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 11:17
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148289)
I predict 10-20yrs down the line folk will be getting the same illnesses from these electric devices as they do with tobacco.
Personally,I'm happy paying £5-£8 a week to kill myself so I won't be taking the NHS up on their offer.
The best way to quit is "cold turkey" as Margaret mentioned in the benefits thread.
I won't put money on your prediction. The damaging stuff in cigs is not the nicotine (nicotine is relatively innocuous...and the receptors in the brain disappear after five days of not using nicotine)......it is the chemicals that do the damage.
If E cigs are going to be prescribed then they will have to meet rigorous quality and safety checks, which at present, they are not subject to.
My understanding of how these work is that they deliver a small amount of nicotine(which can be progressively reduced until you get down to zero) in steam....steam is water vapour......I use steam to clear my chest when I have a bad chest...so am I going to be at risk of the same diseases smokers get Jason.....I sincerely hope not as I have never smoked in my life(though I have been subjected to second hand smoke during my life).

I think one of the main reasons why smokers find these devices better in helping them quit is that it maintains the 'hand to mouth' action that many smokers miss when they give up coffin nails.

Having seen first hand the damage that smoking does I am in favour of whatever method is most effective in getting people to stop...and if this needs the intervention of health professionals then so be it.

If I wanted to save money on prescriptions I would go about it in a whole different way...but that is another matter entirely.

Gordon Booth 20-08-2015 12:12
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148289)
.
Personally,I'm happy paying £5-£8 a week to kill myself so I won't be taking the NHS up on their offer.
The best way to quit is "cold turkey" as Margaret mentioned in the benefits thread.
£5-£8 a week? You're not a smoker! Get on the £8 a day and you'll qualify, until it gets you.

Cold turkey is OK for a lucky few, not many manage it.
I've tried everything, patches, gum(revolting), acupuncture, hypnotism, and yes cold turkey.
The nearest I've got is ecigs, not done it yet but I'm getting there. I can go out without cigarettes now, just an e cig. Not quite broken it at home but I will.

It's not just the nicotine(I read it's more addictive than heroin?), it's the habit as well. You're stressed or just want a break, go through the routine of getting out the packet, take a ciggy, get out lighter, light up and before you even inhale you're into that break. (Smoking a pipe was even better, it would be five minutes of messing about before you could even light it).
An e cig comes close to that habit and tops up the nicotine. Also you can make the changeover at your own pace.We weak creatures need all the help we can get!

I don't think they should need to be on the NHS, if you can afford £8 a day(or more!) you can afford £30 or even less for a good e cig which will last forever plus £3 a week for the liquid.
But- patches £14 a week, gum £18 for 240, other methods similar. E cigs on the NHS would cost less, if some folk need that extra incentive to give up why not?

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 12:36
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
nicotine is addictive, but is relatively innocuous....and as I said in my previous post...the receptors on the cells in the brain disappear after five days without any nicotine......but the hand to mouth habit(as you have so rightly observed) is a much harder habit to break...and this is where the e-cig has it over the patches and chewing gum....you still have the hand to mouth action....and although I have never tried an e-cig...they tell me they are much more palatable than the chewing gum.
I have been told that this gum is revolting even though it is supposed to be mint flavoured.

Michael1954 20-08-2015 13:45
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Nicorettes aren't so tasty, but Nicotinell and Tesco's home brand are fine. It's just a matter of getting used to them and much safer than the dreaded weed. Trouble is I'm now addicted to gum!

accyman 20-08-2015 13:53
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowlf (Post 1148283)
It is apparently being suggested that E cigarettes should be given on the NHS. I for one am appalled . At a time when we are told money is tight the very thought of funding something like this when children are having drugs denied them is for me a step too far.
yeah and its disgusting they give people chemo therapy as well aint it ,thats pretty expensive as well

lets take crutches away from people too that aluminum aint cheap

id rather have the nhs pay for a e-cig than pay for the treatment and cure of cancers and other smoking related illness

Michael1954 20-08-2015 14:08
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Despite that, I'll stick to paying for my gum, rather than getting it free from the NHS. I can afford it, but I can appreciate it that some might not.

Accyexplorer 20-08-2015 14:22
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
I don't smoke tobacco anymore since I started on my Ecig,I spend £5-£8 a week on Eliquid,coils etc.
I won't use gum or patches as I've heard folk can suffer nightmares and other adverse effects from them.
Inhaling any foreign substance isn't good for you,steam seems perfectly ok so you'll be fine M,but will zero nicotine Eliquid just be water like from the tap?...I doubt it.
I don't think they use water to create the vapour but I may be wrong.

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 14:51
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Jason, I have been inhaling steam at the first sign of a cold for many years....Sometimes it heads the cold off at the pass(the steam is supposed to limit the growth of the virus in the throat and the naso-pharynx) sometimes it doesn't......but I still do it.
Yes, there are chemicals in the e-cigs, but I thought that the resultant product of the heating of these was water vapour, but I am very happy to be corrected and educated if this is not so.
I still think that ultimately they will be safer than the chemicals in conventional cigarettes.....and that any efforts to reduce dependence on tobacco are to be applauded.
My father died a horrible death from lung cancer......and his last days stay with me in my memory....yes he was a smoker. He was given cigarettes as he embarked to fight in France in WWII....prior to that he had not smoked.

Eric 20-08-2015 15:39
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
As the greater drain on NHS resources now seems to obesity and its buddy diabetes, it would be cheaper, and more politically correct, to hand out carrots and/or other healthy veggies.

I still smoke ... doesn't cost all that much for me as I live a short drive from Tyendinaga Mohawk Territory.:alright:

accyman 20-08-2015 16:19
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148320)
I won't use gum or patches as I've heard folk can suffer nightmares and other adverse effects from them.
when i was on the full strength nicorette patches i woke up convinced in my head that i was married and spent 20 mins looking for my wedding ring lol

thats one nightmare i will never forget :D

as for e-cigs theres plenty of scaremongering out there based on zero facts mostly by the hard core nazi anti smokers lot that think anything that looks like smoking will kill you and your children.After e-cigs they will be calling for a ban on breathing out in winter time as that too can look like and encourage children to smoke..

what these morons dont quite grasp is that the two main ingredients they object to in e-liquid are found in most food products they eat but hey whats a few facts when you have a pocket full of un proven statements to look at on google from fellow morons to throw at people you simply want to do everything your way

Accyexplorer 20-08-2015 16:31
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington (Post 1148321)
Jason, I have been inhaling steam at the first sign of a cold for many years....Sometimes it heads the cold off at the pass(the steam is supposed to limit the growth of the virus in the throat and the naso-pharynx) sometimes it doesn't......but I still do it.
Yes, there are chemicals in the e-cigs, but I thought that the resultant product of the heating of these was water vapour, but I am very happy to be corrected and educated if this is not so.
I still think that ultimately they will be safer than the chemicals in conventional cigarettes.....and that any efforts to reduce dependence on tobacco are to be applauded.
My father died a horrible death from lung cancer......and his last days stay with me in my memory....yes he was a smoker. He was given cigarettes as he embarked to fight in France in WWII....prior to that he had not smoked.
We're already on page two,not bad for a "non starter" ;)

"The main ingredients found in the e-cigarette liquids are glycerin and glycol ethers, which are used as the liquid carrier into which all of the nicotine, flavorings and preservatives easily dissolve, Thornburg said. Those substances are not considered harmful."

Personally,I don't believe Thornburg or the public health minister if they say these chemicals are safe to be inhaled. :D

There is a little more info on Eliquids in the link below:-

E-Liquid Facts - VapeHit

Accyexplorer 20-08-2015 16:54
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Lord knows how many folk have to turned to e cigs without the help of the taxpayer, so imo ,there's no need for them to be made available on script.
The fact the NHS can't afford much needed care but can afford to provide folk with ecigs is pure madness and I can only hope that they are taking money away from the methadone prescriptions to balance the numbers :D

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 17:26
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
one of the components of the e-cig is polyethylene glycol.
This is currently being added to beta interferon injections used in Relapsing/remitting MS.
It has been proved to have a beneficial effect in making the actions of the beta interferon last longer in the bodies of those patients who are being prescribed it...meaning that weekly injections can now be given fortnightly and there is a study being done that suggests that the addition of this substance will eventually allow for the injections to be given on a monthly basis........so if it can be used for enhancing the effect of a very expensive kind of medication, then it is a good bet that inhaling this will be far less harmful than the inhaling of tobacco smoke

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 17:36
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Eric (Post 1148326)
As the greater drain on NHS resources now seems to obesity and its buddy diabetes, it would be cheaper, and more politically correct, to hand out carrots and/or other healthy veggies.

I still smoke ... doesn't cost all that much for me as I live a short drive from Tyendinaga Mohawk Territory.:alright:
The obesity crisis and the rise in the number of cases of diabetes should be laid firmly at the doors of the scientists, who some four decades ago(it may even be more than that) persuaded us to believe that dairy products...butter. cream, eggs cheese was bad for us...and that we would all be healthier if we gave them up in favour of healthier products.
Now we are being told that had we not followed their advice we would have fewer diabetics, and the population would be slimmer and healthier.

My mother is a type 2 diabetic.....her diabetes was brought on by a seeing her little pet dog mauled by a large alsatian.
She is not obese(could be considered a little overweight since she has shrunk in height) but her weight has remained the same for more than 30 years.

Eric 20-08-2015 17:44
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington (Post 1148334)
The obesity crisis and the rise in the number of cases of diabetes should be laid firmly at the doors of the scientists, who some four decades ago(it may even be more than that) persuaded us to believe that dairy products...butter. cream, eggs cheese was bad for us...and that we would all be healthier if we gave them up in favour of healthier products.
Now we are being told that had we not followed their advice we would have fewer diabetics, and the population would be slimmer and healthier.

My mother is a type 2 diabetic.....her diabetes was brought on by a seeing her little pet dog mauled by a large alsatian.
She is not obese(could be considered a little overweight since she has shrunk in height) but her weight has remained the same for more than 30 years.
Mmmm ... I wasn't being serious you know.;)

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 17:47
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
No...I know you weren't......for goodness sake if the poor coeliacs cause such a fuss about them getting gluten free stuff...can you imagine if obese people were prescribed carrots, lettuce and cucumber?

Accyexplorer 20-08-2015 18:13
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington (Post 1148333)
one of the components of the e-cig is polyethylene glycol.
This is currently being added to beta interferon injections used in Relapsing/remitting MS.
It has been proved to have a beneficial effect in making the actions of the beta interferon last longer in the bodies of those patients who are being prescribed it...meaning that weekly injections can now be given fortnightly and there is a study being done that suggests that the addition of this substance will eventually allow for the injections to be given on a monthly basis........so if it can be used for enhancing the effect of a very expensive kind of medication, then it is a good bet that inhaling this will be far less harmful than the inhaling of tobacco smoke
With you being a nurse, I'll take your word for it ;)

Accyexplorer 20-08-2015 18:15
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington (Post 1148337)
No...I know you weren't......for goodness sake if the poor coeliacs cause such a fuss about them getting gluten free stuff...can you imagine if obese people were prescribed carrots, lettuce and cucumber?
Please don't give the NHS anymore ideas M ;)

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 18:52
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148338)
With you being a nurse, I'll take your word for it ;)
I'm a retired nurse...but still take an interest in all things medical.
You could look it up
http://multiplesclerosis.net/researc...feron-beta-1a/

Rowlf 20-08-2015 19:56
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
My point really was that NHS money could be better spent for conditions that are not self inflicted.

cashman 20-08-2015 20:00
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowlf (Post 1148347)
My point really was that NHS money could be better spent for conditions that are not self inflicted.
Agree entirely, the info is out there now on the dangers, so as far as i'm concerned anyone who starts smoking these days is asking fer what they get simple as.

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 20:06
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowlf (Post 1148347)
My point really was that NHS money could be better spent for conditions that are not self inflicted.
So you would include drug addicts, alcoholics, fat people....where would you draw the line? Would you include those who are HIV positive because of their life style?
My point is that anything that is effective in helping smokers to kick the habit may actually save money and lives.....and that has to be good.

Gordon Booth 20-08-2015 20:08
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowlf (Post 1148347)
My point really was that NHS money could be better spent for conditions that are not self inflicted.
So no NHS for smokers, overweight people, diabetics, bulimia sufferers,drinkers, drug takers, people who climb mountains and fall off, careless drivers who have an accident, children who didn't look both ways before they stepped into the road etc, etc.

Well yes, that would save money but haven't most of them contributed to the NHS? Without their contribution would there be an NHS for you?
And are you sure you'll never need NHS help for a condition you inflicted on yourself? You've never carelessly cut yourself, tripped up by not looking where you're walking? And never will?

Rowlf 20-08-2015 20:47
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Accidents are accidents they are not the same at all.

Margaret Pilkington 20-08-2015 20:49
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
No....accidents are usually caused by someone taking risks...not considering the dangers or simply being careless......and therefore self inflicted...the only true accidents are where someone else has caused the problem by their carelessness...and you have got injured.

Gordon Booth 20-08-2015 20:51
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rowlf (Post 1148354)
Accidents are accidents they are not the same at all.
So we'll cover the children, maybe even the careless drivers. The rest of them- tough?

Rowlf 20-08-2015 21:27
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
If the NHS money was a bottomless pot it would be a different tale but for me when I read of children,some with life threatening illnesses, being denied treatment because there is not enough funding and then the idea of the E cigarettes is mentioned it does not seem right.

Accyexplorer 21-08-2015 07:57
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Even if I could get a £50+ machine with variable voltage,large tank and flashing lights,I do not want a Dr telling me what strength of liquid or flavour I can have.
However,I've developed a predicted addiction to cannabis,fine whiskey and luxury food,I admit that I'm a junkie when it comes to these things,and I look forward to when I can get my fix for as little as £8.....and then I'll happily be dictated too from Dr's :D

Guinness 21-08-2015 20:39
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148289)
I predict 10-20yrs down the line folk will be getting the same illnesses from these electric devices as they do with tobacco.
So first of all you predict mouth, lung, throat, bladder and kidney cancer, emphysema and chronic breathing/bronchitis problems for e-cig users…..with zero evidence or fact.:rolleyes:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148289)
The best way to quit is "cold turkey" as Margaret mentioned in the benefits thread.
Then you make a statement about ‘cold turkey’ which a) you have no experience of and b) the facts and figures do not back up (and another rollseyes) :rolleyes:


Me, started over 40 years ago at 13 because of peer pressure… tried cutting down, said I’d give up when they got to a £1 a packet/£2 a packet etc.. done the cold turkey a few times in the past and once lasted 2 years before I regressed….problem is that once you’ve had a fag and become an addict…that taste and feeling NEVER goes away and you are always one moment of weakness away from lighting up again.

I’m currently on my third year fag free because of a post on this forum about e cigs from Flashy (btw thanks xx)

Normally I smell smoke and I feel like retching.. but just occasionally it smells oh so sweet (especially when I’m on the beer)….but I got my plastic fag to stuff in my mouth and that feeling goes away.

I have one of these ‘grown up dummys’ in my gob more often than I used to have an actual fag…but I can’t remember the last time I coughed other than to clear my throat, my breathing and taste are better, when I exercise my heart and pulse rate are normal for my age and I’ve just passed my annual health MOT with flying colours.

They work, just like antibiotics, antipsychotics and antihistamines….so why shouldn’t they be classed as a medication and therefore prescribed?

Margaret Pilkington 21-08-2015 21:01
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
My husband gave up the fags using cold turkey, but he will freely admit that it was the hardest thing he has ever done.....And you are right, it fails far more often than it succeeds.
Well done for giving up the ciggies....and however you did it, it is still an achievement.

I do not subscribe to the idea that using e.cigs might encourage people to convert to the coffin nails.....or that using them normalises smoking cigarettes.
I am all for any method which increases the chance of a smoker to kick the tobacco habit.

Accyexplorer 21-08-2015 22:38
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guinness (Post 1148401)
So first of all you predict mouth, lung, throat, bladder and kidney cancer, emphysema and chronic breathing/bronchitis problems for e-cig users…..with zero evidence or fact.:rolleyes:

Then you make a statement about ‘cold turkey’ which a) you have no experience of and b) the facts and figures do not back up (and another rollseyes) :rolleyes:


Me, started over 40 years ago at 13 because of peer pressure… tried cutting down, said I’d give up when they got to a £1 a packet/£2 a packet etc.. done the cold turkey a few times in the past and once lasted 2 years before I regressed….problem is that once you’ve had a fag and become an addict…that taste and feeling NEVER goes away and you are always one moment of weakness away from lighting up again.

I’m currently on my third year fag free because of a post on this forum about e cigs from Flashy (btw thanks xx)

Normally I smell smoke and I feel like retching.. but just occasionally it smells oh so sweet (especially when I’m on the beer)….but I got my plastic fag to stuff in my mouth and that feeling goes away.

I have one of these ‘grown up dummys’ in my gob more often than I used to have an actual fag…but I can’t remember the last time I coughed other than to clear my throat, my breathing and taste are better, when I exercise my heart and pulse rate are normal for my age and I’ve just passed my annual health MOT with flying colours.

They work, just like antibiotics, antipsychotics and antihistamines….so why shouldn’t they be classed as a medication and therefore prescribed?


Firstly,congratulations on kicking your habit ('not illness').
Now,I personally don't see how being a smoker should be classed as being medically ill so I fail to see why these Ecigs should be deemed as (tax funded) medicine.They are simply a way that a nicotine addict can get a slightly healthier fix iny eyes.

To my awareness,No real long term studies have been conducted on these different types of devices/liquids so any claims and figures are nothing more than educated guess work.
I may be wrong but,I think it's more about generating lost revenue and controlling the market than caring for folk.

On a aside, I've just read the packet my Eliquid came in and its says "if swallowed call the poison centre" that's not really advice you'd expect to see on a harmless,non toxic product is it?

Personally,I don't trust the medical industry anymore than I trust the guy in the local pub with his bag full of dodgey tobacco....

...If you find any of the above incoherent please tell me which bits your struggling to comprehend and I'll try simplify it for you (rolleyes x2) ;) :p :D

Guinness 22-08-2015 08:30
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148412)
Firstly,congratulations on kicking your habit ('not illness').
Now,I personally don't see how being a smoker should be classed as being medically ill so I fail to see why these Ecigs should be deemed as (tax funded) medicine.They are simply a way that a nicotine addict can get a slightly healthier fix iny eyes.

To my awareness,No real long term studies have been conducted on these different types of devices/liquids so any claims and figures are nothing more than educated guess work.
I may be wrong but,I think it's more about generating lost revenue and controlling the market than caring for folk.

On a aside, I've just read the packet my Eliquid came in and its says "if swallowed call the poison centre" that's not really advice you'd expect to see on a harmless,non toxic product is it?

Personally,I don't trust the medical industry anymore than I trust the guy in the local pub with his bag full of dodgey tobacco....

...If you find any of the above incoherent please tell me which bits your struggling to comprehend and I'll try simplify it for you (rolleyes x2) ;) :p :D
Actually most of it is incoherent…(it usually is when you manage to refrain from copy/pasting someone elses work and try to pass it off as your own)

It’s incoherent because:-

a) It’s not a habit, it’s an addiction
b) Other smoking substitutes are already given on prescription, and earlier posts have alluded to the cost effectiveness of these
c) My liquid says ‘seek medical advice if swallowed’ probably because we don’t really have walk in poison centres in this country…I’d suggest you stop buying dodgy Chinese liquid from that guy in the pub, it’s clearly addling your thought processes
d) Your argument about not being ‘medically ill’ fails because not all tax funded prescription treatments are given because of illness (the guy who needs pain killers for a sports injury….or antibiotics for someone who gets an infection from a rusty nail whilst mooching around a dilapidated building)

’As an aside’…the eye drops I use for my occasional dry eye also says seek medical advice if swallowed, and every single medication from Anadin to Zantac has side effects and toxicity.

Because of your mistrust of the medical industry can I assume that you do not use doctors, hospitals, have eye tests or visit the dentist? If, however, you do use these, should I then assume that you mistrust the advice you receive and ignore it.

Accyexplorer 22-08-2015 09:06
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Does anyone know if:-
A: Ecigs are excluded from the smoking in cars with kids ban?
B: Can you smoke Ecigs on public transport?

accyman 22-08-2015 12:04
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148439)
Does anyone know if:-
A: Ecigs are excluded from the smoking in cars with kids ban?
B: Can you smoke Ecigs on public transport?
yes you can vape on public transport but common decency would suggest that you wouldnt or if the bus company puts up no vaping signs and makes a request for them not to be used as it is their bus and their rules while on them

you can vape in pubs

you can vape on hospital grounds but not inside hospitals but thats not law thats a request or condition set out by the hospital.You wont get fined but will be asked to stop it or leave

you can vape in your car

because it isnt smoking and the law is a no smoking law

theres something gong on in the EU about e-cigs but its not really about health issues its trying to find a way to tax the hell out of it like they do fags instead of the standard VAT which is a lot less than the tax and vat on fags

jack straw is or at least was working with a local company to stop the EU classing them as a tobbacco product or something

lets put it in terms anti smokers will understand - if roy castle had been breathing in e-cig vapour through his trumpet he would most likely still be alive or certainly not dead from cancer

Margaret Pilkington 22-08-2015 16:20
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Guinness (Post 1148432)
Actually most of it is incoherent…(it usually is when you manage to refrain from copy/pasting someone elses work and try to pass it off as your own)

It’s incoherent because:-

a) It’s not a habit, it’s an addiction
b) Other smoking substitutes are already given on prescription, and earlier posts have alluded to the cost effectiveness of these
c) My liquid says ‘seek medical advice if swallowed’ probably because we don’t really have walk in poison centres in this country…I’d suggest you stop buying dodgy Chinese liquid from that guy in the pub, it’s clearly addling your thought processes
d) Your argument about not being ‘medically ill’ fails because not all tax funded prescription treatments are given because of illness (the guy who needs pain killers for a sports injury….or antibiotics for someone who gets an infection from a rusty nail whilst mooching around a dilapidated building)

’As an aside’…the eye drops I use for my occasional dry eye also says seek medical advice if swallowed, and every single medication from Anadin to Zantac has side effects and toxicity.

Because of your mistrust of the medical industry can I assume that you do not use doctors, hospitals, have eye tests or visit the dentist? If, however, you do use these, should I then assume that you mistrust the advice you receive and ignore it.
I also have a 'healthy' mistrust of the medical profession. This is because I know that those in the medical profession do NOT know everything and they can be wrong. It is up to me and no one else to make sure I put my health first....after all who else could be trusted with something so very precious.
I will research the background of drugs if I am prescribed them, though so far I have not needed to take anything other than antibiotics.
I do not take things on face value.....I seek out as much information as possible, information is armour.

cashman 22-08-2015 16:32
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Accyexplorer (Post 1148439)
Does anyone know if:-
A: Ecigs are excluded from the smoking in cars with kids ban?
B: Can you smoke Ecigs on public transport?
Yeh cant smoke em in some pubs fact, Greyhound fer one.

accyman 22-08-2015 17:43
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 1148486)
Yeh cant smoke em in some pubs fact, Greyhound fer one.

i suppose its landlords descression but it isnt backed up by law

if a landlord says i cant i move to the next pub that says i can but havnt had the problem yet :)

Accyexplorer 22-08-2015 22:21
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashman (Post 1148486)
Yeh cant smoke em in some pubs fact, Greyhound fer one.
I'm glad i don't frequent that watering hole then ;)

Accyexplorer 23-08-2015 08:48
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
I wonder what chemicals (if any) get mixed with the vapour when the coils start burning out on Ecigs?
I know my chest can get tight and my breathing can also become a little wheezy if I don't change it regular.
One thing is for sure,overall,it's not only myself that feels healthier for changing to Ecigs my bank balance is slightly healthier too and that seems to be reflected in most folk.

accyman 23-08-2015 11:47
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
depending on what coil/burner you use you can open them up and clean them gently with one of them small brushes you use to clean between your teeth.I build my own burners its a good idea to buy a tank that takes a burner thats easy to rebuild.You can also boil them in a pan which will clean them or soak in vodka..

hey presto you have a like new coil and get a bit longer out of it

ps:

the wire in the coil dosnt usually burn out its the build up of syrup that coats the coil and prevents it working.If you have a clear tank you will notice your liquid discolours as well.Not the wire thats yuor problem its burning gunk either change or clean your burner

oh soaking them in full fat regular coke a cola cleans them as well

rinse then allow to dry out


i left some in my pocket and DAZ does a good job too but leaves an after taste

Accyexplorer 23-08-2015 12:12
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
Cheers for that accyman,I've a box of used atomisers so I'll give boiling water a try.
Do the wicks burn out in them? there is defiantly something that tastes like burning after a few days or so of use leading to me having chest/breathing problems.
I'm going to have to invest in one of them fancy £50+ jobs with a digital display and variable voltage as this cheapo (£20) version tastes like muck after a day or two.

accyman 23-08-2015 12:34
Re: E Cigarettes on NHS ?
 
you will have the same problem its gunk building up thats teh problem not the wire or wick

the wick/string lasts a long time it only really damages if burnt dry

them £50 jobs are ok but overkill and you will find the burners are more expensive.You will also get used to the stronger vape so when your big battery runs out of power you cant feel a thing when you use your backup vapestick

i got mine for 15 quid at the jews market salford theres no way i will pay 50 quid upwards fro a cheap import from china which is what all brands are with different lables and prices

all the same junk from the same place you have to be wrong in the head to pay 90 quid upwards for a e-cig just because it looks bulky they all operate on the same sort of burners/coils theres nothing different about them its the battery that makes the difference and the hotter you burn the faster they stop working

just keep your coils clean , google your coil and watch videos on how to rebuild or clean them


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