Interesting devlopments over in Russia

entwisi · 17-07-2007, 14:04

Alltunes.com claims win in Russian copyright case | The Register

So now where does this sit legally. I seem to be accused of wingeing when people copy music etc, Lets hear your opinions on this?

flashy · 17-07-2007, 14:07

entwisi, EVERYONE has done at least 1 illegal thing in there life, i dont care who they are, whether it be stealing sweets or pinching something off someone, and those who say they havent tell lies, yes we know selling copied dvd's etc is illegal, but unfortunately it happens...

entwisi · 17-07-2007, 14:12

So whats your opinion on what I posted then? legal or not?

WillowTheWhisp · 17-07-2007, 19:43

OK, admitting to being a bit of a numpty here. Is this Alltunes a website where people have been paying to download music from?

entwisi · 17-07-2007, 20:36

its sort of a Russian iTunes only songs are ~£0.12 rather than $0.99 only the royalties they pay are Russian 'performance royalties.. The big labels do not recognise the agency that is collecting them (ROMS) and are therefore claiming its illegal. So you are paying royalties just to an agency teh labels rufuse to collect from as it would endorse them and upset iTunes Amazon etc

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davo69 · 17-07-2007, 20:42

so how many of us go out for a night in a pub and listen to a singer playing youe favourate tunes .and how many of these artist pay royalties and how many of these pubs are paying prs ?.question do you get up and leave ? some sell cds how many people have bought one ?i think there are alot of people out there with double standers !!!!!

Zero · 17-07-2007, 20:49

Obviously Alltunes is taking advantage of a legal loophole, it doesn`t actually describe their misdemeanour, but I presume they`re charging for something they have no rights to. That is Illegal in answer to your question, BUT as visa the people raising the objection are not the people who own the intellectual copyright then Alltunes are (currently) getting away with it. if the PRS/Mpcs or anyone owning rights takes up the case I think it may be a different story, I`m not sure .....That`s why Lawyers get paid so much eh ?

Zero · 17-07-2007, 20:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by davo69

i think there are alot of people out there with double standers !!!!!

Is that 2 legs ?

Sorry

davo69 · 17-07-2007, 20:57

lol three for some

entwisi · 17-07-2007, 21:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zero

Obviously Alltunes is taking advantage of a legal loophole, it doesn`t actually describe their misdemeanour, but I presume they`re charging for something they have no rights to. That is Illegal in answer to your question, BUT as visa the people raising the objection are not the people who own the intellectual copyright then Alltunes are (currently) getting away with it. if the PRS/Mpcs or anyone owning rights takes up the case I think it may be a different story, I`m not sure .....That`s why Lawyers get paid so much eh ?

What Alltunes are doing is effectively charging you the 'performance' rate that say a pub would pay PRS. They claim and technically its correct that they deliver teh byte stream to you once. If you choose to record that stream and reuse it it is just like you taped off teh radio. The difference is of course that in digital music there is no degredation. They are not breaking the law in 'performing music' as long as they p[ay the relevant fee to ROMS which they do.

You have to also consider that their whole business is sited in Russia and yet teh Americans are trying to sue them outside Russia. The case that I linke to is that a Russian judge has decreed that it is only the copyright owners who can take them to court or withold services that they were contracted to do. As such I believe no record label has actually tried taking them to court they just put pressure on Visa etc to cut off their main source of revenue.

The underlying priciple here is a trading model that undercuts what western suppliers could hope to get away with and that irks them.

I'd really like to hear Lindsay's view on this. After all fundermentally its just like iTunes and Amazon selling music as opposed to outright theft.

Zero · 17-07-2007, 21:52

Ah that makes the picture a whole lot clearer and I would probably agree that it`s the fact that they are undercutting established sources that has caused the kerfuffle. They seem to be paying their way and as you say its pay per play not for keeps so its the client who performs the criminal act by making a recording. Pretty much like I`m downloading some Dr Who torrents now I`ll watch once and delete what`s the difference between that and me borrowing a video of the episode that you had taped off the Telly ?
Like I said it all makes a lot of money for lawyers and confusion for everyone else.

I originally thought this post was going to be about extraditing British diplomats. I can fully understand why Putin wants to restart the cold war than have dealings with countries governed by political correctness but I guess I`ll have to find another thread.

WillowTheWhisp · 17-07-2007, 22:00

I record stuff off telly to watch later - that's the whole reason for having a recorder isn't it so's not to miss things when you're out? I've downloaded stuff too to have a listen to people I would otherwise never have heard of who don't get played on the radio. It kinda makes up for the old days when you could go into Mary's and pick up an album and have a listen to it in the little booths.