Accrington Pals project - Page 3

garinda · 17-04-2006, 22:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bazf

Thats not what the project is about, it going to tell us how the town changed for women, you already know this, how is that going to enlighten someone unless your going to get an anti war agenda which I don't think the pc brigade in Accy would even dare to surgest.

I should imagine the background as to why nearly a whole batalion of men were wiped out in a few hours, might be mentioned in passing.

Driller · 17-04-2006, 23:08

I'm not convinced this "project" should cost anything .. money for what?.. the research will likley be done on the web or from books.. so how much funding do you need?

SPUGGIE J · 18-04-2006, 08:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

I should imagine the background as to why nearly a whole batalion of men were wiped out in a few hours, might be mentioned in passing.

The Generals of the day Haig Gough Plummer etc thought that if you bludgened the enemy hard enough you could beat him. The Western Front was a war of attrition which was a bit daft as the American Civil war showed the men attacking a fixed defensive line always came of worse. Chuck in the fact that the shelling turned the place into a muddy moonscape did not help. A certain party just wanted the tommies to open a gap for the cavelry and even in later battles did exactly the same. The young men of Britain were cannon fodder literaly. The country lost a generation and those that survived were in many cases crippled and proberly could not earn a shilling for there families. I for one only have a vague idea about how the women coped with those who came back and those that didnt. In a time when it would have been hard enough on families how did they cope? There would have been no welfare state or pensions as such so it must have been horrendous. Today we live in a society that looks after the unfortunate with free health care social security payments etc but what of those poor families? I think it will be very educational as we have it so damned easy today.

Bazf · 18-04-2006, 12:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

I should imagine the background as to why nearly a whole batalion of men were wiped out in a few hours, might be mentioned in passing.

So on the back of that we have a project funded, which would mostly be a look at the way world events changed the women of the town's lives forever.
How about the effect about the men who didn't go or the import of labour or Despite the mainstream Labour Party's support for the Coalition, they were instrumental in opposing mobilisation through organisations such as the Non Conscription Fellowship based in Accrington and surrounding areas.

garinda · 18-04-2006, 13:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bazf

So on the back of that we have a project funded, which would mostly be a look at the way world events changed the women of the town's lives forever.
How about the effect about the men who didn't go or the import of labour or Despite the mainstream Labour Party's support for the Coalition, they were instrumental in opposing mobilisation through organisations such as the Non Conscription Fellowship based in Accrington and surrounding areas.

I presume Gayle is applying for the funding from the woman's perspective, but I think all aspects of the tradgedy will be covered. Personally I think that's quite a novel way of getting funds that wouldn't be otherwise available.

I don't really see your gripe, it's not costing us anything indirectly. Plus it will be great to hear the play on the radio, which incidentally doesn't focus on the feamale perspective, and people that get to hear it might learn something important about out town's history.

Bazf · 18-04-2006, 14:48

Sorry G just needed a discussion that didn't include the fluff thats been on recently.

Gayle · 18-04-2006, 15:13

Don't know whether you're apologising to me or Garinda but either way your views are important.

Bazf · 18-04-2006, 15:16

Actualy Garinda, what have I done to upset you?

Gayle · 18-04-2006, 15:19

Nothing, it was just my thread that started it! That's why I was questioning it!

garinda · 18-04-2006, 22:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bazf

Sorry G just needed a discussion that didn't include the fluff thats been on recently.

No matey, I'm not upset at all. In fact I'm relishing the debate we've had, because it's been a bit sluggish on here lately, so thanks.

Tealeaf · 19-04-2006, 16:37

There is a slight problem here. If you are thinking of putting togeather a travelling exhibit of the Pals, then you are mainly concerned with the events leading up to and then occuring on 1st July 1916 in France. However, if you are talking about the wider socio-economic impact of WW1 on the town then you have to take into account the following relative number:-
Despite the carnage sustained on the morning of that fateful day, the dead (& missing) of that battle represent only about 1 in 10 of the total losses sustained by the men who joined up from Accy and the area. ( Andrew Jackson can possibly give a more accurate figure). All the rest - several thousand - were killed while serving with other East Lancs battalions, other infantry regiments - such as the Lancashire Fusiliers - others corps, and other services. They lie dead not only on the Somme, but in the mud of Ypres and Passendale, the beaches of Gallipoli and in the desert of Iraq.

Busman747 · 19-04-2006, 17:24

As Gayle may possibly be aware of, I am against the use of finances dished out by quango's in a way that takes their fancy - HOWEVER! I feel that we are short of information here and if Gayle knows the answers?

1) If a grant is received, will it pay in part for someones wages?

2) What figure are we talking about, £hundreds or £thousands?

3) Who ARE The Hyndburn Womens Forum? (Another of my pet hates is predudice against men like "Womens Institute," "Shelter for Battered Wives" (I witnessed the wounds today of a man that was hit repeatedly by his "partner" who also trashed their car and refused to report it, the idiot is returning to the house tonight because she phoned to say "sorry!" ) and all the other quango financed institutions that are aimed at women only.

4) How will information be attained? - - - and

5) Lastly, will the information received become public knowledge - in a book? local press? internet?

If the answers to these questions are favourable, then you have my full support Gayle

Doug · 19-04-2006, 17:44

A very good point Mr Tealeaf. My Great Grandfather lost his leg in 1917 while serving with the Kings Liverpool Regiment in France. He was born in Blackburn, but spent all of his Adult/Married life in Accrington, specifically Stanley Street where he lived from the First War until his death in 1955. After losing his leg he joined the 22nd Labour Corp and continued to serve until the wars end.

The impact of the loss of the Pals was a major blow to the Town. However, many others served in other Regiments and other theatres of war, as well as hundreds of men who served underground in our mines or in the foundries producing Iron and Steel for the effort. Many of those men served and died without memorial in the town.

I accept and appalled Gayle efforts to reflect the impact of the First World War on those left behind in Accrington, but I would feel more supportive if it reflected to war in Total and not just the tragic loss suffered by the heroic Pals Regiments of East Lancashire…..