Allotments

[MargaretR]

I have never heard of 'Bootstraps' before so have explored their website.

Welcome to Bootstrap
It may just be me having a foggy day but after reading several of their webpages I do not claim to have learnt much about them.

I do tend to switch off when I see phrases such as
...'walk the extra mile'
...'people empowerment'

The only connection to allotments I saw (on their website) was their 'work' at Meadoway
"Meadoway Allotment is a community based allotment. The Day Service works together with Hyndburn Council and Prospects to maintain the allotment facilities. The site offers a variety of horticultural based sessions. In recent years team members have produced a number of different vegetables, plants and shrubs that are taken home."

Can someone please explain how they have earned £4,378?

[Retlaw]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

I have never heard of 'Bootstraps' before so have explored their website.

Welcome to Bootstrap
It may just be me having a foggy day but after reading several of their webpages I do not claim to have learnt much about them.

I do tend to switch off when I see phrases such as
...'walk the extra mile'
...'people empowerment'

The only connection to allotments I saw (on their website) was their 'work' at Meadoway
"Meadoway Allotment is a community based allotment. The Day Service works together with Hyndburn Council and Prospects to maintain the allotment facilities. The site offers a variety of horticultural based sessions. In recent years team members have produced a number of different vegetables, plants and shrubs that are taken home."

Can someone please explain how they have earned £4,378?

They havent earned it, that figure is what Hyndburn are claiming as their costs.
Retlaw.

[MargaretR]

Originally Posted by Retlaw

They havent earned it, that figure is what Hyndburn are claiming as their costs.
Retlaw.

Those 'costs' must include wages because -

"Bootstrap employs more than a hundred people as well as a team of consultants available for project development work. We employ specialists across a range of disciplines including employment, enterprise, skills, training, disability, social care and skills for life"

'specialists' and 'consultants' don't come cheap.They are shown as a registered charity - so allotment rents are increased for a charitable donation to someone trained to grow veg.

Is this a little surreal

[dusty mears]

this beef should be about HBC. Bootstraps are caught in the cross fire in some respects. I dont know full details as to why they're suddenly paying bootstraps wages bill (as it appears on line) but be assured i will be asking for enth detail as i have already. I am of the opinion that this mess, rises, paying for sheds, compost, skips, portakabin, picnic tables, etc; grand plans which dont actually exist; are the work of HBC officer/s. No one, cllrs included, who i've said this to have attempted to deny or defend my opinion - to me speaks volumes

[MargaretR]

I live adjacent to Heys allotments.
I have seen a lorry load of compost dumped on the car park.

I recall a notice staked next to it to the effect that it was supplied by Parks and Gardens dept - presumably what they have produced and surplus to their needs.

They can't include this as a 'cost' in order to justify rent rises.

[dusty mears]

hi margaret. Dont know about that compost or parks involvement. They do make some compost from proper composting methods so could've donated some. The spend list which i've put into a spreadsheet (cant load as on a mobile) reads as -
Allotment regen, contractor other, compost for keys (typo?), bootstrap enterprises, 15/03/11, £1225.39.
That's some amount of compost !!
If you go on hbc web site, enter the word spend into search, 1st listing brought up is £500 spend. Interesting reading !

[MargaretR]

You would have thought that those highly paid Bootstrap advisors/consultants would be instructing veg growers on how to make their own, which is what allotment holders do.

Dumping it on them when they haven't asked for it, then charging them for it, is rather dubious practice.

I have lived here nine years - seen one such compost load.

(Maybe there has been another that I missed seeing - I used to go on coach trips and could have missed one.)

[MargaretR]

I have looked at "Allotment Regeneration Programme" on the council website here -

Allotment Regeneration Programme - Progress to Date

and can only comment on the work done at Heys
" Waiting list time down to 27 months
Completion of 'big plot' that created 36 allotment plots and a number of raised beds suitable for disabled users
Increase in site plots
Drainage improvements
Upgrade of ginnels and track improvements"

Throughout the last two summers a coach daily delivered a motley crew of 'youths' (some wearing ankle tags) to the Heys site. Their numbers varied between half a dozen and 20.

I was told that they were subdividing some of the large plots at the far reaches of the site into smaller plots. They arrived about 9.30 and left about 3pm -hardly work experience jobs - but by the appearance of them it seemed more like 'compulsory community service'.

I have not ventured that far into the site to view their handiwork but my neighbour advises me that a car park area has been provided adjacent to these constructed plots, which has meant that the car park adjacent to the flats where I live gets used much less now.

I confess to spending a large amount of my time looking out of my window, I have never seen tarmac equipment go up the allotment tracks. I have seen the occasional lorry load of gravel go up there are return empty. The tracks are still hazardous to vehicles. Only last summer a car was towed away from my front door having damaged something vital on its underside(a lot of either petrol or oil leaked onto the road) when coming down the track.

Track maintenance cannot have amounted to much more than filling some of the worst holes with gravel.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

You would have thought that those highly paid Bootstrap advisors/consultants would be instructing veg growers on how to make their own, which is what allotment holders do.

Dumping it on them when they haven't asked for it, then charging them for it, is rather dubious practice.

I have lived here nine years - seen one such compost load.

(Maybe there has been another that I missed seeing - I used to go on coach trips and could have missed one.)

You are making assumptions. How do you know they have not asked for it or have been charged for it?

[Neil]

Originally Posted by dusty mears

If you go on hbc web site, enter the word spend into search, 1st listing brought up is £500 spend. Interesting reading !

I did that for all 2011 and picked out the allotment spends. They total £102,590.29. I am sure it will be more than that if you add all the under £500 spends we don't know about. I have posted them all so as not to be biased against any particular site or contractor.

I would like to point out that the payments appear to be split into 2 category's, Regeneration and General. I am interested to know if the regeneration has been funded by projects using some/all external funding. I was aware of some allotment projects that were seeking funding a while ago.

Sorry it's hard to read, I have attached it as a pdf thats easier to read.


ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER FLOODING TO ALLOTMENTS B000013591/46334 N G DRIVEWAYS & DRAINAGE 17/03/2011 £3510.23
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER FELL TREES AT PEEL PARK ALLOTM B000013632/48203 MR J A WALSH 17/03/2011 £1080
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER SOIL TESTING AT WOODNOOK ALLOT B000013620/49504 L K CONSULT LIMITED 24/03/2011 £1250
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER 3 x 6' x 4' sheds B000013631/32619 TRAVIS PERKINS TRADING CO LTD 29/03/2011 £586.56
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER REPAIRS TO ALLOTMENTS B000013628/8833 BOOTSTRAP 31/03/2011 £1069.95
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER HEYS - 2 X PICNIC TABLES B000013684/20273 PROSPERITY RECYCLING LTD 14/04/2011 £823
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER MATERIALS FOR PEEL PARK ALLOTM B000013685/43728 BOOTSTRAP ENTERPRISES 19/04/2011 £860.56
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER WORK ON MEADOWAY DRAINAGE B000013695/43728 BOOTSTRAP ENTERPRISES 19/04/2011 £1409
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER WOODNOOK MOUND MOVE B000013699/42355 O'CALLAGHAN LTD 19/04/2011 £600
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER Norden - Portable Cabin B000013747/49552 NETWORK CABIN SALES 19/04/2011 £1135
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER SOUTH ACCESS PATH MEADOWAY B000013699/42355 O'CALLAGHAN LTD 21/04/2011 £8555
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER VARIOUS ASBESTOS REMOVALS B000013744/42423 CASTLE MOUNT CONTRACTS LTD 21/04/2011 £999
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS KNOTWOOD ERADICATION- PEEL PAR B000013695/36805 THURLOW COUNTRYSIDE MANAGEMENT LTD 21/04/2011 £3420
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER Heys - Plot 18 materials B000013747/1360 EMPRESS FENCING 28/04/2011 £539.55
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS LAND DRAIN - FLOODING AT WOODN B000013798/2094 J & R MORAN 24/05/2011 £1854
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS FLOODING- HUNCOAT ALLOTMENTS B000013839/28458 MARCHBRIDGE BUILDERS LTD 24/05/2011 £5143.27
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS WORK AT VARIOUS ALLOTMENTS B000013865/43728 BOOTSTRAP ENTERPRISES 21/06/2011 1846
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS KNOTWEED ERADICATION B000013924/36805 THURLOW COUNTRYSIDE MANAGEMENT LTD 30/06/2011 570
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS INFORMATION BOARDS - HEYS B000013924/24708 SIGN IT 07/07/2011 £1300
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS SKIP HIRE- PEEL PARK B000014004/1377 ENVIRO SKIPS LTD 26/07/2011 £2410
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS WHITEASH - PLOT SUB DIVISION B000014006/8833 BOOTSTRAP 26/07/2011 £569.2
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL WATER CHARGES 6.5.11 TO 1.8.11 - LEY B000014064/8325 UNITED UTILITIES WATER 18/08/2011 £604.94
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL WATER CHARGES 23.3.11 TO 10.8.11 - NORDEN B000014129/8325 UNITED UTILITIES WATER 15/09/2011 £1854.11
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION MISCELLANEOUS BREAKDOWN MANHOLE B000014150/46334 N G DRIVEWAYS & DRAINAGE 29/09/2011 £628.55
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS NEW GATES AT MILNSHAW B000014152/20 A BYRNE FENCING 29/09/2011 £836
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL GENERAL REPAIR & MAINT BLDGS 3RD STAGE KNOTWEED SEP 11 B000014155/51355 THURLOW COUNTRYSIDE MANAGEMENT LTD 06/10/2011 £570
ALLOTMENTS-GENERAL WATER CHARGES 17.9.11 TO 10.11.11 - NORDEN A B000014285/8325 UNITED UTILITIES WATER 17/11/2011 £548.51
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION MISCELLANEOUS SUPERVISORS- OCT 11 B000014286/43728 BOOTSTRAP ENTERPRISES 06/12/2011 £4378
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION MISCELLANEOUS 2 SUPERVISORS- SEPT 11 B000014286/43728 BOOTSTRAP ENTERPRISES 06/12/2011 £4378
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION MISCELLANEOUS MANHOLE WORKS- PEEL PARK B000014332/46334 N G DRIVEWAYS & DRAINAGE 06/12/2011 £1720.29
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION MISCELLANEOUS CAR PARKING AREAS AT WOODNOOK B000014315/2094 J & R MORAN 08/12/2011 £7020
ALLOTMENTS REGENERATION CONTRACTOR OTHER PEEL PARK ALLOTMENTS B000014365/46334 N G DRIVEWAYS & DRAINAGE 20/12/2011 £2776.6


Total For 2011 £102590.29

[mobertol]

Originally Posted by Neil

Total For 2011 £102590.29

Interesting read Neil -that's a lot of money, you could buy plenty of veg with that amount. Hope they are all producing plenty! How much money comes in off the rents received?

[MargaretR]

Originally Posted by Neil

You are making assumptions. How do you know they have not asked for it or have been charged for it?

The allotment holder I spoke to at the time hadn't asked for it.

The 'charge' is happening now by way of rent increases (which include compost as justification).

[Neil]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

The allotment holder I spoke to at the time hadn't asked for it.

The 'charge' is happening now by way of rent increases (which include compost as justification).

Where does it state that the Council will supply compost as part of the rent charge?

[Atarah]

LEY ALLOTMENTS, BAXENDEN

Remember there is a meeting TONIGHT (Tues 24th Jan) regarding the ridiculous increase in rents. It's at Bash Conservative Club, Manchester Road (right hand side going up, just past St John's Church). Be there just before 8.00pm if possible.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by mobertol

Interesting read Neil -that's a lot of money, you could buy plenty of veg with that amount. Hope they are all producing plenty! How much money comes in off the rents received?

A lot less than that but is that the issue?

How much do other recreational facilities in the Borough cost?

Does Hyndburn Sports Centre make enough money to fund itself or are Hyndburn Borough Council still giving money to the Leisure Trust?

Are the rent increase in line with increases for other leisure activities in Hyndburn? - That is why the court case I linked the case notes to was lost by the council and won by the allotment holders.