Are manners a thing of the past?

[westendlass]

Your right there Margaret. Respect is the key word. My kids grew up to respect others and all three have a healthy dose of empathy. There was no major shouting or drama in their upbringing and we always showed them the respect they deserved as kids. Obviously, they had their naughty moments but slapping wasn't an option really. My youngest son laughs when he remembers 'the look' that his dad used to shoot at him. No words needed. Haha. I see people out and about on a regular basis screaming and shouting at their kids, venting their rage when the kids are just being kids. And mobiles! don't even get me started on that subject. The kids being dragged along with the parent wrapped up in a conversation on the phone. Why does everyone need to talk to someone when they're out shopping? Unless it's an urgent call I think it's pig ignorant. They want to try reconnecting with the world around them, they might have something decent to talk about then!

[Margaret Pilkington]

There is a vast difference between violence and chastisement.
I grew up in a household where we were warned about our behaviour and told what the consequences of the continuation of that behaviour would be.

Yes we did get a slap from time to time. Did I feel violated, or abused if I got a slap?
No, because I had been told the consequences......all actions have consequences.....and i had brought those consequences on myself.
Children have to know that there are things that are unacceptable, things that they cannot do, there have to be barriers that they cannot cross. Rules.
This does not appear to be how children are raised these days. They do not appear to think that there are any rules that they need to obey.
Parents are not the friend to their child.....you cannot be a friend and maintain rules and discipline.
I know that this is a very un PP attitude, I make no apologies for it....it is my way, it is how I was brought up......I think that if more parents took the time to teach the consequence of life to,their children, then maybe, just maybe we would have a better society.

[Margaret Pilkington]

As Westendlass has said, it is easy to see every single day, parents who while they may not be slapping their child, are violent towards them.
When in the post office recently I saw a mother with three small children......all of the under school age, put her face no more than a couple of inches away from her toddler sons face and then proceed to verbally abuse him.....with a long line of vile expletives.
Is this violence? Is this likely to cause the child lasting harm?
My answer would be that this is much more harmful than a slap on the legs.

Since parenting became a softly, softly thing.....do you think society has improved?
My parents were strict.....we knew exactly where the boundaries were.....and knew what would happen if we crossed these boundaries.
My mother once dragged me to the police station for taking sixpence out of her purse.
She asked for me to be put into a cell for half an hour(I was let out after a very long ten minutes)......was she wrong to do that?
Do you think I learned my lesson......of course I did. It stays in my memory....but I am not damaged by it because I know that I brought it on myself.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

I once slapped my son on the leg in frustration and immediately apologised for doing it.

You can teach your children manners by your example.

My experience showed me that children will learn their behaviour from you, providing you have gained their respect.

Violence, however 'mild', is not a respectable action.

Utter rubbish, my son may well have been dead now if i hadn't slapped his legs, after many times trying to explain.

[Margaret Pilkington]

There were seven children in our family and without rules and discipline there would have been chaos.
We all knew what was expected of us.....and my father kept order like a sergeant major.
We knew that what he did, he did for a reason. He didn't tell every night ' i love you' he demonstrated it daily by making sure that we were safe, cared for and fed(which was no mean feat).
I would not have had it any other way. It prepared me for life very well.
I brought my own daughter up along similar lines.....and she is bringing up her children in the same vein.
To be a good parent, you have to have had good parents.
Parents who demonstrate their moral code, their ethics and their beliefs.
This does not mean that you are forced to choose the same things for yourself, but you cannot differentiate good from bad if you do not know what 'good' is.
Manners are instilled before a child goes to school.....they are maintained by good example after that.

[Studio25]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

To be a good parent, you have to have had good parents.

Not necessarily - but I'm sure it helps.

[pifco]

I went into 4 shops yesterday and bought something in each but only in 1 did I hear a please or thank you by the shop assistant. Last month in Currys I spent several hundred £s and I never heard a please or thank you but I was told by the salesman to press the green button on the panel by the door on my way out to signify that I was very satisfied with the service I received.

[MrPastry]

Um...the flip side of this for me is I have held doors open for women most of my decades and probably 10% of the time I come across one who does not like a man holding a door open for them, even had one tell me 'I don't need a man to help me' as they stomp off jabbering. Funny owd world....

[cashman]

Originally Posted by MrPastry

Um...the flip side of this for me is I have held doors open for women most of my decades and probably 10% of the time I come across one who does not like a man holding a door open for them, even had one tell me 'I don't need a man to help me' as they stomp off jabbering. Funny owd world....

I woulda said, fair enough ignorant lesbo.

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by cashman

I woulda said, fair enough ignorant lesbo.

Manners may not be in abundance ...... but it appears chivalry is flourishing.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by MrPastry

Um...the flip side of this for me is I have held doors open for women most of my decades and probably 10% of the time I come across one who does not like a man holding a door open for them, even had one tell me 'I don't need a man to help me' as they stomp off jabbering. Funny owd world....

That means that 90% valued your gentlemanly behaviour.
I always thank anyone who hold a door open for me regardless of their age or gender...because it is polite and courteous to do so, it is how i was brought up.
Please do not stop doing this just because there are some churlish people in the world...the world is a richer place when people do these small acts of kindness.

[yerself]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

Violence, however 'mild', is not a respectable action.

Violence is the sign language of the illiterate.

The most ill-mannered people I seem to come across are cyclists and old biddies with shopping trolleys.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Isn't mild violence an oxymoron?
To talk of the chastisement of your child as violence is wrong.
If you do not check your child when he/ she does something which is wrong, something which is dangerous, you are not a responsible parent....and you are certainly not setting your child up for life in the real world.

[lindsay ormerod]

I don't know if it counts as manners but I saw the most fantastic behaviour exhibited outside my place of work yesterday. I work in a building on the corner of Barbara Castle Way and Preston New Rd, it's a crazy busy junction all day, with 3 sets of traffic lights for the pedestrian and 2 traffic islands.
An elderly Caucasian gent had broken down on his mobility scooter at the opposite side of the road, he was frail and unsteady on his feet whilst trying to get his scooter going, with no luck. Just as the lads in the office were about to go to his aid a young Asian fella was there, he looked very streetwise, bandana and muscle vest, he took the old guy's arm and whilst guiding him across the road he pushed the scooter too! It was obviously extremely hard work, dunno if the brakes were seized, but the young man was panting when he got to the traffic island. Then a young Asian woman ran across and helped him with the old fella, both of them pushing the scooter and making sure the old fella got to the health centre. I must add that whilst they were slowly crossing the road some ignorant git beeped his horn even though it was obvious what was going on, the young man flicked him the bird and rightly so!
It was a wonderful thing to see and full credit to the 2 of them for helping!

[cashman]

I have to say linds, it dont surprise me, in my experience Asians in general are far more family orientated than we are, may upset a few, but thats how i see it.