Bedroom tax - targeting the poorest.

[Less]

Originally Posted by gpick24

Now don`t be like that. Less is OK so long as you agree with everything he says.

Deary me, have I hurt you in the past?

Now you've found an allie?

Not to worry, I'll allow you this one after all your mate can make paragraphs you only make a one sentence comment, hardly a real contribution is it?

[gpick24]

Originally Posted by Less

Deary me, have I hurt you in the past?

Now you've found an allie?

Not to worry, I'll allow you this one after all your mate can make paragraphs you only make a one sentence comment, hardly a real contribution is it?

Hurt me? No
Found an ally? No, as I disagree with most of what he put.
And one sentence comments are the most I can manage during a busy day at work.

[Less]

Originally Posted by gpick24

Hurt me? No
Found an ally? No, as I disagree with most of what he put.
And one sentence comments are the most I can manage during a busy day at work.

If you and those like you stopped stealing time from working just to make inane posts on the internet perhaps our economy would be on the road to recovery?

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by GEaston

Plenty of idiots on here mouse, and Less is one of them. He and others that can't argue quickly resort to personal insults. As a former teacher he should know better. For my part I am pleased I didn't attend his IT class!

I'd like to know why people think the government owes them anything - house, living, just anything at all. Welfare state came in post war to provide for people in harsh circumstances, which was an honourable idea, but its long since morphed into something can take the **** out of as the Phillpot "family" perfectly demonstrated. I get that's an extreme case, but the fact that people can is shameful. Individual greed will always trump need.

What happened in Britain in every century prior to this one? For the previous 10,000 years we did just fine, and were a great nation for much of the latter part. There's plenty of excellent economic systems without a Welfare state, or handout mentality, like the one here in Singapore. Here they spend next to nothing on welfare, and almost no one looks to the govt for help nor is anyone jealous of the UK system, which they find laughable. Here, and in most of Asia, the concept of FAMILY is live and well. FAMILY look after you until such time as you no longer need help. The house next door to me has 4 generations of the same family living in it.

Meanwhile back in Blighty we now have a system where people leave home at 18, feel entitled to be housed by the government (for no reason other than they reached 18), have kids and often can't even stay in an immediate family unit - in fact if you don't your priority in the govt housing queue rises, long with your Govt support payments.

Time to completely reconsider the role of govt in society, instead of just moaning about it. Step back for a minute and read this thread again - people are actually outraged that the government isn't providing enough of the right type of housing !!!! I could add my previous point about our nation also being financially bankrupt and unable to support any such thing, but that's a wider discussion.

Gotta say Mr. Loadsamoney... that has got to be the wildest most inaccurate pile of nonsense I've ever read on this forum, maybe if you took your head out of Property Developers Weekly and read about the real hardship being caused to the many because of the greed of the few you may gain some insight.

Who knows you may even be able to create a cogent argument, instead of banging on about how great it was with cholera, whooping cough, 7 year old chimney sweeps, workhouses, cannon fodder, giving up your bride to the feudal lord on your wedding night, bubonic plague and the black death.

[cashman]

Nah then Guinness yeh will be joining the idiots saying that.

[Less]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Gotta say Mr. Loadsamoney... that has got to be the wildest most inaccurate pile of nonsense I've ever read on this forum, maybe if you took your head out of Property Developers Weekly and read about the real hardship being caused to the many because of the greed of the few you may gain some insight.

Who knows you may even be able to create a cogent argument, instead of banging on about how great it was with cholera, whooping cough, 7 year old chimney sweeps, workhouses, cannon fodder, giving up your bride to the feudal lord on your wedding night, bubonic plague and the black death.

Although I agree with what you have said, forgive me if this sounds like a criticism, he just didn't deserve a reply.

[GEaston]

:-) usual suspects all in rampant agreement with each other. Do you have independent opinions ?

I recon I provide a refreshing change, at least you can collectively moan about me instead of collectively moaning about the government.

Less, it was indeed a specific point made about you, much he same as the one you made to mouse. I just wondered if you can take criticism as well as you dish it out. I see the playground bully didn't like getting a back eye.......lol

[Margaret Pilkington]

However inane/ill judged/ludicrous/silly(please supply your own adjective to my list if you wish) anyone considers a post to be...it is what keeps a forum going.
If people stop posting, because they fear that their comment is going to be judged harshly(after all, we all have our own opinions....and we are adult enough to agree to disagree) then the forum will fold.
Now wouldn't that be a shame?

[accyman]

some are adult enough to agree to disagree but personally id rather settle disputes with water pistols loaded with beer at around 1pm ish in a pub with a decent beer garden

[Margaret Pilkington]

with your mouth open I presume .

[accyman]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

with your mouth open I presume .

not if its loaded with fosters

[Less]

Originally Posted by GEaston

:-) usual suspects all in rampant agreement with each other. Do you have independent opinions ?

I recon I provide a refreshing change, at least you can collectively moan about me instead of collectively moaning about the government.

Less, it was indeed a specific point made about you, much he same as the one you made to mouse. I just wondered if you can take criticism as well as you dish it out. I see the playground bully didn't like getting a back eye.......lol

Oh you silly child, I'm not a playground bully, I pointed out that you are as bad as you claim I am, as for the rest of that stupid post...


...Did you really believe all that nonsense you followed it with?

I have wished you luck with your projects in the past, perhaps I should be backing someone that show a little more compassion for the little guy than you do?
Hmm, show compassion for the little guy, the sort of thing a real bully would walk away from isn't it?
Or would he just take the little guy down a blind alley and blame him for everything? Make sure he knows it's his fault and shove his hand up his back and force any money he needs out of him with a new but uncaring tax?
Any suggestions?
Perhaps you may consider the bedroom tax once you've stopped having fun with the single persons Council tax?
Nothing better than to make the innocent scream is there?

Me, a bully? I don't think so, I just don't like the way people are being forced to the wall and will continue to say so.

Have a good life Mr. (or would you prefer Bwana) Easton, but please don't let your superiority complex get in my way.

[GEaston]

I don't wallow in nostalgia Margaret. Advances in medicine and technology obviously make comparison with previous periods not so relevant. My point was merely that the welfare state and public belief that the government owes them a house is in historic terms a new concept.

Historically people had family or nothing. Now it's family and state. This topic was started by the woman who killed herself because the government had given her a house that was too big, and wasn't giving her enough to live in it. Tragic yes, but probably not a situation that would happen in many other countries.

No one at all wanted to even talk about the 50% rise in the welfare bill since 2004, or where the extra £10 billion a year can come from. Not a single person said I think the money should be raised from this or that....... What we did see was the usual howls of greedy Tories, nasty government etc but nothing of actionable practical value.

Govt spending as was is unsustainable. The debt clocks http://usdebtclock.org/world-debt-clock.html of pretty much everywhere (except china which I note is reducing) are spinning out of control, and unlike historic periods where this happened there is no inflation to erode the value of the debt.

[Less]

Originally Posted by GEaston

This topic was started by the woman who killed herself

Well in that case she doesn't have a leg to stand on does she?

If she's dead she doesn't need a house no matter how many bedrooms.

However I think you will find the thread was started by someone that is alive and it was about how a badly thought out attack on the poor has driven somebody to suicide.

Nothing you say can bring that life back or recompense her relatives for the loss of a loved one because she felt such a burden on both the family and the state.

How long before you agree with cattle trucks re-locating not into 1 bed flats but a few furnaces?

Still with modern technology we could generate a few watts of electricity. But no doubt you would then blame the victims and their carbon footprints for global warming?

Your type of attitude really does make me sick!

[GEaston]

Ok Less, then lets hear how you propose to pay for the utopia you seek.

Margaret - found something we can agree on, which is that free speech is to the benefit of the forum. However, I recon far more people would contribute if they weren't shot to flames by Less and his team of playground bullies. I don't mind them at all, but as can be seen I have a thicker skin than most.

To your compassion point Less we can once again disagree. I've made over 50 loans to people in real need on http://www.kiva.org. These people have genuine needs. I prefer to help in this way because a collective loan enables the person to get going and then is repaid allowing you to resend the same sum to another person. I would recommend anyone on the forum to take a look at it. Interestingly every one of the 50+ loans I've made was repaid (my loss if it isn't) probably because these people need help but don't want charity/pity.