Benefits for the poor are spent on drugs and gambling

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by cmonstanley

brighthouse ie private sector shop

BrightHouse, what has BrightHouse got to do with it?

Oh, I see, those who don't go to work buy their stuff from Brighthouse at over-inflated prices and ultra high interest rates........now let me see....where do these people get the money for this stuff?
Why the tax payer of course........so while they might be paying for these goods, it is you and me who are paying for it really via our taxes.

Around here they don't call it Brighthouse, but something which rhymes with it.

[Boeing Guy]

So the loss of the mill's, factories etc has got nothing with the desire of the general public to purchase goods as cheaply as possible.
I remember the Three day week, only having two channels on the TV when ITV went on strike, Red Robbo at British Leyland, even the Miners holding the country to ransom in the mid 70's, "crisis what crisis" (I am not referring to the Supertramp Album).

Anyone remember the Buy British campaign?
What happened to that?
James Dyson, of Dyson fame, moved his manufacturing to China 6 or 7 years ago, because the Government were strangling him.
My own father is currently designing a card product, he wants to have it made in Britian, but as it would cost 30p more here than China, the Retailers will not buy it as the General Public will find it too expensive!

Personally, I felt that Northern Rock should have been allowed to fail with all debts (mortgages,
loans etc) written off and all deposits guaranteed by the Government of the day.
I have no time for the Bankers and their bonuses, but neither the last government or this one are prepared to cap them.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Boeing Guy

So the loss of the mill's, factories etc has got nothing with the desire of the general public to purchase goods as cheaply as possible.
I remember the Three day week, only having two channels on the TV when TV went on strike, Red Robbo at British Leyland, even the Miners holding the country to ransom in the mid 70's, "crisis what crisis" (I am not referring to the Supertramp Album).

Anyone remember the Buy British campaign?
What happened to that?
James Dyson, of Dyson fame, moved his manufacturing to China 6 or 7 years ago, because the Government were strangling him.
My own father is currently designing a card product, he wants to have it made in Britain, but as it would cost 30p more here than China, the Retailers will not buy it as the General Public will find it too expensive!

Personally, I felt that Northern Rock should have been allowed to fail with all debts (mortgages,
loans etc) written off and all deposits guaranteed by the Government of the day.
I have no time for the Bankers and their bonuses, but neither the last government or this one are prepared to cap them.

You've got to remember BG that the ills of this country have, in history, only started on the 3rd May 1979 and the 6th of May 2010, well that's according the Pinky and Perky or north and south of the border. it seems funny though that they conveniently forget what happened in the years leading up to these dates, its always easier getting into the mire than getting out of it, they're great at the first part but crap at the second, always leaving it to others to clear up while the main protagonists sail of into the sunset to make their own fortunes

[Boeing Guy]

Damm it Jay, I nearly lost a mouthful of coffee on my netbook screen then!!!!
I would give more K, but cannot at the moment.
BG

[Less]

I would love to know when I and others like me became scroungers?
I was recently made redundant not because of the world recession, not because the goods I was manufacturing weren't wanted, not because I wasn't prepared to travel and work hard.
I was made redundant because the Country I was working in had a revolution!
This brought a suspension of the long term contract I was working on which in my own small way was bringing much needed money into this Country.
If ever things become stable again in that Country I know, there is a backlog of work that I will be able to catch up on.
Until then, I and others in my position are doing what they are entitled to do, claim benefits.
While I was working, I bought the luxury goods, flat screen T.V.'s, decent mobile, excellent P.C. & laptop for when I do go abroad.
All items I paid cash for, I have no debts so if I choose to fritter away some of my benefits on entertainment am I being irresponsible? Am I stealing from other peoples tax?
No, I am existing on less than quarter of what I used to earn, but I certainly don't need some high minded person to decide how I spend my entitlement, nor am I suddenly so incompetent with money that I need to be paid in vouchers.
Very soon fortunately the work is going to be there again for me plenty of panels that are well overdue to be made, plenty of time spent abroad fitting those panels. (the Company hope there will be so much work they will be able to employ even more struggling people in genuine jobs).
Do I blame the people of that Country for fighting for a better life? No, hopefully their freedom will mean more work as we turn their Country around.
I have of course been prepared to do any job while I'm claiming my rights, the jobs just aren't out there like they used to be.
As for generations being on benefits it's a disgrace, but I don't think it is their disgrace, it is OUR digrace, so unless you have some magic fix that will bring genuine work for all do not be too quick to judge, the vast majority in their situation want to work.

[Margaret Pilkington]

No Less, you are not a scrounger. You have paid into the system and are claiming what is yours.
You will pay into the system again, when you are employed....you are employable, you have a skill....you have a work ethic.......you told us you would take any job until things pick up.
No-one has suggested that you have sudenly become incompetent with money...or that you should be denied the entertainment of your choice.

Why do you think that generations who have never worked is OUR disgrace as you put it?

They have never paid into the system as you have....and in essence they are taking your money too.

The magic fix you talk off was way back down the line...opportunites missed.
Other factors too have had an impact......the uncontrolled immigration....the global economy. But it has to be said that there are some people, who unlike you.....do not want to work, but want to be kept by the state.
If you feel that this acceptable then, so be it.......but it is an unsustainable situation.

[Less]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

No Less, you are not a scrounger. You have paid into the system and are claiming what is yours.
You will pay into the system again, when you are employed....you are employable, you have a skill....you have a work ethic.......you told us you would take any job until things pick up.
No-one has suggested that you have sudenly become incompetent with money...or that you should be denied the entertainment of your choice.

Why do you think that generations who have never worked is OUR disgrace as you put it?

They have never paid into the system as you have....and in essence they are taking your money too.

The magic fix you talk off was way back down the line...opportunites missed.
Other factors too have had an impact......the uncontrolled immigration....the global economy. But it has to be said that there are some people, who unlike you.....do not want to work, but want to be kept by the state.
If you feel that this acceptable then, so be it.......but it is an unsustainable situation.

The people so easily sacrificed and then condemned by those luckier than themselves could also be employable and contribe if the work was there. It is only a tiny minority that scrounge and choose to live on benefits, it is an even smaller minority that steal benefits, what is disgraceful about these thieves is that when caught the punisment doesn't fit the crime.
But oh how easily our 'right minded' people are to tar all claiments with the same dirty brush, playing the blame game against the vulnerable is cowardly, whether you are a politician or the so called ordinary man in the street.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Is it only a tiny minority who live exclusively on benefits?
I know at least three families who have never worked...ever.

And yes, it is disgraceful that when caught the benefit cheats get ludicrous sentences.
It is even more disgraceful that they cheat in the first place, rather than have the morality to go out and earn a living.

Have a walk along Broadway, any day of the week and look at some of the vulnerable.

[Margaret Pilkington]

And it isn't luck that makes someone employable.....and you know it. It is application, application to learn, application to adapt, being willing to do something that perhaps someone else won't do. It is getting up in the morning, showing up for the job...that has nothing at all to do with luck.

Polish workers seem to find work easily enough......employers like them because they want to work.

[accyman]

Originally Posted by cmonstanley

brighthouse ie private sector shop

i know of a few people who use that shop and they dont have what they buy very long because they cant keep up with the payments so they come and reposses the item.I reakon anything you buy there has probably had at least 3 previous owners unable to keep up payments but thats their choice to shop there.Personally i would save up a couple of quid each week and get a nice telly as long as teh nosey cow down teh street didnt stick her nose into my window and start telling everyone how distgusting it is that instead of buying fags or exepensive food i lived a little cheaper and saved for a cheap brand lcd tv from asda

what next..

how dare people on benefit buy their children christmas presents.

some people work 16 hours a week and get topped up by the tax payer to a full time wage plus get council tax reductions and dont have to pay for prescriptions and dental etc.Maybe its time to shoot them as well because their top up money ( tax credit) is paying for their little extras.

Im sick of peple on benefits been made out to be living a life of luxury.There are some on benefits who drive flash cars ,have all the latest mod cons and go on holidays , I think they are called drug dealers

[Less]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Have a walk along Broadway, any day of the week and look at some of the vulnerable.

I bet for each one of your deadbeat families on Broadway there will be perhaps 10 families that are on benefits and would like nothing more than for some of their family to break out of the poverty trap.
You remember poverty? You like to tell us how you grew up in poverty and how you worked hard to improve your lot.
Heres somewhere that luck comes in, you were part of a generation that enjoyed full employment, these so called misfits aren't as lucky as you but I'll bet you they wish they had the chance to work as well.

[Taggy]

Originally Posted by Less

The people so easily sacrificed and then condemned by those luckier than themselves could also be employable and contribe if the work was there. It is only a tiny minority that scrounge and choose to live on benefits, it is an even smaller minority that steal benefits, what is disgraceful about these thieves is that when caught the punisment doesn't fit the crime.
But oh how easily our 'right minded' people are to tar all claiments with the same dirty brush, playing the blame game against the vulnerable is cowardly, whether you are a politician or the so called ordinary man in the street.

I agree pretty much with all that. As you say those convicted of Benefit fraud should be punished properly in accordance with the severity of that crime & that doesn't always seem to happen. However as you also say, despite what you hear via the media, this crime is relatively low, certainly much lower both in percentage and monetary terms than Tax Avoidance by the very rich, yet there never seems to be the same clamor to hunt those miscreants down.

I know of several disabled people who are being made to feel persecuted & worthless by the constant media bombardment which labels everyone who isn't in gainful employment as workshy. They would all chose a job over their disability any day. Unfortunately its a choice, through no fault of their own, that they will never have!

Best Regards - Taggy

[Margaret Pilkington]

No Less, there was no luck involved in how I turned my life around. I studied, and I worked...and I studied some more.
When I left school in 1962 there were more young people than jobs. I got up every day and looked for work. I took myself to places...asked if they had any jobs going.
When I did get a job, I made damn sure that I worked so hard that they didn't want to let me leave.
I left and went working in the weaving mill....because it paid better money. I worked damned hard......6am in the morning til 2pm in the afternoon(I worked in Rawtenstall...lived in Clayton...walked from Clayton to Accrington to get the 5.30 bus to Rawtenstall) I learned to weave top class fabrics....then the company moved lock stock and barrel to South Africa........some workers went with the company...I had just got married and so I was made redundant.......how long was I out of work?
2 days. Why? because I went and found work for myself.
I worked for the Carborundum company...nasty dirty dusty work, heavy too.....decided that a career was better than a job....and you know the rest.
So don't tell me that luck had anything to do with how my life turned out....it didn't, it was application, education, persistance, hard graft........but luck NO...it had nothing at all to do with it.

[accyman]

when i was 18 ( due t wasting 2 years on y.t.s) i went knocking on doors for jobs and would either get an interview there and then,be told to go back for a chat or my details would be taken so i could be contacted when a vacancey came up.

when i found myself needing a job 12 years ago i went back to knocking on doors and was promtley told to fill in an application at teh local job agencey group so agencies arnt a new problem but they have got worse as nearly all big companies use them.For things to get beter these agencies need scrapping or severely reducing because as long as they exist employers can keep giving false prommise of a permement job only to transfer them to another department under a new temporary contract or simply let them go.

although i hav not used agencies friends have and there are too many ways in which an employer can abuse the system and not give out jobs at the end of teh contract so they can save on paying holiday pay and sick pay etc

senator international used to be a good local employer but now uses agencey workers rather than employ someone full time or as a full senator employee

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Taggy

I agree pretty much with all that. As you say those convicted of Benefit fraud should be punished properly in accordance with the severity of that crime & that doesn't always seem to happen. However as you also say, despite what you hear via the media, this crime is relatively low, certainly much lower both in percentage and monetary terms than Tax Avoidance by the very rich, yet there never seems to be the same clamor to hunt those miscreants down.

I know of several disabled people who are being made to feel persecuted & worthless by the constant media bombardment which labels everyone who isn't in gainful employment as workshy. They would all chose a job over their disability any day. Unfortunately its a choice, through no fault of their own, that they will never have!

Best Regards - Taggy

Why feel guilty when your not, I've had ill health for years, and was totally ****ed of when I was told I couldn't work again, but there are those and a lot of um that fain disability to claim money they are not entitle too, if these were eked out then the real needy would get more, but until we get rid of the feckless workshy scroungers, which in fact escalated to outrageous propositions while the last government through money about like confetti, and the likes off Mancie think is quite okay for them to carry on, the game really is a boggy