Beyond The Call Of Duty

jambutty · 23-07-2008, 20:08

Royal Marine Lance Corporal Matthew Croucher, 24, from Solihull is to be awarded the George Cross, which ranks alongside the Victoria Cross as the highest decoration for bravery.

On patrol in Afghanistan to try and uncover a Taliban bomb making factory, Lance Corporal Matthew Croucher hit a trip wire, wired to a grenade. Fortunately grenades do not explode immediately the pin is pulled but there is a delay of several seconds. It was this delay that not only saved him from at best serious injury but gave him time to cover the grenade with his body to protect his patrol. As he hit the deck he was able to roll over on his back over the grenade and wait for it to explode. What saved his life and prevented a serious injury that was limited to a bloody nose and a severe ringing in the ears was his rucksack full of equipment. Question – no flack jacket?

According to the Guardian “the only difference between the VC and the GC is that the GC is awarded for acts not in the presence of the enemy, but the level of heroism required for the two honours is the same.” http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk/2008/jul/23/military.afghanistan

As I understand it there is only one highest bravery award and that is the VC. The GC is the equivalent highest award to civilians as in the case of the peoples of the island of Malta. I discover today that the GC is also awarded to military personnel for actions not in the face of the enemy. So the booby trapped grenade was not in the face of the enemy? You can’t get much closer to the enemy than a grenade a couple of yards away.

Royal Marine Lance Corporal Matthew Croucher’s extremely brave action deserves the VC and nothing less.

I’ll bet that had the patrol been led by Lt. Snodgrass and it was he who dived on the grenade he would have been awarded the VC. But the MOD palms a squaddie off with an inferior bravery award.

But then what do we expect from this excuse for a government. It cannot even supply the troops with the tools to do the job and lives are being lost because of it.

Eric · 23-07-2008, 20:14

Deserves the VC for this ... no question about it.

Wynonie Harris · 23-07-2008, 20:19

Agree with every word you say there, Jambutty. A very brave lad who does indeed deserve the VC.

Eric · 23-07-2008, 20:36

Didn't the Captain of HMS Conqueror receive a medal for sinking the Belgrano? If that was classed as an act of bravery, then Lance-Corporal Croucher most certainly deserves the highest award your country has to offer.

BERNADETTE · 23-07-2008, 20:55

The MOD never cease to amaze me, how can they possibly say this was not in the face of the enemy??? He should get the highest award there is!!

West Ender · 23-07-2008, 21:19

Yes, Jambutty, I agree. The lad was in a war situation, even if war hasn't officially been declared, and I always believed the GC was for civilians such as, as you say, the people of Malta. I don't really think it's an inferior award, in essence, but I do think it's inappropriate in this case. He's a soldier who saved the lives of his comrades and he should be honoured as a soldier.

cashman · 23-07-2008, 21:26

agree totally the guy should be awarded the V.C. also agree that if he carried a "Rank" he would have been, the ordinary squaddie counts fer nowt as the shortage of equipment has shown once again, despite all the promises.

Loz · 23-07-2008, 21:40

Well said Jambutty.
He was in the face of the enemy and saved many lives with his brave actions and should be awarded appropiately with the highest honour there is.
This useless goverment can't even give honours out correctly!

Royboy39 · 23-07-2008, 21:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loz

Well said Jambutty.
He was in the face of the enemy and saved many lives with his brave actions and should be awarded appropiately with the highest honour there is.
This useless goverment can't even give honours out correctly!

Depends very much on how the citation reads.
I agree, this lad deserves the VC.
Citations are constructed by the man's Commanding Officer after taking witness statements.
These citations are presented to an awards commitee and it is they who decide on the award.

jambutty · 23-07-2008, 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Eric

Didn't the Captain of HMS Conqueror receive a medal for sinking the Belgrano? If that was classed as an act of bravery, then Lance-Corporal Croucher most certainly deserves the highest award your country has to offer.

Probably but it wouldn’t have been the VC, GC or even MC. Just yet another campaign medal. I doubt if the crew got anything though.

If Royal Marine Lance Corporal Matthew Croucher had been a yank he would have been showered with “Purple Hearts”, got a substantial promotion and got a ticket tape reception in New York.

Slightly off topic but now can people see why we don’t want street corner yobs and petty criminals conscripted into the armed forces? They just ain’t good enough.

The VC also comes with a pension for life and the right to receive salutes from every single serving member of the armed forces and that would include Charles and co and the upper echelon of the armed forces.

Imagine General “Sit behind a desk sending men to their death” or Admiral Pugwash or Air Marshal Biggles having to salute a squaddie. There would be a major outbreak of apoplectic fits.

BERNADETTE · 23-07-2008, 22:12

Quote:

Jambutty Slightly off topic but now can people see why we don’t want street corner yobs and petty criminals conscripted into the armed forces? They just ain’t good enough.

I have always thought like that, why should the forces be stuck with morons who have no intention of obeying any orders?
Back on topic the lad deserves the highest award there is!!

Royboy39 · 23-07-2008, 22:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by BERNADETTE

I have always thought like that, why should the forces be stuck with morons who have no intention of obeying any orders?
Back on topic the lad deserves the highest award there is!!

Bernie...........The army would not be stuck with morons who would not take orders......Don't obey..then Glasshouse....that is the worst experience anyone could encounter.....no lounging about in TV rooms.
Going to the toilet....double....Square bashing....two hours non stop.
I know of no one who would exchange a comfy prison for an army correction unit.

BERNADETTE · 23-07-2008, 22:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Royboy39

Bernie...........The army would not be stuck with morons who would not take orders......Don't obey..then Glasshouse....that is the worst experience anyone could encounter.....no lounging about in TV rooms.
Going to the toilet....double....Square bashing....two hours non stop.
I know of no one who would exchange a comfy prison for an army correction unit.

I still don't see it as the answer but that is just my opinion. We need lads and lasses who join the forces by choice not because they have been told to.

Royboy39 · 23-07-2008, 22:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by BERNADETTE

I still don't see it as the answer but that is just my opinion. We need lads and lasses who join the forces by choice not because they have been told to.

I have to agree to a certain extent but how the hell are we going to deal with the 'morons' who have no regard whatsoever for society.
A smack on the wrist does not work.
There are many menial tasks in the army which would give these morons the crediblity they deserve.
Give them a shovel and watch the segs grow and have that as a badge of rank.
Toilets in a field are priority and the hole that has to be dug will take the sails out of any butch moron who thinks he is better than his peers.

Ber999T · 24-07-2008, 07:38

Fully agree with JB that he should get the VC.

There is a squadie that got the VC in Iraq "For dealing with injured colleagues and getting them to safety while coming under direct fire from the enemy".

As he had tripped a booby trap they could be saying that was not under DIRECT fire and therefore the GC is the highest award.

Don't shoot me down as I thought he, and still do, should get the VC.