Big Fire Blackburn Road

[Claytoner40]

Originally Posted by jaysay

That's a poor comparison Claytone40, the vast majority of Muslims are devout, but not so in Christianity

That's true Jaysay but the owners of the takeaway may not be devout. I am at work now with Muslim lads who don't fast

[Retlaw]

Originally Posted by Claytoner40

It is Ramadan there's no supposing about it. Food can be prepared before sunset. You have to bear in mind not all of the community are devout Muslims in the same way I'm not a devout Christian

As I said read the Article again, one of those interviewed was about to go in the shop to break the fast when it happened, so why get cooked food so early if sunset is not till 8-38pm. Properly installed ventilators don't catch fire like the old ones did, used to be able to count on one a fortnight back in the 70/80's but not any more.

[MargaretR]

If you look at the roof line of the row on google maps

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Acc...66.61,,0,-8.21

it appears that the double fronted takeaway was once two dwellings, and most all the other properties on the row appear to be dwellings.

The view of the interior of the takeaway shows the wall between (what was) two premises has been demolished. It seems likely that this demolition eventually led to the collapse of the frontage.

It would be interesting to know when this internal alteration happened, and whether planning consent was applied for and approved.

This post may well be regarded as 'stating the obvious' to people familiar with the location, but some members here are not so familiar.

[Less]

Originally Posted by cashman

This seems highly suspicious to me.

Nope, don't agree, Think they were probably victims of having a cheap job done by cowboys, which lead to all of this.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

If you look at the roof line of the row on google maps

https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=Acc...66.61,,0,-8.21

it appears that the double fronted takeaway was once two dwellings, and most all the other properties on the row appear to be dwellings.

The view of the interior of the takeaway shows the wall between (what was) two premises has been demolished. It seems likely that this demolition eventually led to the collapse of the frontage.

It would be interesting to know when this internal alteration happened, and whether planning consent was applied for and approved.

This post may well be regarded as 'stating the obvious' to people familiar with the location, but some members here are not so familiar.

You could well be right Margaret, if they threat planning like they do parking in that area, the laws that apply to us don't seem to apply to them

[katex]

Originally Posted by Mick

You can go down BLackburn road on the bus but it has to be the small red ones they go as far as dale st round the back down willows lane and back onto Blackburn road and into town

Got snarled up in it today. Thought I would be clever and go down Lonsdale Street to avoid the temporary lights at Church from Ossie. On way to Asda.

Forgot about this and lead myself a merry dance, I can tell you ..

To make matters worse, when I got to the bottom of Willows Lane, the blooming lights got stuck on red !!!

Originally Posted by MargaretR

It would be interesting to know when this internal alteration happened, and whether planning consent was applied for and approved.

This was when they altered the shop front and removal of internal wall ... lots of suggestions on the beams; seems very thorough :

Case File

Application for change of use only :

Case File

[MargaretR]

Thank You Kate for taking the trouble to find that.

So it was in 1985 that an existing restaurant was given permission to extend into a house next door.

The plans clearly show that all internal walls (with the exception of a stairway on the far left and the kitchen outbuildings) were to be demolished, and that the support for the upper floor be one central column.

I can't see 'suggestions on beams' you referred to but most of the planning notes I found unreadable.

I am not a structural engineer but the wisdom in doing that is doubtful, especially in view of the age of the original buildings.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

Thank You Kate for taking the trouble to find that.

So it was in 1985 that an existing restaurant was given permission to extend into a house next door.

The plans clearly show that all internal walls (with the exception of a stairway on the far left and the kitchen outbuildings) were to be demolished, and that the support for the upper floor be one central column.

I can't see 'suggestions on beams' you referred to but most of the planning notes I found unreadable.

I am not a structural engineer but the wisdom in doing that is doubtful, especially in view of the age of the original buildings.

Think I agree with you on that Margaret and I know a bit about the subject, but obviously it must have passed all the necessary inspections at the time, well one would think so anyway

[susie123]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

I can't see 'suggestions on beams' you referred to but most of the planning notes I found unreadable.

Margaret on document 8063 page 15 out of 18 there is on the RHS a section on the plan referring to beams. It is quite legible if you blow it up on the Adobe reader.

[MITZY]

As far as I know the buses are running normal route again.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by MITZY

As far as I know the buses are running normal route again.

They seem to be Mitzy. i drove through behind one about 4-30 ish.

[MargaretR]

Originally Posted by susie123

Margaret on document 8063 page 15 out of 18 there is on the RHS a section on the plan referring to beams. It is quite legible if you blow it up on the Adobe reader.

I found this about the central column -

"Pier 665mmx665mm built from concrete common bricks on a 1.750mm x 1.750mm x 250mm thick concrete foundation. Foundation to have 2layers of A1dz(?) welded steel facing reinforcement with the lower layer placed 50mm up from the bottom of foundation. Foundation to be laid 500mm min below floor level. Pier to have 665mm x 665mm x 150mm padstone on top & a DPC (damproof) 150mm min above floor level".

I couldn't find any ref to 'beams' but I would expect RSJs (rolled steel joists) to feature at ceiling level and I can't see it.

In 1980 I organised the total refurb of a terraced house which involved demolition of 12' of a 15' dividing wall between two ground floor rooms. An RSJ of a specific size was required and it had to be fireproofed.

I can see nothing similar anywhere mentioned in the plans for the internal wall demolition done on these two properties.

[susie123]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

I found this about the central column -

"Pier 665mmx665mm built from concrete common bricks on a 1.750mm x 1.750mm x 250mm thick concrete foundation. Foundation to have 2layers of A1dz(?) welded steel facing reinforcement with the lower layer placed 50mm up from the bottom of foundation. Foundation to be laid 500mm min below floor level. Pier to have 665mm x 665mm x 150mm padstone on top & a DPC (damproof) 150mm min above floor level".

I couldn't find any ref to 'beams' but I would expect RSJs (rolled steel joists) to feature at ceiling level and I can't see it.

In 1980 I organised the total refurb of a terraced house which involved demolition of 12' of a 15' dividing wall between two ground floor rooms. An RSJ of a specific size was required and it had to be fireproofed.

I can see nothing similar anywhere mentioned in the plans for the internal wall demolition done on these two properties.

If you look at the plan on page 15 all the beams supporting the upper floor radiate out from that central column to the walls. The section on the extreme right of that page mentions them and what size they should be.

[lancsdave]

Originally Posted by MITZY

As far as I know the buses are running normal route again.

Blackburn Rd is now back to how it was before the fire, open with traffic light control

[MargaretR]

Originally Posted by susie123

If you look at the plan on page 15 all the beams supporting the upper floor radiate out from that central column to the walls. The section on the extreme right of that page mentions them and what size they should be.

Found it now thanks

...strange that it says 'beams' and not 'RSJs'