Bring back National Service !

[blazey]

The Army has a problem with aiming their advertisements at people with poor academic records, so if they're lacking quality minds then they need to rethink their marketing, because I saw a poster in Manchester aimed directly at 16/17yr olds who had recently sat their GCSE's and I thought it was very decieving the way they were focussing their campaign on the wages rather than the job at hand.

The only people from school who joined the army where chavs who failed their GCSE's, and thats because they are the ones who are targetted. Most of them WOULD have asbo's now if they hadn't gone into the Army, so I dont doubt it would be a benefit to send those with Asbo's into the Army, but it will only repel the intelligent people further away.

I'm not saying there aren't intelligent chavs, I study with one, but the majority are too heavily influenced by the idiots who think its 'cool' to not try hard at school and cause people problems.

[derekgas]

Originally Posted by Speedy

Honestly...NO. Why punish our soldiers by sending all the asbo holders over there. And if they were sent over there they should not be payed army wages as this would most likely skint our army meaning less openings for those who actually want to be in the army (me being one of those people).

You will soon learn if successful speedy, that the bigger, harder, cleverer and more careless the conscripts thought they were, the harder they would be kicked into shape! The regulars will not stand for anybody trying to make a mockery of the army (except the government who regularly do).

[West Ender]

Originally Posted by blazey

It is a parents job to teach discipline and self respect. If they are so worried they should try harder then maybe there wouldnt be this suggesting of bringing back NS for the sake of discipline.

Fitness doesn't protect you from bullets either, so on that note they still have reason to think of the worst rather than the best.

When you've finished trying to teach your granny to suck eggs, my brothers, my husband and I grew up in the 1940s and 50s. Believe it or not we were taught discipline and self-respect but, like so many of your contemporaries who are turning this country into a shambles, there were those who had no discipline in their lives and National Service gave them what Life hadn't. So, what do you propose to make indolent parents "try harder"? I'm sure you have an answer.

Fitness doesn't protect you from knives, or trainers aimed at the head either but, if you manage to avoid the former, it does sometimes help you to live a bit longer.

[Sue1]

I am not sure that the army should take the brunt of what has gone wrong with society today - on the other hand, were they to do this, I suspect they would do it extremely well. You only have to look at an ordinary young chap who goes through basic training - at the other end there is a chap who knows exactly how to behave in a given situation, has manners and self confidence. Those who would be handed asbos (and of course some of them are 10 years old and not eligible) should be put through basic training and the army does take women. I also strongly feel that prisons should be run on army lines - they are actually not meant to be holiday camps. In case anyone thinks prisoners would be unnecessarily penalised I read in the paper today that we spend over fifty percent more per day on prisoners meals than we do on NHS patients in hospital - wonder why there is a problem of malnourishment among patients being discharged from hospitals?
I wonder how bad things are really going to get before something has to be done.

[WillowTheWhisp]

Originally Posted by blazey

We are obviously obliged to care for our families, but paid work is not necessarily an obligation at birth, because not all societies do have paid work.

I'd like to live in a tribe and not have to think about paid work. Although the recent programmes showing the lives of tribes show a hard working society, its nice to see how they function off only natural things and live very fulfilling lives. I really like that idea. There dont seem to be many massive tribal wars either.

Paid work may not always be necessary depending on the society you live in but some kind of work is always necessary by someone. If everyone decided that they didn't fancy bothering and didn't feel obliged to work then nothing at all would ever get done and we'd all starve to death.

Living the commune lifestyle does sound ideal on the face of it - everyone does as much as they are capable of and only takes as much as they need. Unfortunately human beings tend to get lazy and greedy and you get people wanting more but doing less and that leads to resentment and conflict.

If you imagined trying to live "The Good Life" and be self sufficient you'd still need to earn money to pay bills. There are some unavoidable bills. Also in order to be self sufficient you still need to work at growing food etc.

What tribes are you referring to? There may not be wars on the scale of WWI and WWII but there are and have been many tribal wars with people being driven out of their homes, maimed and killed. In many ways tribal warfare can be more cruel to the civilians. It doesn't need to be on a global scale for the individual suffering to be just as acute.

[park381]

Originally Posted by katex

Comment by Retlaw (and others) that we should bring back National Service, sorry to start with a google, however, :-

BBC - History - The Peacetime Conscripts: National Service in the Post-war Years

Sure did not do any good to the minority of our young lads in the 50's 60's as per this report.

Can you imagine what the problems would be today ?

Young people being taken away from their ongoing education. We need more qualified technicians, engineers, plumbers, academics, scientists to forward our economy now.

That was never a problem, anyone in the process of "serving an apprenticeship" was exempt until such time as the apprenticeship had fininshed and the young person was classed as a "skilled man"

Training in those days always started on the "shop floor" that is after you had learned the correct way to brew the tea. The further education and qualifications came later in the form of 1 day at college + 3 of your nights attending "night school" if you could stand the pace.

[garinda]

The armed forces don't instill discipline in everyone, which can be illustrated by the case of local sqaddie who recently bit the head off a chicken for fun.

Customers shun pub after man bit head off chicken - News - Accrington Observer

Man bites chicken’s head off - News - Accrington Observer

[mr_flibble]

The armed forces is not for everybody, forcing young people into it is a bad idea. While i am sure service with in our forces would do some people the world of good, it could destroy others.

Not to mention i really don't think, in a country where gun crime is on the rise, teaching every young yob how to shoot is a very good idea.

[West Ender]

Perhaps those of us who remember National Service can, in a way, divorce the concept of a fighting force from that of young men being trained acceptably to "toe the line". A modern form of N S needn't, necessarily, be a spell in one of the front-line services but could be incorporated with helping to maintain the community - provided the army-style discipline etc. was in place and the work was regarded as seriously as army service.

There is a YOI not far from here. The lads wear uniform and they do work in the community, like getting ready for and clearing up after festivals etc., under very strict supervision. Unfortunately they've had to actually get a criminal record and be sentenced before they get that bit of discipline in their lives.

[MargaretR]

Until 2005 Italy had conscription and many of them served in the carabinari which is a type of police force, which still polices the community but with different duties from Polizia

To explain the different types of police (Polizia/Carabinari)- I found this-
The Carabinari live in barracks and are part of the military whilst the Italian police are civilian and community based.
Their mission(Carabinari) was to control crime and to serve the community through respect for the Law.

and this
Law enforcement in Italy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[derekgas]

Originally Posted by [email protected]

Until 2005 Italy had conscription and many of them served in the carabinari which is a type of police force, which still polices the community but with different duties from Polizia

To explain the different types of police (Polizia/Carabinari)- I found this-
The Carabinari live in barracks and are part of the military whilst the Italian police are civilian and community based.
Their mission(Carabinari) was to control crime and to serve the community through respect for the Law.

and this
Law enforcement in Italy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

It may be margaret, that knowing our government, they would be so good at monitoring them, they would actually breed cleverer criminals, if anything else they do is anything to go by.

[Neil]

Would this National Service be for males only or males and females?

[derekgas]

Originally Posted by Neil

Would this National Service be for males only or males and females?

Suit me if it were both Neil.

[Diesel]

Are any of the people for this National Service actually of eligible age if it were to happen...?