Burn baby

[Accyexplorer]

Aborted babies incinerated to heat UK hospitals

Aborted babies incinerated to heat UK hospitals - Telegraph

Some say abortion is wrong to begin with and if a women can terminate the human life in her womb then they shouldn't give a flying about aborted foetuses being incinerated.I'm holding back on my thoughts (for now).

Some folk say until we start to value human life and stop abortions we have no moral authority on this issue,other say “This practice is totally unacceptable,”.

Im just wondering what you folk think.

[cashman]

I think its a very complex subject,if they were stopped completely, some women would die because of it, no doubt at all about that fact,so how would that be valuing human life?

[AccyMad]

Cashy is right, this is a very complicated subject but I think that to lump a woman's, often very difficult & painful decision to have an abortion in with how the health authority have treated the foetus afterwards is wrong - woman have abortions for all sorts of reasons & I would imagine very few do it without considerable thought & agonising over it so to say that because she has made that decision she has no right to protest over what has happened afterwards does not make any sense at all.
Can I also just say that the title of this thread could have been given more thought by the starter considering the sensitivity of the subject

[Eric]

I have the great good fortune to live in a country where, for most folks, abortion is a non issue. Not too much bs about the "rights of the unborn". We don't even have an abortion law. The question has been settled. It's about a woman's right to have access to a safe medical procedure paid for by the health care systems in the individual provinces, funded by tax transfers from the Federal Government and Provincial income taxes. This, in my opinion, is how it should be. Come to think of it; it's none of my goddam business, it concerns only a woman and her physician. Doctors are not forced to perform abortions, and some hospitals, the Hotel Dieu in Kingston for example, won't allow them ... go figure, eh.

Sure, we still have a bunch of placard waving Kevins who protest on Parliament Hill; but they make noise, and go away largely ignored. But, rather than worry about "the unborn" we should maybe give some thought to the thousands of kids who will starve to death today.

[flashy]

a relative of mine who uses the same doctor as me (they just so happen to all be born again christians at that practice) went and asked the doc if she could have an abortion, he said no....who gives him the right to decide? he wouldnt even make an appointment for her at gyne, she had to ring the hospital and plead her case

[Less]

Well, for some reason I haven't been able to open the link will try again later.
I do find it unimaginable however, surely it is not for heat but for practical disposal.
I bet as well as these, there are the arms/legs of amputees, diseased kidneys and sundry other items of flesh that have to be burnt for safe disease free disposal.
Leave the women that for their own tragic reason go down this road alone.
Remember the fact that a miscarriage is also an abortion.
What do they do in summer? Store everything until it's chilly?
Of course not. They are just disposing of someone's misfortune.

[flashy]

on the opposite side of things i have an appointment tomorrow at the hospital to TRY and ask them if i can be sterilsed, because i am 38 and only have 1 child my doctor seems to think i dont stand a chance of being 'allowed' to get it done, the fact that i havent popped out a dozen more kids in the last 18 years may just go against me, i havent been pregnant in the last 18 years by choice, the choice NOT to have any more children...and i certainly dont want to start again at my age, i have a great job and a great life....i dont want to be worrying about getting pregnant for the next 15 or so years

my life .... or does it belong to the doctors?

[Eric]

Originally Posted by flashy

a relative of mine who uses the same doctor as me (they just so happen to all be born again christians at that practice) went and asked the doc if she could have an abortion, he said no....who gives him the right to decide? he wouldnt even make an appointment for her at gyne, she had to ring the hospital and plead her case

Kingston General has a women's clinic ... from what I understand, a woman doesn't have to "plead her case" ... she just phones them. Two important points: "Open to all women". "No age of consent."


Kingston General Hospital, Women's Clinic

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Less

Well, for some reason I haven't been able to open the link will try again later.
I do find it unimaginable however, surely it is not for heat but for practical disposal.
I bet as well as these, there are the arms/legs of amputees, diseased kidneys and sundry other items of flesh that have to be burnt for safe disease free disposal.
Leave the women that for their own tragic reason go down this road alone.
Remember the fact that a miscarriage is also an abortion.
What do they do in summer? Store everything until it's chilly?
Of course not. They are just disposing of someone's misfortune.

You are right Less, some hospitals have combined heat and power systems where the heat from everything they incinerate is used to produce heat or electricity. From a practical point of view it is obviously a good idea and as you said lots of body parts will end up in there. The story is just typical newspaper sensationalism and until they dragged it up most people in the terrible situation of miscarrying or having a termination don't ask what happens to the remains.

A health minister has jumped on the band wagon and has said it's totally unacceptable and has stopped it - must be election time.

Just got to the end of the story and this is the story on Dispatches tonight on Channel 4 at 8pm.

I might try and watch it tonight.

[Accyexplorer]

I feel the act of incinerating an already dead fetus shouldn't mean that much IMHO.As some of you may of gathered, I don't hold much if 'any' religious belief's (I'll leave that to Kevin an his tribe).

When is a fetus legally/medically deemed to be a human life?
To be honest I'm not sure point a fetus becomes a human life,you could argue at conception,although even sperm & egg's could be deemed life.
Personally it would be when the fetus begins to take shape of a human-like form.
I do think the ultimate choice & decision to have an abortion is for the pregnant woman, and it's sod all to do with anyone else (Dr included).

I hope everyone can agree that once a fetus takes on a "human-like form", abortion just isn't right?

Like Jeremy Kyle,I believe Education, and prevention is the key,though there are sometimes circumstances beyond our control, rape is one such example.

I believe there is also a (bigger) issue of parents being lied to saying things like "remains are cremated",No mention of them heating hospitals from their incinerators.
Stop NHS 'burning babies' says Amanda Holden: Hospitals heated wards with fetal remains - parents thought they were cremated - Mirror Online

Also i'm sorry if the title of the thread seemed a little insensitive (that's just me sometimes), you've a good point though.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Accyexplorer

I hope everyone can agree that once a fetus takes on a "human-like form", abortion just isn't right?

Er no ... and more to the point, for Canadian women, neither does the Supreme Court of Canada:


R. v. Morgentaler - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The first paragraph says it all ... those particularly interested in how we do things over here may be interested in the details.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Accyexplorer

I believe there is also a (bigger) issue of parents being lied to saying things like "remains are cremated",No mention of them heating hospitals from their incinerators.

They weren't lied to though were they.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Right! Now here is what happens in our local area.
Any aborted foetal material goes to the local crematoria and is given a dignified cremation.Even babies who were aborted for social reasons were treated in the same way.
That is of course after any histopathology specimens are looked at(for whatever reason).
The remains of foetuses are treated with the greatest respect by nursing and medical staff. How do I know this...because I was on a steering committee to make sure that this happened.
It was one of my areas of work.

And before anyone gets het up about sensationalising this subject. It is something that only the woman concerned can make a decision about....and sometimes it will be the hardest decision she will ever make.
Many go on to have serious issues after the event, though some do not.
Termination of a pregnancy is done for many reasons. Some women are unfortunate to be in the situation of having to undergo this procedure when the baby they carry is much wanted(abnormalities, genetic conditions)
I notice it is a man who started this thread...and he tell us he is holding back his thoughts (for now).
When I was #sister in charge of the Gynae Unit at what was then QPH all parents were given honest information about what was to happen to the remains of their baby. They were given opportunities to make an entry in the book of remembrance, they were told the date that their baby was being cremated and that this would be done at the Crematorium at Pleasington. Those who wanted pastoral care were given it. All parents were told about the service of Remembrance at St Josephs Church in Blackburn each October.....they were told that whatever their faith was they would be welcome to attend...and even if they did not attend a candle would be lit for their baby.

While I was at QPH we also had a memorial garden with areas for quiet contemplation.
We had a sculptor make a very tasteful wood carving.
I feel that we gave the parents a good service.

In early termination of pregnancy now - the medical version, it is very likely that any products of conception go down the toilet and are flushed away.

[Margaret Pilkington]

And I would just like to say this thread is insensitive.
There may be women reading this now who have had to go through this procedure and are now having to face your judgemental attitude.
There may be women who have had to endure this and were told truthfully what happens - you may have caused them grief because now they are face with the possibility that what they were told isn't true...how painful is that at a time when they already feel bad?

[DaveinGermany]

We've sort of been here before,

http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/f...ium-56620.html