China to execute two over poisoned baby milk scandal - Page 2

blazey · 26-01-2009, 20:16

I don't agree with the death penalty and I can't justify it... in any circumstance.

If they were in this country I'd expect them to never leave prison. I'd lobby against any form of death penalty because I expect better from this country.

To be honest I expected China to have a pretty harsh prison system, though I know nothing of it, so I imagine they'd have systems of torture in place and so on. Death is reasonably good in comparison to that.

'Justice' in legal systems differs. The death penalty wouldn't be my idea of justice in our system, but in any country that probably has a harsh prison system then death is better than torture.

And torture and pain would probably more fitting to the general pain they caused. People who kill are often driven by anger, passion, jealousy... things you generally can't have MUCH control over if you feel them to that extent. Or mental problems...

These men let people die for the sake of their greed and lust for money. That in my opinion can be controlled... they were just unconcerned with the danger they might cause. And a rational mind that puts the lives of that number of people at risk is far more dangerous than your average psycho.

That's my opinion anyway. I don't think I could impose my personal views on cultures I don't fully understand, but what I do understand of China is that it is much more harsh than it is here.

The death sentence in this case certainly isn't an eye for an eye, no where near.

steeljack · 01-02-2009, 14:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by MargaretR

No one got punished here for inflicting severe disabilities on thousands of babies in the mid 60s
.....remember thalidomide
Pharmacutical companies are the evil in our midst

came across this news article about the 'lingering' effects of the drug
State shuns children of thalidomide - Times Online

SPUGGIE J · 01-02-2009, 14:27

At least the law in China works even if in our eyes its harsh. We moan about ours not working then deride another country for the way its law works. I wouldnt mind if our laws worked half as well as the Chinese one does.

We could do with ours working like it should instead of being the pamper kind were the criminal is a victim and the victim is a non entity!!!

blazey · 07-02-2009, 02:32

Quote:

Originally Posted by SPUGGIE J

At least the law in China works even if in our eyes its harsh. We moan about ours not working then deride another country for the way its law works. I wouldnt mind if our laws worked half as well as the Chinese one does.

We could do with ours working like it should instead of being the pamper kind were the criminal is a victim and the victim is a non entity!!!

I have to disagree. If the law in China was working then those men would have never taken that risk. How can a law that strict still fail to act as a deterrent?

The way I see it, they've taken the risk between a life of luxury or no life at all.
In this country you'd take the risk of life of luxury or a life in prison completely alone, probably on suicide watch for the rest of your life, because the inmates would all want you dead for causing the death and serious ill health of so many innocent people.

If nobody can say what the experience of death is like, and it is likely to be complete nothingness, I think the risk is an easier one to take in China than here.

I suppose it depends on how you view prison as a whole though for those who have committed the most heinous of crimes.

SPUGGIE J · 07-02-2009, 07:13

I believe that when it comes to children that are the victims then the harsher the better. They took a chance and paying the price is the result. The thing is would it be better to leave them to face uncertainty in prison with the thought of some inmates ending their life or trying to do the job themselves. As a parent maybe I have a very heavy handed view of how to deal with those who kill injure or harm children and might be seen as some as having extreme views. I will not appologies over my views but understand that some will have more level headed thoughts on the matter. Everyone is entitled to their own view and might clash with some.

I do not believe that prison in some cases is a real deterrent and that the best view is an eye for an eye. If anything happened to my daughter I would to be honest proberly lose the plot as I have little or no faith in UK justice and stand by the comment about the "criminal is a victim and the victim is a non entity" is my belief . Wonder how many people are actually executed in relation to the population size in China? We would not be happy if any other country tould us how to run our justice system so we should not do the same with what might be seen as arrogant. The culture is different almost alien to some but it is the way they live their lives.

As for death that depends on your own beliefs and could lead to one hell of an argument over what or not is there when the lights of your life go out.

blazey · 07-02-2009, 09:22

I'm glad these men saw the risk of eye for an eye as a deterrent.

There is statistical evidence conducted by many sociologists that would suggest the death penalty is no more of a deterrent than life imprisonment. I studied it at college.

I personally would rather just die than spend my life in prison by myself. I'm sure I'm not the only one in the world who thinks this way.

blazey · 07-02-2009, 09:23

I've started studying a module called courts, politics and the law in the comparative perspective recently where I get to look at several legal systems. I wholeheartedly stand by this one in comparison.

SPUGGIE J · 07-02-2009, 12:06

This system of ours aint that good so would hate to think what the others were. Untill it is fairer and more equal as opposed to the Mice n Men senario then I will keep my view on it.

derekgas · 07-02-2009, 12:16

I have said before, the punishment should fit the crime, in my opinion, if you take a life, make a serious attempt on a life, or carry a gun etc, which could serve no other purpose than to end or seriously change a persons life, then you should expect to be put to death, or imprisoned for life (until you die). If this does not deter murder, knife/gun crime etc, then nothing else will, so you may as well inflict the harshest punishment possible and hope.

blazey · 07-02-2009, 12:24

On that argument you might as well inflict the harshest punishments for every crime and hope.

It's always the same people who have these strict views that whinge about speed cameras and stuff like that. People only want strict rules on things that they don't want to do themselves. The moment they want to do it they start banging fists on the table in the name of 'justice'

katex · 07-02-2009, 12:44

Heard a news bulletin about something similar involving teething rings and the fluid they contained ... can't find anything and didn't hear all the details.

derekgas · 07-02-2009, 13:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by blazey

On that argument you might as well inflict the harshest punishments for every crime and hope.

It's always the same people who have these strict views that whinge about speed cameras and stuff like that. People only want strict rules on things that they don't want to do themselves. The moment they want to do it they start banging fists on the table in the name of 'justice'

I have a clean licence, this is because I dont speed, not too long ago I was in a situation where I had a choice, on a friday night, accept a caution, or go to court on monday(and remain in a police cell until then), it was unjust, but I took the caution so that I could return home ater 5 hours, and have seen the same or similar happen to others, if I were (and I have several years ago) caught speeding, I would pay up without quibble, the justice system here, in my opinion, is garbage, and it will take more than a speeding ticket to change that, what doesnt change are the targets that are set for the police, on petty crime, or the ridiculously lenient sentences passed for crime in this country.

emamum · 07-02-2009, 14:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by katex

Heard a news bulletin about something similar involving teething rings and the fluid they contained ... can't find anything and didn't hear all the details.

i know what you mean, you are not supposed to use the fluid filled ones because they can pop and baby can swallow the liquid. I remember something about cheap dummies as well.... there have been warnings about everything to do with babies because its something we worry about, Just before ty was born there was something about baby milk, dummies and also baby food, so i never used any of them with him.

heres an old news story about it...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/515497.stm

SPUGGIE J · 07-02-2009, 16:52

Ok seen as there seems to be a run against executing these guys then lets find an option that will inflict the same kind of pain and grief while they watch. Get their kids tie them to a post and let the grieving parents kill them. They will then suffer the same.

groove · 07-02-2009, 17:09

On this subject bare in mind that criminals are,nt in prison to be punished.Being there is the punishment,soberly reflecting on your actions for in some cases your eternal life.Worth noting that Harold Shipman and Fred West opted out of that....Ian Brady is another strenuously appealing for the right to die.Best to keep em alive and live with what they,ve done,as do the familys of there victims.Death is the easy way out imho