Corrupt Council ? - Page 2

JCB · 08-10-2010, 18:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by claytonender

Could you please quantify the above statement as I don't think you understand how the local government process works.

You are totally correct .

I had always thought it was a democratic process .

JCB · 08-10-2010, 18:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

I have no idea who you are but you're full of the same woolly arguments as many Tory supporters on this forum when it comes to rubbishing Labour.

Please specify woolly arguments I have used .

Does criticising the Labour opposition on Hyndburn Council necessarily make me anti-Labour ?

You speak of Tory supporters . You know nothing of my voting record in national and local elections .

If you want some detail to back up my original quote I will give it in the form of this question . What did the Labour opposition do regarding the issue of the terrace on Pendle St , an issue you mentioned the other day ?

JCB · 08-10-2010, 19:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

As I've said before this would probably lead back to the Chief Executive, a man who is struggling to hold the machinery together whilst the children fight amonst themselves.

Please name the children who are fighting amongst themselves .

It may clarify the point I am trying to make .

A few months ago a Labour councillor came to see me about a certain matter . He hadn't been in the house 10 minutes when a Conservative councillor came about the same matter . Then the silliness started . I might as well not have been in the room . I sat looking at them arguing about petty points and getting nowhere . It was an eye-opener .

As persons I respect both of them , and am sure they both do their best for those they represent . But as party political politicians they brought no credit to themselves .

And some people wonder why I think party politics should have no place in local government .

jaysay · 09-10-2010, 09:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCB

Please name the children who are fighting amongst themselves .

It may clarify the point I am trying to make .

A few months ago a Labour councillor came to see me about a certain matter . He hadn't been in the house 10 minutes when a Conservative councillor came about the same matter . Then the silliness started . I might as well not have been in the room . I sat looking at them arguing about petty points and getting nowhere . It was an eye-opener .

As persons I respect both of them , and am sure they both do their best for those they represent . But as party political politicians they brought no credit to themselves .

And some people wonder why I think party politics should have no place in local government .

Think you've hit the nail on the head JCB, why do you think I no longer give two hoots for local politics, and I was a person who was very much involved until 2001. Peter Britcliffe is a friend of mine, in fact he actually call into see me on Thursday, I wished him happy new year, for 2007 that is

but when Graham was leader of the labour group, they were both as bad as each other, who could outdo the other, who could score the most points over the other, now it seams Ken Moss has taken on that mantle, which does him no favours what so ever. Having met Ken I actually think he's better than that, as I've said on here before he's the only Labour councillor that talks any sense, so it saddens me that he has taken this line, but people do there own thing and its up to him, but it does disappoint me nonetheless

JCB · 09-10-2010, 09:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by claytonender

Could you please quantify the above statement as I don't think you understand how the local government process works.

Thanks for putting me in the picture . It has been an eye-opener . Clearly opposition to the ruling group's decisions are difficult and maybe impossible , given what you have told me .

Based on your info I withdraw my criticism of the Labour opposition on the council .
I also apologise if my remarks have led to any being given a wrong impression of the Labour group .

Is the Cabinet statutory , or is it a system created by Hyndburn Council itself ? I have concerns about it within a democracy .

I also have concerns about the Full Council meetings , which I think should be monthly at least , about Emergency Powers , about the power of the Leader , and about the Overview and Scrutiny committees .

At the next round of local elections I think that the Labour candidates should stand on a platform for Council Reform .
The Labour councillors should commit themselves to a root and branch reform of the Council where it is possible within the law .

I am certain that most of the electorate in Hyndburn are , like I was , unaware of how Hyndburn Council is run . I suggest a process of educating the electorate be implemented by the Hyndburn Labour Party .

At present I don't know what changes can be made to make the council more democratic within the laws concerning Local Government .

JCB · 09-10-2010, 20:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

Think you've hit the nail on the head JCB, why do you think I no longer give two hoots for local politics, and I was a person who was very much involved until 2001. Peter Britcliffe is a friend of mine, in fact he actually call into see me on Thursday, I wished him happy new year, for 2007 that is

but when Graham was leader of the labour group, they were both as bad as each other, who could outdo the other, who could score the most points over the other, now it seams Ken Moss has taken on that mantle, which does him no favours what so ever. Having met Ken I actually think he's better than that, as I've said on here before he's the only Labour councillor that talks any sense, so it saddens me that he has taken this line, but people do there own thing and its up to him, but it does disappoint me nonetheless

I have two main problems with local politics , Jaysay .
One is the way the council is run . Is it run according to Local Government legislation from Westminster , or is it run according to rules made by the ruling group ?
I was surprised by the information given by Claytonender . Such a system is undemocratic in many ways , and must lead to trouble between councillors .
I have no problem with Ken Moss . He is free to criticise anything I say , even though he has misunderstood where I am coming from . He is doing what our councillors do , indulging in party politics , and that brings me to my second main problem .

I have said before that I don't see a need for party politics in local government . Most of the issues dealt with by the council are of a non-party political nature . So the councillors seek matters that may divide them , and finding none they turn to personalising things . They get personal , and this leads to a bad form of politics .

Local politics and the Council set-up are due for a good shake up as I indicated in the quote before this one .

I am tending towards criticising the present ruling group , the Conservatives , for the present situation and hoping the Labour group will bring about reform to Council procedures .
I am open to correction if my understanding of all this is faulty .

Gayle · 09-10-2010, 22:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCB

I have said before that I don't see a need for party politics in local government . Most of the issues dealt with by the council are of a non-party political nature . So the councillors seek matters that may divide them , and finding none they turn to personalising things . They get personal , and this leads to a bad form of politics .

I absolutely agree with you and on the surface that's what it looks like. But there is a lot of cross party working and some Councillors are very happy to work with their opposite number.

Vicbfc · 09-10-2010, 22:40

I like it when people work together

Nickelson · 09-10-2010, 22:44

HBC is corrupt didnt Malcom Pritchard saga prove that ?

Mancie · 10-10-2010, 01:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

Think you've hit the nail on the head JCB, why do you think I no longer give two hoots for local politics, and I was a person who was very much involved until 2001. Peter Britcliffe is a friend of mine, in fact he actually call into see me on Thursday, I wished him happy new year, for 2007

Did you dunk his biscuits?.

spignific · 10-10-2010, 02:00

i worked with graham Jones for a few years in printing industry .he is has honest as the day is long..its not which party locally you want,its who's going to help you whoever polical sway..can say jonesy would help and certainly aint 'corrupt' in anyway...cant ask for anymore than that !!!! not bothered who you trust but i'll personally stand up for graham in that respect,,

jaysay · 10-10-2010, 09:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mancie

Did you dunk his biscuits?.

He didn't stop long enough

jaysay · 10-10-2010, 09:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCB

I was surprised by the information given by Claytonender . .

Labour were just as undemocratic when last they were in power for 13 years JCB, if not more, a 44 seat majority was never good for democracy and some of the things that went on behind closed doors was unbelievable, which was virtually everything

JCB · 10-10-2010, 09:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

I absolutely agree with you and on the surface that's what it looks like. But there is a lot of cross party working and some Councillors are very happy to work with their opposite number.

Thanks .
I'm glad to hear some good news . Let's hope there is more of it .

SPUGGIE J · 10-10-2010, 09:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

Labour were just as undemocratic when last they were in power for 13 years JCB, if not more, a 44 seat majority was never good for democracy and some of the things that went on behind closed doors was unbelievable, which was virtually everything

Could that not be applied to all colours of politics though? Up here it can be like a playground fight when they disagree. Evens stevens is not always good either.