Crematorium - Page 2

Barrie Yates · 01-10-2015, 14:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

The cross will remain up unless requested to be taken down, not the other way around.

Your statement is quite clear - "The cross will remain" So there can be no doubt that the original cross will be re-instated and not replaced by a removable altar top miniature version.
Please will you confirm to the electorate of Hyndburn that what you have said is in fact what you mean.

Barrie Yates · 01-10-2015, 14:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

I thought this would crop up on here. It's just another headline-grabbing lie from Peter Britcliffe. The cross will remain up unless requested to be taken down, not the other way around.

Government guidelines now state that public buildings should be non-secular so the only difference is that a cross is now permanently displayed on a stand rather than the wall. It makes it easier to remove when asked.

May I suggest that you look at the threads on Hyndburn Chat on this subject. You will then see for yourself the outpourings of anger that you have generated.

cashman · 01-10-2015, 14:46

To be honest its Ken Moss thats grabbed the headline NOT P.B. probably a headline he neither envisaged or wanted, but thats life, theres clowns in every circus.

Rowlf · 01-10-2015, 14:54

I saw about this in last nights Lancs Telegraph and then lo and behold it is in todays national press. I think Hyndburn council need an arithmetic lesson as 40% does not equal a majority and therefore is not democratic. I think the cross should stay put and if any family do not want it then it could be removed for their service. What these idiots will think of next beggars? Will all the grave stones on the cemetery that have a cross on them have to be removed too in case someone is offended passing them on the way to the crem?

Margaret Pilkington · 01-10-2015, 15:07

It isn't Muslims that require the cross to be removed, Muslims do not cremate their dead.
So 40 % of the local population do not profess any religion doesn't mean that they would find the cross offensive, I do not believe that humanists would object to this symbol either.
That must mean that it HAS to be the PC brigade making a problem where none exists....how very sad that they can find nothing better to do with their time and energy.

Margaret Pilkington · 01-10-2015, 15:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman

To be honest its Ken Moss thats grabbed the headline NOT P.B. probably a headline he neither envisaged or wanted, but thats life, theres clowns in every circus.

And not ALL the clowns are in the circus either Cashy.

Accyexplorer · 01-10-2015, 15:25

Jesus,I see this topic has made a few folk pretty cross....

....jacket please

yerself · 01-10-2015, 16:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman

theres clowns in every circus

Or put another way 'There's a prick in every bunch of roses'.

JCB · 01-10-2015, 16:43

Some have used this topic to get at the Muslims , but as has been pointed out on the thread Muslims are forbidden to have cremations , so they won't be at the crematorium .

The last two funerals I attended at the crematorium were of two friends who were Jehovah's Witnesses , and it did cross my mind at the time , knowing that they do not accept the sign of the cross , that it was a bit odd to have their funeral services conducted before a sign they had spent many hours preaching against .

Being a Christian I don't feel strongly about this issue of the cross . I have a crucifix in my home . It symbolises a lot to me .....everything really . I attend church on Sundays , and the cross is central to what occurs in the church .

But I can't see anything wrong with having a moveable cross at the crematorium , so that Christians can have the cross on display and secularists , humanists , atheists can have the cross not on display .

And as for this being a Christian country......well it isn't and never has been . A country cannot be Christian . Only a person can be Christian . A country might have 99% of its population committed Christians , but that doesn't make the country Christian . It can't do.....just as my dog , not being a person , can never be Christian .

Now if all of this makes me a PC nutter , well I have no problems with that . I am already a nutter for many , perhaps for most on this forum just for being a Christian ......believing all those "fairy tales" , "superstitions" , "brainwashed by all those paedophile men in dresses", etc , etc .

accyman · 01-10-2015, 16:49

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

May I suggest that you look at the threads on Hyndburn Chat on this subject. You will then see for yourself the outpourings of anger that you have generated.

he cant he got banned from the group

but there were plenty of other places on facebook he could have answered , plead his case , corrected the public and also twitter

i have no doubt he will ride the storm and get his way and the Christians of hyndburn will have to make do with a trinket crucifix and hope the people at the back can see it

not even sure if complaining to our MP will do any good but it could be worth a try

they kind of have us over a barrel if you cant afford a burial you have to use this crematorium or the green wheelie bin i assume

it wasnt that long ago a woman got sacked from heathrow because she wore a crucifix so dont really expect any help or respect from the people in authority.

Margaret Pilkington · 01-10-2015, 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by JCB

Some have used this topic to get at the Muslims , but as has been pointed out on the thread Muslims are forbidden to have cremations , so they won't be at the crematorium .

The last two funerals I attended at the crematorium were of two friends who were Jehovah's Witnesses , and it did cross my mind at the time , knowing that they do not accept the sign of the cross , that it was a bit odd to have their funeral services conducted before a sign they had spent many hours preaching against .

Being a Christian I don't feel strongly about this issue of the cross . I have a crucifix in my home . It symbolises a lot to me .....everything really . I attend church on Sundays , and the cross is central to what occurs in the church .

But I can't see anything wrong with having a moveable cross at the crematorium , so that Christians can have the cross on display and secularists , humanists , atheists can have the cross not on display .

And as for this being a Christian country......well it isn't and never has been . A country cannot be Christian . Only a person can be Christian . A country might have 99% of its population committed Christians , but that doesn't make the country Christian . It can't do.....just as my dog , not being a person , can never be Christian .

Now if all of this makes me a PC nutter , well I have no problems with that . I am already a nutter for many , perhaps for most on this forum just for being a Christian ......believing all those "fairy tales" , "superstitions" , "brainwashed by all those paedophile men in dresses", etc , etc .

I take your point and I don't think you are a nutter.
Whatever gets you through the night...is fine by me.
Faith is an admirable attribute.

When I said it was a Christian country what I really meant was a country that has a strong Christian past, christian values......and that the majority of the population follow the tenets of Christianity even if they deny the faith for themselves.
Many people are embarrassed to admit that they have a faith on which they can lean...some will only find a faith when they find difficulty.

I consider myself chastened and will make my post clearer next time......by saying what I mean.

hyndburner · 01-10-2015, 18:22

Why would anyone be offended by a cross?

If you are not a Christian, it will mean nothing to you so just treat it as a wall decoration.

Morecambe Ex Pat · 01-10-2015, 18:41

Pandering to the whims of the PC brigade just turns the whole thing into a farce.
Why go to all the bother of removing the cross? If a funeral party is so anti Christian then simply cover it over with a sheet.
I suspect that most non Christians attending a service at the crem wouldn't take a lot of notice of a cross on the wall and certainly wouldn't be offended by it's presence..

g jones · 01-10-2015, 19:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

You do surprise me, I thought Ken was one of the more "balanced" of the labour luvvie lefties ........ Aye well! You live & learn.

Explain minorities?

g jones · 01-10-2015, 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morecambe Ex Pat

Pandering to the whims of the PC brigade just turns the whole thing into a farce.
Why go to all the bother of removing the cross? If a funeral party is so anti Christian then simply cover it over with a sheet.
I suspect that most non Christians attending a service at the crem wouldn't take a lot of notice of a cross on the wall and certainly wouldn't be offended by it's presence..

Non believers on the last census were the majority of people in Hyndburn & fastest growing group of people.