Death of sex change teacher

[Neil]

Originally Posted by susie123

She might have had the female genes from birth but they may not have been apparent. It does happen.

Yes it does. I have had children with 2 women, if I decided that I was really a woman would you think I may have had female genes from birth?

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Neil, just read that again, I didn't say something 'wrong'.
You made that assumption.

I do apologise for that assumption

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

I just said that these people who are transgender have their brains wired differently.....differently doesn't mean wrong...it means different.

Different to what? Normal?

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

I happened to be listening to Radio4's Today in Parliament last night, and heard Graham Jones speak in the Commons about how the press had hounded her.

Maybe he'd like to comment on his own local newspapers role in this tragedy.

Write Your Adventures Down: Here There be Monstering

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Neil

I don't wish to insult anyone's memory but I do not agree that surgery can change gender. Gender is down to genetics x and y and all that genetic stuff.

Its not a as simple as that Neil, far from it, its obvious that although X wanted to be Y, or in other words the wrong body was teamed up with the wrong mind, think most of us can say there but for the grace of god go I

[susie123]

Originally Posted by Neil

Yes it does. I have had children with 2 women, if I decided that I was really a woman would you think I may have had female genes from birth?

This is not a copout, all I will say is that genetics is more complicated than it may appear.

[susie123]

If anyone is interested, I found this series broadcast on Channel 4 last year to be interesting and informative, without sensationalising at all.

My Transsexual Summer - Series 1 - Channel 4

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by Neil

Different to what? Normal?

No, different is just that, different...as in being left handed is different from being right handed.

You can have a female brain in a male body and these people recognise that they are 'different'....(not abnormal) from an early age.

Wasn't there a school child who was recently diagnosed with gender dysphoria(that is the medical terminology for this condition)...biologically a boy, but mentally a girl?...Now being schooled as a girl.

[Less]

Whatever the gender, we are talking about the death of a human being, none of us, (i'm sure even Neil will agree), are perfect, surely this was a person loved by those that knew them.
Whatever took her from this world should be treated with sympathy, who can say how, why, or when this person started to feel different from what the superior amongst us call the 'norm', but I suspect she went through hell many times until making such a decision as to change gender, then went through hell once more IF she did take the lonely route of suicide.
We don't need her to be criticised any further she is no longer in pain of any kind, I hope those that loved her in life will be allowed to grieve for her in death.

I used the terms her and she, because that was the persons choice can any of you really imagine what she went through to make such decisions?

[Margaret Pilkington]

Well said Less.

[lindsay ormerod]

Daily Mail: Sack Richard Littlejohn | SumOfUs

Lucy had the full support of the staff and head teacher,you can make your feelings known about the idiot that is Littlejohn on the above link.

[mobertol]

Originally Posted by Neil

You're right, you will have to wait until the newspapers report about it after the inquest.



Now you are putting words in my mouth. I never said either sex was inferior to the other. Please don't forget though that we are talking about a man who wanted to be a woman and not a woman.

I don't like to put the horse before the cart -ever -it is part of my "scientific" or for those who know me well, "peacekeeping", for want of a better word, nature.
As to inferior- or not, with respect to the "female" type brain -your inference was that it was in some way mentally ill to wish to be so -I quote "If you are like me and think he must have had some sort of mental illness to want to be a woman" !! Hmmmmm!
There are those who appear to be male and are brought up to respect the "ideal" of that state, who in fact are quite the oposite. Nature is surprising in it's variants from that which we deem to be the norm -so much so that there is actually no "norm", just a range of semblances and behaviours. One thing we all have in common is that we are human beings -in all our beauty and with all our many failings...

[Neil]

Originally Posted by mobertol

As to inferior- or not, with respect to the "female" type brain -your inference was that it was in some way mentally ill to wish to be so -I quote "If you are like me and think he must have had some sort of mental illness to want to be a woman" !! Hmmmmm!

It was not an inference it was a statement but did not mean I think female are inferior. I would have said the same if we were talking about a woman who wanted to be a man.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Less

Whatever the gender, we are talking about the death of a human being, none of us, (i'm sure even Neil will agree), are perfect, surely this was a person loved by those that knew them.
Whatever took her from this world should be treated with sympathy, who can say how, why, or when this person started to feel different from what the superior amongst us call the 'norm', but I suspect she went through hell many times until making such a decision as to change gender, then went through hell once more IF she did take the lonely route of suicide.
We don't need her to be criticised any further she is no longer in pain of any kind, I hope those that loved her in life will be allowed to grieve for her in death.

I used the terms her and she, because that was the persons choice can any of you really imagine what she went through to make such decisions?

Hit the nail on the head Less

[MargaretR]

Transgender issues aren't rare. You just don't hear about them often, because those affected rarely have the courage to change to , what they feel, is a lifestyle which expresses their true identity. I met some of them during my career.

Some people are assigned the wrong gender at birth due to the size of sex organs not being within what is considered the 'norm'.

Others can be hermaphrodite or 'intersex' (they are not the same)

Wikipedia pages explain these phenomenon.

[accyman]

the only reason why this story got picked up on by the press is because kids were involved and contary to belief just because someone has concerns about a man returning to young childrens lives a few weeks later as a woman it dosnt make you homophobic,transgenderists or whatever it is people want to call you if you dare raise any concerns at all.Of course this man had the backing of the school can you imagine the court case that would follow if the school dared to suggest he sought employment elswhere where the kids wouldnt have known him as a man.

im not saying he should have left teaching but perhaps this wouldnt have even been news if he had simply started a new job to go along with his new life and new sex.A sex swap fella worked as a tutor at Huddersfield university for many years and you probbably dont know that because it didnt make the press.It didnt make the press because he/she wasnt dealing with young children.Sadly he/she also took his own life by throwing himself off the university top floor because he/she had issues.

if my son had been attending mary mags when this was going on i would have pulled him out of that school and relocated him.Not because i am homophobic or a barbarian thug but because i dont want my junior school aged child exposed to the ins and outs of transgenerism just yet in his life and if this had happened when i attended that school i have no doubt my parents would have got me out fo there also.Mind you when i was there the head teacher dissappeared after a swap incident.He swapped his teaching carreer for a prison carreer after stealing a coach from rigbys coach travel and tried using it for his own firm haydock coaches or something close to that

so just to be clear im not homophobic and i have no objections to someone whos had a sex swap teaching.My only issue is that he could have remained in teaching but maybe not such a good idea to stay at teh school where he was known to the kids as a man.

as for teh reporter - sure try getting him sacked if you must but to be fair please target every other reporter that ran this story also