Did Graham Jones do the right thing?

[garinda]

Originally Posted by mobertol

Well said , Less,
Don't be reluctant when you ask though. My mum grew up on Exchange St. went to Springhill school and the connection with Kashmir is apparent and obvious?!

You'd have thought now that we're Hyndburn International Council, they'd have used the world stage to condemn the attrocious human rights abuses, carried out in other parts of the world.

Child slavery, the sexual exploitation of minors, the rights for female equality, the torture and killing of political opponents, in say....Pakistan.

Not a word.

So Far.

Perhaps they'll tackle the issue at the next full meeting of our Internationalist Council.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Of course thats not it!

You caught me on the hop, unlike you before a council meeting, I don't have an agenda in front of me with a list of possible questions that I can prepare answers for.

I suggest you go do a little bit of research and educate yourself just like the rest of us plebs have to do

Or easier still, he could just listen to what Graham Jones says.

After all, he does know best.

[Guinness]

And where do you think he gets this information to make judgements? Could it be the advisors with their own agenda? Could it be he is simply listening to EdM?.... he's spending a lot of time on the scrap metal issue and goings on at Ewood, he can't be everywhere?

Go do some research, have a look at the issues, he's wrong and he's let us down big style on this one

[Ken Moss]

Originally Posted by Guinness

And where do you think he gets this information to make judgements? Could it be the advisors with their own agenda? Could it be he is simply listening to EdM?.... he's spending a lot of time on the scrap metal issue and goings on at Ewood, he can't be everywhere?

Go do some research, have a look at the issues, he's wrong and he's let us down big style on this one

I'm asking you first off, you said you had all the facts.

If you don't then that somewhat proves my point.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Guinness

And where do you think he gets this information to make judgements? Could it be the advisors with their own agenda? Could it be he is simply listening to EdM?.... he's spending a lot of time on the scrap metal issue and goings on at Ewood, he can't be everywhere?

Go do some research, have a look at the issues, he's wrong and he's let us down big style on this one

He has a finely tuned, and very sharp political mind.

You only have to read a few of his old posts, to witness that.

http://www.accringtonweb.com/forum/s...=2609658&pp=25

This is one of my own favourite examples, of this keen political intellect.

Originally Posted by g jones

The problem for the Germans is the Mediterranean nations devalue the Deutchmark.

The problems for the Greeks as I said to Bone and Nuttall, if your a Greek with a €100k and someone whispers Drachma, you shift your Euros to a bank outside of Greece. The question is if everyone thinks the same, what happens to the Drachma and the Greek economy, Greek banks? Can any of them survive? Will the position not be cataclysmic compared to where they are now? A run on the Drachma that would resemble a run on the Zimbadwean currency?

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

I'm asking you first off, you said you had all the facts.

If you don't then that somewhat proves my point.

Actually I said 'full' facts, and like I said in my previous post you are simply picking on one word in a fifty word rant.

Of course I don't have the 'full' facts or even 'all' the facts that would be ridiculous and presumptious. You are continually picking at one word in a cogent argument to deflect the fact that you are sheepishly following the party line without makiing a single argument against the bulk of my post.

Or to paraphrase your idol '95% of my comments are apparently inarguable'

[Ken Moss]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Actually I said 'full' facts, and like I said in my previous post you are simply picking on one word in a fifty word rant.

Of course I don't have the 'full' facts or even 'all' the facts that would be ridiculous and presumptious. You are continually picking at one word in a cogent argument to deflect the fact that you are sheepishly following the party line without makiing a single argument against the bulk of my post.

Or to paraphrase your idol '95% of my comments are apparently inarguable'

No, I'm just trying to make the point that on an EU referendum there would probably be a lot of people who claim to know their facts when in reality there are a few sizeable holes in their knowledge.

I am one of them.

I am all for a referendum but it would be dependent on all GB residents knowing everything they were voting on.

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

No, I'm just trying to make the point that on an EU referendum there would probably be a lot of people who claim to know their facts when in reality there are a few sizeable holes in their knowledge.

I am one of them.

I am all for a referendum but it would be dependent on all GB residents knowing everything they were voting on.

Not having that argument either..how many people vote in a general election with those constraints? Anyone on here know the manifestos of the big 3? Do you Ken, honestly?

I really think that the majority of people should be asked 'in or out' based on their own interpretations, do your party political broadcasts, have your debates etc.. but for the love of mike, let the people speak on this one

[Ken Moss]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Not having that argument either..how many people vote in a general election with those constraints? Anyone on here know the manifestos of the big 3? Do you Ken, honestly?

I really think that the majority of people should be asked 'in or out' based on their own interpretations, do your party political broadcasts, have your debates etc.. but for the love of mike, let the people speak on this one

Agreed, but come on, it's a biggie.

Party politics aside, if we're going to have big referendums we should know EVERYTHING.

And I'm not talking about that silly AV vote in 2011 either....

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

No, I'm just trying to make the point that on an EU referendum there would probably be a lot of people who claim to know their facts when in reality there are a few sizeable holes in their knowledge.

I am one of them.

I am all for a referendum but it would be dependent on all GB residents knowing everything they were voting on.

Even your little chum agreed a referendum would settle the E.U. membership question 'democratically'.

Before shortly voting to deny the people of Hyndburn their democratic right, to have a say whether we want membership, or not.

Something we've never, ever been asked as a people.

The E.U. didn't even exist, the last time we had a referendum, on whether we wanted continued economic ties with mainland Europe

The arguments, for, and against, would have happened later.

If democracy, rather than blind, party political loyalty had triumphed.

Pointless, mulling it over now.

Greater minds than your's, have decided the question for you.

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

Agreed, but come on, it's a biggie.

Party politics aside, if we're going to have big referendums we should know EVERYTHING.

And I'm not talking about that silly AV vote in 2011 either....

Yes we should, and in these days of instant research, communication etc.. we can find out for ourselves the pro's and con's of most arguments within an hour. Most politicians have still to realise that the majority can't be hoodwinked anymore by press clippings and hype.

Sorry that I appear argumentative but the AV vote was a good idea screwed up by the question and the timing, which I guess brings us full circle.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Guinness

You know what else makes me laugh hysterically...my old man was a card carrying paid up member of the Labour party until the day he died, he thought Labour were for the ordinary guy in the street and tried to educate me into that way of thinking.

Yet half the current tories want out of Europe, but Labour were whipped in and helped swing the vote because of threats, and one of the whippers was our own MP, who was not in the house that day because I watched the whole sorry debacle on parliament TV

Why weren't you representing me Mr. Jones..why were you toeing the party line when you knew that the majority of your voters wanted out?

I'm not totally sure but being a whip he can't join in the debate, I'm sure I'll be corrected if I'm wrong

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Ken Moss

I don't 'follow' him, I just trust him to make decent judgements on issues that he knows about. I don't know about the Europe situation anywhere near as well as he does and from hearing him talk he knows his stuff.

Why would I know about the EU inside out? I don't need to as yet.

In other words if Ed says jump Gramham ask how high

[Less]

Originally Posted by jaysay

In other words if Ed says jump Gramham ask how high

Unfortunately that is the same across all flavours of politics isn't it?

The meek may inherit the Earth but until then, they had better all do as they are darned well told.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Less

Unfortunately that is the same across all flavours of politics isn't it?

The meek may inherit the Earth but until then, they had better all do as they are darned well told.

Ya Less but if you notice this thread is entitled "Did Graham Jones do the right thing", not do all MPs do as they are told, and there was one person who didn't kowtow to the party rulers that was Ken Hargreaves, he was a true man of the people went to Westminster to represent the people of Hyndburn and was one of the very few Tory MPs who did not support the Community Charge (Poll Tax) because he knew it wasn't the right thing for the people who voted for him