Downloading Music. Is it stealing? - Page 4

panther · 05-03-2007, 16:20

Id rather go out and buy the CD, dont like downloading!

jambutty · 05-03-2007, 17:24

When you buy a CD shakermaker you own the disk but you do not own the music on it. So if you allow tracks off the CD to be downloaded via this P2P thing you as well as the downloader are in breach of the copyright act and the P2P site for aiding and abetting. The music industry has every right to get the P2P sites closed down.

The sleeve notes and cover artwork are also copyrighted so copying those is illegal. Unless you pay for them of course or there is a note to state that all copyright claims have been waived. An unlikely scenario.

I get back to my original premise – if it were your work that was being copied and you were losing revenue your view would be different.

No one is arguing that we haven’t been overcharged for records etc for decades, we have, but it doesn’t come into the equation in spite of people trying to put it in. “Milud, I made a copy of the CD for my friend because the record industry have been ripping me off for years with their inflated prices.” Try it as an excuse in a court of law and it won’t hold water.

Every illegal download is a POTENTIAL sale lost Cyfr. If someone wants something badly enough they will go and buy it, inflated prices and all. Some will not.

If my reasoning is the same as RIAA’s then they have got it right within the law.

Quote:

Digital Cameras are used to record SOME films in cinemas illegaly, should we be banning digital cameras??

I assume that you really mean digital camcorders. That’s a nonsense comparison, but yes if you also ban CD and DVD recorders. It’s not the hardware that is being used it is the purpose that the hardware is being used for that is the contentious issue.

I accept that no matter what arguments are put forward you will not agree with them until you stand on the other side of the coin. So let’s just agree to disagree.

mickmc · 05-03-2007, 17:41

Ok - what about songs you can no longer get on CD's, even compilations, especially from 1 hit wonders and the like. You want it, but can't buy it any more !!! so whats the arguments then in these cases ?? - still don't download ?? - I don't think so - I'd download it - what would you do???

cashman · 05-03-2007, 17:46

thats a good point mickmc i have a vast collection of music, and most of the stuff i require thesedays if definately unavailable to buy from any shop.so if i manage to snare it on the net. i will.

lindsay ormerod · 05-03-2007, 18:28

Bet you can't wait for my answer eh? Guess what,I don't download,I consider it stealing,I will own up to having a copied disc of a cd I couldn't get anywhere,someone burnt it for me and it's such bad quality I haven't listened to it twice !
If you want to have no cd shop ,then fine ,carry on copying. I will not be joining you.

Uncle Mick · 05-03-2007, 19:15

I don`t download because, A ; I hav`nt a clue how to do it and B ; I dont want to listen to my music on a computer. I still frequent record shops and also buy direct from artists websites. This can sometimes be the major way an artist earns his income and they are usually thankful that people are still out there supporting them.
The problem people have with record companies is that they keep introducing new formats to play music. The old ones become obsolete and we all pay again for music the expense of which was written off long ago.
When I first got my CD player, I vowed never to buy anything I already had on LP, and you can guess the rest.

garinda · 05-03-2007, 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by jambutty

My musical tastes didn’t progress past about 1985.

1985? Why then as a cut off point?

Come on tell us, admit you were a Duranie.

entwisi · 05-03-2007, 21:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle Mick

I don`t download because, A ; I hav`nt a clue how to do it and B ; I dont want to listen to my music on a computer. I still frequent record shops and also buy direct from artists websites. This can sometimes be the major way an artist earns his income and they are usually thankful that people are still out there supporting them.
The problem people have with record companies is that they keep introducing new formats to play music. The old ones become obsolete and we all pay again for music the expense of which was written off long ago.
When I first got my CD player, I vowed never to buy anything I already had on LP, and you can guess the rest.

Just cause you download it on your PC doesn't mean you have to listen to it on the PC. You can burn audio discs for use in teh HIFI/Car/etc or transfer to an MP3 player like an iPod or there are even boxes that will stream teh audio over a wifi network to any music system

Likewise with changing formats, copyright wise as long as you own the original you can transfer/backup to any other format. e.g.. those old 78's can legally be ripped to MP3 for your iPod as long as you keep teh 78s.

having said that I don't download stuff, the P2P networks ar full of fake/virus/trojans which will punish you if your security isn't 100%.

shakermaker · 05-03-2007, 22:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by jambutty

I get back to my original premise – if it were your work that was being copied and you were losing revenue your view would be different.

I can only answer for myself but no, it wouldn't. I'm not a careerist in the slightest.

At the end of the day if people want to borrow/copy/download music they will find a way. EMI or Sony can never stop that.

WillowTheWhisp · 05-03-2007, 22:44

Well I'm just glad of P2P which helped me find things I would never otherwise have heard of or bought. How can I buy something if I don't even know it exists? Yes, I shop for them at Music Zone.

WillowTheWhisp · 05-03-2007, 22:48

Quote:

Originally Posted by mickmc

Ok - what about songs you can no longer get on CD's, even compilations, especially from 1 hit wonders and the like. You want it, but can't buy it any more !!! so whats the arguments then in these cases ?? - still don't download ?? - I don't think so - I'd download it - what would you do???

I used to have a lot of stuff on vinyl which doesn't exist on CD. I lent almost my whole collection to someone and never got them back - he has done a bunk. How do I replace those? It would be impossible even if I could afford it. If anyone had the LPs and would lend them to me I would copy them to tape. Does that make me a criminal? I borrowed some language records from Mez to copy to tape to help Emz with her pronunciation. I never considered that would be illegal. The records seem very old.

garinda · 05-03-2007, 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by shakermaker

I can only answer for myself but no, it wouldn't. I'm not a careerist in the slightest.

At the end of the day if people want to borrow/copy/download music they will find a way. EMI or Sony can never stop that.

So if you were a painter say, a good one at that, you'd be quite happy for people to print copies of your work and sell them?

Leaving you starving in your garret, without seeing a penny of the cash that people were prepared to pay for your work?

cashman · 06-03-2007, 00:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by shakermaker

I can only answer for myself but no, it wouldn't. I'm not a careerist in the slightest.

At the end of the day if people want to borrow/copy/download music they will find a way. EMI or Sony can never stop that.

i thought like that---at your age shaker.

ah the innocence of youth.

cashman · 06-03-2007, 00:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by lindsay ormerod

Bet you can't wait for my answer eh? Guess what,I don't download,I consider it stealing,I will own up to having a copied disc of a cd I couldn't get anywhere,someone burnt it for me and it's such bad quality I haven't listened to it twice !
If you want to have no cd shop ,then fine ,carry on copying. I will not be joining you.

bought a cd at your place last week linds, but if stuff is not available i will download and much of the old stuff aint. perhaps thats part of the reason shops close,which sure as hell aint your fault or mine.

steeljack · 06-03-2007, 00:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

So if you were a painter say, a good one at that, you'd be quite happy for people to print copies of your work and sell them?

Leaving you starving in your garret, without seeing a penny of the cash that people were prepared to pay for your work?

that was the point i was trying to make in an earlier post , an artist (painter /scluptor) is only paid once at the first sale , any future sale of the item the artist loses out .
If i buy a painting and make multiple copies and either sell them or give them away its my business not the original producers, should be the same with music