Face covering - Page 3

DtheP47 · 18-09-2013, 13:11

Well Margaret, forcing a woman not to wear a veil, burka or niqab contravenes a woman's right to choose in the self same way that forcing her to wear one does; both cases represent an attempt to control the woman and dictate how she should express herself.
Wrong on both counts in my book.

cashman · 18-09-2013, 13:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by DtheP47

Well Margaret, forcing a woman not to wear a veil, burka or niqab contravenes a woman's right to choose in the self same way that forcing her to wear one does; both cases represent an attempt to control the woman and dictate how she should express herself.
Wrong on both counts in my book.

What book would that be D? "Billys Weekly Liar"

Margaret Pilkington · 18-09-2013, 13:31

I am firmly of the opinion that many women in this country do not choose to wear the niqab in the way that you and I exercise choice...but that they are coerced into wearing the garment to satisfy the wishes of their menfolk and the local community(You have no idea how powerful a muslim community can be, against someone who wants to do things differently)
These women(I believe) are misled into thinking that the muslim religion requires this of them.......but in muslim countries,if this were the case, then all women would be required to dress in this manner...and clearly this isn't the case.

It is wrong to allow/encourage the social acceptance of such an unsocial and intimidating garment...and it has no place in schools, colleges, courts or in a medical setting.(for obvious reasons)
But it appears that you agree with making women invisible, by citing that it is their choice, without calling into question whether it is or not.

It is a medieval practice aimed at the subjugation of women by men.
It implies that women are sluts and that men cannot control their sexual appetities.

That is my last word on this subject as I think that you and I will have to agree to disagree on this.

DtheP47 · 18-09-2013, 13:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman

What book would that be D? "Billys Weekly Liar"

Memories Ol

it was packed with great gags such as: “A football scout from a Midland club is interested in Dan Druff from Ayr.”
They don't write them like that anymore............. except in here.

Eric · 18-09-2013, 13:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

You need no special building to exercise any religious belief...you can pray anywhere - if you want to.

Matthew 18:20: "For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them."

Or, I guess, you can just do it on your own.

Neil · 18-09-2013, 14:50

Just saw some ladies (I assume they were ladies) in the full body burkas picking their kids up from school. I don't think they should be allowed in school dressed like that. How do they know who it is picking up the kids?

Less · 18-09-2013, 15:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil

Just saw some ladies (I assume they were ladies) in the full body burkas picking their kids up from school. I don't think they should be allowed in school dressed like that. How do they know who it is picking up the kids?

Smell? Perhaps if your sight is limited from birth by a veil the only way to recognise your mother would be enhanced?

DtheP47 · 18-09-2013, 15:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Less

Smell? Perhaps if your sight is limited from birth by a veil the only way to recognise your mother would be enhanced?

More likely the association with the Beamer/Audi/Merc with blacked out windows their mum uses on the school run Less.

Sunflower49 · 18-09-2013, 15:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil

Just saw some ladies (I assume they were ladies) in the full body burkas picking their kids up from school. I don't think they should be allowed in school dressed like that. How do they know who it is picking up the kids?

This is one of my main issues with the subject.

I disagree with the subordination of women also, there's a lot of grey areas in that minefield, but from a straightforward, for the health of society point of view, people should not be allowed to cover their faces.

I have to remove my motorcycle helmet to enter a shop/bank and wouldn't dream of not doing. It's a no-brainer really.

DtheP47 · 18-09-2013, 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by sugarmouse0707

This is one of my main issues with the subject.

I disagree with the subordination of women also, there's a lot of grey areas in that minefield, but from a straightforward, for the health of society point of view, people should not be allowed to cover their faces.

I have to remove my motorcycle helmet to enter a shop/bank and wouldn't dream of not doing. It's a no-brainer really.

I've just spent a bit of time today in London and have seen many a Japanese tourist wearing their anti-flu masks, they are tolerated and welcomed in all the major stores to shop till they drop as of course are ladies with burquas and such like.
"Funny Old World eh?"

jaysay · 18-09-2013, 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by DtheP47

People should in principle have the right to wear whatever they want and to express their religious beliefs. We live in an age of rights and freedoms enshrined in law. As long as it's a genuine expression of belief and not something imposed by social or familial pressures.

Sorry Dave that's an utter load of crap and I think you know it, like others have said you can't go into a bank post office in the dock in court wearing a crash helmet , so why should we bow to people wearing full face veils when they attend these places

Less · 18-09-2013, 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by DtheP47

I've just spent a bit of time today in London and have seen many a Japanese tourist wearing their anti-flu masks, they are tolerated and welcomed in all the major stores to shop till they drop as of course are ladies with burquas and such like.
"Funny Old World eh?"

Yes, it is a funny old World, women being stoned to death because they were raped.

Obviously they must have been putting themselves out there, it couldn't be the blokes fault. He wouldn't have done it if she hadn't worked him up to such a frenzy, (I'll use that excuse if ever I'm put before a Judge, he will surely be senile enough to believe me).

jaysay · 18-09-2013, 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by DtheP47

Did you never go to a wedding where the bride wore a veil Margaret???

Ya Dave but they always remove it before they say I DO, sadly

Less · 18-09-2013, 17:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by sugarmouse0707

I disagree with the subordination of women.

I would also disagree, but let's be honest, they really do need to be cared for and steered away from any real form of thinking by their immature Husbands.

DtheP47 · 18-09-2013, 18:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

Sorry Dave that's an utter load of crap and I think you know it, like others have said you can't go into a bank post office in the dock in court wearing a crash helmet , so why should we bow to people wearing full face veils when they attend these places

John, the recent rumblings and rantings about wearing the veil in the court when giving evidence provides a clear example of the need to balance competing considerations and find a suitable compromise. The same applies in the school context where individual needs must be balanced against other important factors such as the school community, the ethos of the school and the impact on the wider community. This is not a case where one-size-fits-all will produce the right response.
In a free society, the state must allow citizens to do as they please as long as it doesn't harm others, and to resolve any problems that arise through negotiation and informal give and take, rather than legislating on the minutiae of everyday life in my book.