German history between the wars

WillowTheWhisp · 08-01-2008, 12:12

I was almost tempted to post this in Aleks's thread where he is selling a copy of Mein Kampf but it would have been too much of a thread hijack so I decided to start a whole new topic.

Hopefully you'll see this Aleks and having read Mein Kampf you may have some views on the matter.

It strikes me as odd how we so readily deplore Germany for invading Poland but very little is said (perhaps even less known) in this country about the French invasion of German territory between the wars.

How much did France's invasion of Bavaria in 1923 have a bearing on Hitler's subsequent actions? What was the aim? Would Bavaria have been an independant country or would it have become part of France?

It sort of puts the German occupation of France during WWII in a different light when you look at it from the point of view of things which transpired between the wars.

garinda · 08-01-2008, 12:44

I'm not saying you are wrong, but I didn't know the French invaded Bavaria in 1923, I always thought it was the coal rich region the Ruhr.(?)

In my opinion the draconian demands of the Treaty of Versailles, resulting in hyperinflation, and a poor national self image, created an ideal breeding ground for extremist parties. Though it was down to chance as to who, the left or the right, who would eventually seize power.

WillowTheWhisp · 08-01-2008, 13:42

You may well be right - my memory plays silly tricks on me. I should maybe have a bit of a Google. I thought that Bavaria was potentially going to break away from Germany and the French invasion played a part. I may have got my recollecting wires crossed. Thing is though, whichever bit it was which France fancied, we don't tend to hear about 'naughty France' creeping into other people's territory. We just tend to get the 'Germany was at it again' part.

garinda · 08-01-2008, 13:50

Hitler tried, and failed, to grab power in Bavaria in 1923, in the failed Beer Hall Putsch.

Perhaps you were thinking of that.

WillowTheWhisp · 08-01-2008, 14:03

Was that when he was imprisoned?

garinda · 08-01-2008, 15:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by WillowTheWhisp

Was that when he was imprisoned?

Yes, and whilst imprisoned wrote Mein Kampf.

I wrote the dissertation for my degree on the Weimar Republic, as seen through the works of Englishman Christopher Irsherwood. It was a fascinating time in history, as Germany for the first three decades of the twentieth century, had been one of the most liberal and free thinking countries in Europe, yet so easily turned to extremist politics, in my opinion because of the measures introduced by the Treaty of Versialles.

I had a wonderful summer in 1985, retracing Isherwood's journey. What I found saddest, fifty years on, and post-Nazi atocities, was how quickly seemingly liberal Germans were so racist towards the sizable Turkish community living there.

shakermaker · 08-01-2008, 18:16

All this stuff is really interesting to me, just a pity I don't have any time to do any personal reading & research with exams just around the corner. Really wish I'd have taken History at A-level. One day I'll come back to it.

steeljack · 08-01-2008, 18:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

I had a wonderful summer in 1985, retracing Isherwood's journey. What I found saddest, fifty years on, and post-Nazi atocities, was how quickly seemingly liberal Germans were so racist towards the sizable Turkish community living there.

I spend a couple of weeks in Germany every year and would disagree with your comment about Germans having a racist attitude towards the Turks , what I think you will find is a similar attitude to what some of the Brits have with the asian community in the UK ......"Why can't they just live the way we do" , a feeling of having their native culture overwhelmed .
Considering that Germany lost her overseas colonies at the end of WW1 most Germans now find 'people of colour' quite exotic and more of a curiosity , after having 50 odd years of liberal propaganda stuffed down their throats and being told how bad Germans are , three generations have grown up with a bit of a guilt complex about race issues . Any right wing (fascist) race problems are mainly confined to the former DDR states in the eastern parts where the NPD has it most support ,

garinda · 09-01-2008, 00:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by steeljack

I spend a couple of weeks in Germany every year and would disagree with your comment about Germans having a racist attitude towards the Turks , what I think you will find is a similar attitude to what some of the Brits have with the asian community in the UK ......"Why can't they just live the way we do" , a feeling of having their native culture overwhelmed .
Considering that Germany lost her overseas colonies at the end of WW1 most Germans now find 'people of colour' quite exotic and more of a curiosity , after having 50 odd years of liberal propaganda stuffed down their throats and being told how bad Germans are , three generations have grown up with a bit of a guilt complex about race issues . Any right wing (fascist) race problems are mainly confined to the former DDR states in the eastern parts where the NPD has it most support ,

Ok, it wasn't blatant racism. I was just suprised at the attitude of the people I met, who on the whole, were very liberal. I was working for a fashion magazine, for goodness sake!

At that time I would have been offended by anyone talking in derogatory terms about British Asians in the UK, ie: calling them by insulting names, over here stealing our jobs, benefiting from our welfare state, etc. They're the sort of attitudes I was suprised to find in Germany, regarding the Turkish community.

kestrelx · 14-01-2008, 17:58

Did you know that Hitler's real name was SCHICKELGRUBER. And after 1st World War Hitler spent some time in a mental hospital! Oh yes!

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