How'd you vote in an E.U. referendum?

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by g jones

Europe as it is now is very unsatisfactory and there needs to be change.

It is and there won't be. Manuel Barrosso and the pampered power brokers who run the EU will see to that. The "Britain must stay in and reform the EU" doesn't hold water. The whole impetus of the EU is towards more and more centralisation of powers in the drive towards a European superstate and Britain will be swept along with that.

Get the hell out I say, but that's only my opinion. I'm quite prepared to accept the verdict of the British people in a free and fair referendum. Unfortunately, the major parties don't have a similar belief in democracy.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

I'm quite prepared to accept the verdict of the British people in a free and fair referendum. Unfortunately, the major parties don't have a similar belief in democracy.

Exactly.

I wouldn't vote to stay in.

But if the greater majority of Britons did, I'd accept that decision. Even if I didn't like it.

That's democracy.

Since we haven't been allowed a referendum on whether we want E.U. membership, that certainly isn't democratic, and is in urgent need for redress.

[cashman]

Democracy............thats a laugh, its only a factor if it happens to suit the party in power,at any given time, yer all clutching at straws if yeh think yeh will obtain it!

[garinda]

Originally Posted by cashman

Democracy............thats a laugh, its only a factor if it happens to suit the party in power,at any given time, yer all clutching at straws if yeh think yeh will obtain it!

I'm quite aware the chances of being allowed a referendum are very slim.

But the consequences for this country will be so terrible, that it's worth fighting for.

On the plus side, anger and resentment is growing every day, nationwide.

So mainstream political parties can carry on chosing to ignore this issue at their peril.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by cashman

Democracy............thats a laugh

You turning into MargaretR?



Yes, democracy is relative.

But at the moment, compared to much of the world, we do have the right to vote (though not in an E.U. referendum), and to freely speak our mind, so we ain't got it too bad.

[Margaret Pilkington]

This argument/discussion just goes round and round in cirlces.

The EU want Britain to sit down and shut up...like a good little nation.
They have no intention of changing anything.......their inaction of the the fate of the Euro (tinkering at the edges doesn't constitute action in my book) shows this.
Maybe the problem is because it is lead by a committee of unruly monkeys.
Anyway, whatever. I'm done. I have said my piece and that's me........ finished.

[Tealeaf]

I see that the H of C's has come round to having a debate on whether or not to hold a referendum on EU membership. According to the Tory party in-house magazine - the Torygraph - Cameron has already issued a three-liner so that his back benchers go through the 'No' lobby. Read it all here:

Conservatives ordered to vote against EU referendum - Telegraph

Nowt unexpected there, then. But there is no information yet on what Red Ed has instructed his troops to do. My question therefore, to Graham is this: Given the local feelings about the UK's continuing membership of the EU and your postings within this thread, will you go into the 'Aye' lobby?

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Tealeaf

I see that the H of C's has come round to having a debate on whether or not to hold a referendum on EU membership. According to the Tory party in-house magazine - the Torygraph - Cameron has already issued a three-liner so that his back benchers go through the 'No' lobby. Read it all here:

Conservatives ordered to vote against EU referendum - Telegraph

Nowt unexpected there, then. But there is no information yet on what Red Ed has instructed his troops to do. My question therefore, to Graham is this: Given the local feelings about the UK's continuing membership of the EU and your postings within this thread, will you go into the 'Aye' lobby?

No matter what people think about the pros and cons of the E.U., there is an overwhelming desire for local people to be allowed their say on this issue.

We wait with interest whether our M.P.'s vote reflects this.

[Gordon Booth]

Originally Posted by g jones

The EU transaction tax would apply to all financial transactions in Europe equally.

Come on Graham. Are you being naive or political? Or both?
70% of all financial transactions in the EU are conducted in London. So one country out of the 27 in the EU will pay 70% of that tax.Lets hope the other 26 can afford to pay the other 30% between them.
Result- the end of London as Europes financial centre. Whatever you think of our bankers their companies provide the bulk of the tax paid by companies in this country. Remove that and we'll rank alongside Romania( if we try very hard).

[Wynonie Harris]

It'll be interesting to see how all our MPs vote.

As far as I'm concerned, anyone who votes against a referendum does not believe in democracy and I hope the voters will remember this come the next election.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Tealeaf

I see that the H of C's has come round to having a debate on whether or not to hold a referendum on EU membership. According to the Tory party in-house magazine - the Torygraph - Cameron has already issued a three-liner so that his back benchers go through the 'No' lobby. Read it all here:

Conservatives ordered to vote against EU referendum - Telegraph

Nowt unexpected there, then. But there is no information yet on what Red Ed has instructed his troops to do. My question therefore, to Graham is this: Given the local feelings about the UK's continuing membership of the EU and your postings within this thread, will you go into the 'Aye' lobby?

Good question. Also maybe hear from the local Conservative Riding Assocn., or whatever they call it. I've been following this thread with interest and I do think that the local MP should come up clean and clear with his position ... and justifications for it. Not the views of his party; his personal views.

[Tealeaf]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

It'll be interesting to see how all our MPs vote.

As far as I'm concerned, anyone who votes against a referendum does not believe in democracy and I hope the voters will remember this come the next election.

It's interesting to note that one country that regularly employs the mechanism of a referendum is Switzerland - a country which is also the second largest financial centre within Europe after the UK. It's also one of the wealthiest countries, alongside Norway and Liechtenstein, in Europe. These three countries - alongside Iceland (which ain't really in Europe anyway) make up the European Free Trade Area. Guess what? The UK was once a member of EFTA but we knifed 'em in the back in order to join the Common Market back in '72.

EFTA members are part of the European Economic Area, which encompasses the EU; the difference is, they are fully sovereign states with full control over their borders, natural resources and most importantly, their democratic sovereignty. All of those we have now lost within the UK. But it's not to late. The first duty of any MP -even before his obligations to his constituents - is to be a loyal servant of his country and as such I can see no other alternative now for any MP who is not a traitor to vote 'Yes' in the forthcoming division for a referendum on Britains exit from this shambles called the EU - or the Fourth Reich, as it should now be properly called.

[garinda]

Just watched this.

BBC News - Panorama - The secret lives of Britain's child beggars

Heartbreaking.

Heartbreaking for the children who are trafficked into the U.K. by their parents.

To beg, and take advantage of the generous legitimate social benefits available to them in the U.K., and exploit with ease those same benefits fraudulently. Before driving back to their luxurious palaces in Romania, in their expensive Mercs, all funded thanks to the British tax payer.

More heartbreaking is that in all the years I lived in London, in the eighties, nineties, and early noughties, the number of professional beggars working in London you could count on the fingers of two hands.

My, how things have changed, in the few short years Romania has been a member of the E.U., with it's open border policies.

The next expansion of the E.U. will most likely include countries like Turkey, with it's 75 million population.

Shall we open a book, guessing how long before they become full E.U. members?

Three? Five? Seven years?

...and please don't anyone dare try and label me as racist, because I oppose the madness that ensues from the U.K.'s membership of the E.U.

I was actively fighting real racism and prejudice from the age of fourteen.

Not the lily-livered, liberal apologists' version of perceived racism, that's so popular today within the ruling elite, who favour 'positive discrimination', and which ironically is actually racist by it's very concept.

This issue is frightening, not just because what's happening, and will continue to happen, but because of the inevitable rise in support there'll be for extremist political groups. Supported by ordinary people who feel so disenfranchised, and let down by mainstream political parties, who they feel have sold them down the river.

In years to come you can forget 'Rivers of blood', this will make Bosnia look like a tea party. The seas around Britain will be red with blood that's been shed.

[Mancie]

Cor blimey Garinda.. you churned up about 80% of the posts on this thread and it looks like you are hell bent on pulling out.. I thought I might give you a promo vid in any upcoming campaign you may make for the pull out from Europe

[Wrighty]

I e-mailed Mr Graham Jones about the EU referendum debate on Monday & told him the majority of people want a vote to leave the EU , Seeing as we are supposed to live in a democratic country the vote should be left for the people to decide whether we are in or out .. Here is his reply


Thanks for your email about a proposed referendum on Britain’s membership of the European Union.



Britain currently faces tough economic challenges, with high inflation, rising unemployment and stagnant growth.



Indeed, in the last nine months the UK economy has not grown at all. Over the last year only Japan has grown more slowly in the G7 and only Greece, Portugal, Denmark and Hungary have grown more slowly in the EU. One in five young people are out of work and there are now more women unemployed than any time since 1988.



It is in that context that we make judgements about Britain’s membership of the European Union. Labour is not opposed to having referenda on European questions when a Government seeks to make a major change to Britain’s relationship with the European Union. For example, it was a Labour Government in 1975 that held instituted a referendum on Britain’s membership of the European Union and Labour believes that if any future government wanted to try and take Britain into the euro, they would need to win the British people’s backing in a referendum.



But it is Labour’s assessment, shared by the leaders of all the main parties in the UK, that it is in Britain’s interest to remain members of the European Union.



Membership of the European Union is vital to Britain’s growth and prosperity:



· 3.5 million UK jobs are linked directly or indirectly to UK trade with the rest of the European Union according to official analysis

· European markets account for half of the UK’s overall exports of goods and services

· Eight out of the UK’s ten main export markets are in the European Union



We did not seek a mandate for this referendum at the last election and we do not wish to leave the European Union now.



We do not believe the case for this referendum has been made and believe it would create uncertainty that could put at risk investment in the UK.



Labour’s position is that Britain should be focussed on jobs and growth, not cutting ourselves off from major export markets that British jobs depend on. It is campaigning for that jobs and growth, and against the policies of the Tory-led Government that have led to flatlining growth and increasing unemployment in Britain, that will remain Labour’s priority in the months ahead.



Best wishes

Graham


Seems Mr Jones doesn't believe in democracy