Is it any wonder children swear? - Page 4

garinda · 15-09-2005, 11:41

Dear Head,
I would like you to excuse Johnnie from religous education lessons. As a committed vegan family, we wouldn't be happy for him to read the Christian bible, which features the miraculous eating of fishes as well as the more acceptable loaves.

Your's etc.

WillowTheWhisp · 15-09-2005, 11:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

A genuine question? Is it not possible to ask what books a child will be reading at the begining of the year? Since most of the national curriculum is set country wide, this should be possible, if it isn't it is wrong. Parents and gaurdians should have a right to know, partly so they could read the books to help the child, as well as to object if they so wish.

I'm not sure about the part about reading the book so the they/we can help the child as that could possibly in some ways put our views/appreciation of the literature in question forward instead of the child's opinion. I'd like to think they can form their own criticism/appreciation by that age.

I'm probably just naive in assuming that the NC wouldn't contain anything to which a parent could object from the point of view of containing such things as profanities.

It's rather ironic that in my day if a pupil had been caught in the lunch hour or break time reading a book with known sexual content or strong language the book would have been confiscated and the child reprimanded. Now such books are part of the curriculum. How times have changed.

I can see from some of the comments in this thread that there are people who think I am an old fuddy duddy and should be encouraging my daughters to watch porn and to eff and blind with the rest of them because "kids do that these days". I may be in a minority but I'm pleased to say that my kids are two of the few that don't and I find it rather sad that it is schools who are teaching them that it's OK and right to do it.

I have found this thread interesting and an eye-opener because I can see now that I'm probably going to be the only parent who has objections.

JohnW · 15-09-2005, 11:55

I also liked "A Taste of Honey", good song too. There were a few films out from the late fifties to the mid sixties which were known as kitchen sink dramas. This was one of them. I think the one that started it all off was "Room at the Top" with the wonderful Lawrence Harvey and Heather Sears. My own favourite was "Saturday Night and Sunday Morning" with the unbeatable Albert Finney and Rachel Roberts. There was also one with Rugby as the main theme, I think Richard Harris might have starred in that one but I can't think of the name of the film at the moment. Ah, just remembered it, "This Sporting Life"

They don't make 'em like that any more!

garinda · 15-09-2005, 12:01

No Willow, I certainly don't think you are a fuddy duddy, it's been a very interesting thread, and like I said you should be so proud of your daughter for having the courage of her convictions, which at her age, amongst her peers is remarkable.

I don't think pre reading the booksd to be studied would influence their enjoyment of it, just keep parents informed of what they are studying. Wasn't Educating Rita studied as part of the national curriculum?

WillowTheWhisp · 15-09-2005, 12:04

Not when I was at school it wasn't.

garinda · 15-09-2005, 12:17

Hee hee, it had only just been written when we were at school.

I do find it interesting about how what was once contemporary and cutting edge at the time, suddenly becomes a 'classic'. Like people have said Shakespeare if taught properly should explain that it was written with a raucous live audience in mind, and all the filthy jokes should be seen in context and explained.

grannyclaret · 15-09-2005, 12:40

i am with willow...morals dont mean anything anymore,,, if you want to bring up your kids without the swearing and carryings on,then you are the one thats being a prude,,,,,
i wouldent like to go back to the victorian age, but i think were too lax now.

cashman · 15-09-2005, 12:44

willow thats NOT being a fuddy duddy its called bringing your kids up decent.

WillowTheWhisp · 15-09-2005, 12:48

Well I obviously wasn't taught Shakespeare correctly because I wasn't aware of any filthy jokes in Macbeth or Richard III when we did them at school. I also wasn't aware of them when I saw them (and Hamlet) performed on stage either or in the Basil Rathbone film version of Richard III on TV so I'm probably naive and ignorant.

And to think it wasn't all that long ago that the word bl***y wasn't allowed on TV. When a girl in my class said she was late for school becuse she'd missed the bl***y bus the teacher remarked that she wasn't aware that a bus had been bleeding. And she wasn't making fun of it she was trying to point out that the girl could have chosen a more accurate word as an adjective without resorting to swearing.

There are restrictions on words permitted on this message board so there must be some validity in knowing what is an acceptable word and what isn't.

If we don't let someone know that we object where would it all end?

garinda · 15-09-2005, 13:08

Even in the historical plays there are rude jokes that the live audiences of the time would have wet their breeches at.

As for Victorian values...........on the surface the model of a decent moral society, underneath, out of a then population in London of five million people there was about 25,000 children working in prostitution, total hypocrisy.

I think parents should have an input into what their children are taught at school, and I applaud both Willow and her daughter's stand. I do however fear that it might result in the censoring of anything that might be deemed unsuitable not being taught at all.

Educating Rita is the story of a working class Liverpudlian mother who found a new life through the studying of literature at university. Her language reflected her background, and could be talked about in context with a good teacher.

Talking of swearing, it's another bug bear of mine that when bad language is reported in the press as a quote, it is always asterixed. We all know the words alluded to, and it just seems stupid because our brains read it as a swear word anyway. F***ing daft.

grannyclaret · 15-09-2005, 13:19

ermm yes i supose you have a point there ..

Margaret Pilkington · 15-09-2005, 13:37

Willow......I must be a fuddy duddy too......I find swearing offensive, and by swearing I mean the F word and others with sexual connotations........if that makes me a prude then so be it......it is because we have accepted these profanities in our daily life that young people feel they are OK to use. My daughter bought me the James Blunt CD and he sings a song called 'Beautiful'....... and yes, it is a beautiful song marred by the 'F' word........I don't even like to play it because of that......you may think that that is taking things too far, but that is just me!

fireman · 15-09-2005, 13:52

I agree many a lovely song as ruined by the use of swear words years ago the original version of John Lennon's Woman used swear words and I would not allow it in my house even though I loved the Beatles. Guess that puts me with you Willow we are all becoming Fuddy Duddies.

cashman · 15-09-2005, 13:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by fireman

I agree many a lovely song as ruined by the use of swear words years ago the original version of John Lennon's Woman used swear words and I would not allow it in my house even though I loved the Beatles. Guess that puts me with you Willow we are all becoming Fuddy Duddies.

no fireman when your over 50 youre an OFFICAL OLD FART.

fireman · 15-09-2005, 14:00

Whats that smell around here ?