just heard this... - Page 12

Mancie · 27-11-2009, 02:58

no excuse for lynch mobs..for the local community to dish out justice as they see it is anarchy, there is no room for it and does not fit in with society... it is easy for us all to be judge and jury but it is not a road to go down.

grannyclaret · 27-11-2009, 10:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by accyman

i think there are cases where vigilanti justice is very excusable , it knocks me sick when i read about some poor sod getting arrested for giving the guy who raped his child a good kicking for example

i agree,accyman,,i shudder to think what would happen if anyone raped my grandaughter,,,i think my son would give them more than a good kicking,and you couldnt wish for a nicer guy

Wynonie Harris · 27-11-2009, 11:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by grannyclaret

i agree,accyman,,i shudder to think what would happen if anyone raped my grandaughter,,,i think my son would give them more than a good kicking,and you couldnt wish for a nicer guy

So if vigilante violence is "excusable", what happens if they get the wrong person? Supposing Stefan Kiszco had been set upon by vigilantes in the mid-70's? Would that have been justice?

accyman · 27-11-2009, 12:12

why do people always drag up very old cases from before we had the technology we have now, if DNA evidence is good enough to free previously convicted criminals im pretty sure DNA evidence is good enough to condem a person today.

cant seem to win with some people, they accept DNA evidence to free wrongly convicted people but cant acccept DNA evidence to condem somone

MargaretR · 27-11-2009, 12:23

DNA can be fabricated from detail on a database, so cannot be relied on if it is the only evidence.
You would be upset if the cops say they found yours at some crime scene and you didn't remember where you were when that crime was committed.

baldy · 27-11-2009, 12:28

I always thought that Alan Street got murdered in revenge for when he attacked Lennard in a pub, And not because Street was a rapist!

Wynonie Harris · 27-11-2009, 12:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by accyman

why do people always drag up very old cases from before we had the technology we have now, if DNA evidence is good enough to free previously convicted criminals im pretty sure DNA evidence is good enough to condem a person today.

cant seem to win with some people, they accept DNA evidence to free wrongly convicted people but cant acccept DNA evidence to condem somone

Sorry, I didn't realise vigilante mobs had DNA evidence at their fingertips. Presumably, they carefully weigh up all the forensic evidence, with the help of detailed case notes, before carefully considering who the guilty person is. After all, vigilantes are generally of quite a high intellectual standard...like the ones who attacked a paediatrician's office, because they thought that was the same as being a paedophile.

As for not accepting, DNA evidence to convict an offender, could you direct me to the post where I've supported that? Strangely enough, I can't seem to remember it.

accyman · 27-11-2009, 12:45

were talking about convicted people who dont get propper scentences or punishment , dont alter the argument to suit you.No one has mentioned dragging people at random off the streets for a good kicking its very clear we are talking about perverts who get let back onto the streets with a slapped wrist for commiting crimes like raping children and how in the majority of right minded people its is at the very least perfectly understandable for a parent to gleefully slit the throat of a person who had raped their child.

if you cant get your head around the fact that a parent would want a person dead and may feel like taking out tehir own measure of justice on the pervert then you are in a very small minority because every parent i know would want a person dead if they raped their child

if anyone ever molested one of my kids they would find themselves hanging from a tree with their throat cut but hey i might just be an over protective parent

Wynonie Harris · 27-11-2009, 12:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by accyman

were talking about convicted people who dont get propper scentences or punishment , dont alter the argument to suit you.No one has mentioned dragging people at random off the streets for a good kicking its very clear we are talking about perverts who get let back onto the streets with a slapped wrist for commiting crimes like raping children and how in the majority of right minded people its is at the very least perfectly understandable for a parent to gleefully slit the throat of a person who had raped their child.

if you cant get your head around the fact that a parent would want a person dead and may feel like taking out tehir own measure of justice on the pervert then you are in a very small minority because every parent i know would want a person dead if they raped their child

if anyone ever molested one of my kids they would find themselves hanging from a tree with their throat cut but hey i might just be an over protective parent

You're the one who's said vigilante violence is excusable. Problem is, what happens when it's meted out to the wrong person? Or can you expect a mob of vigilantes to make a considered judgement about whether someone's guilty or not? Obviously, you think they can...I don't.

As for longer sentences, I would totally agree with you, unfortunately, this present government (and probably the next one) don't.

accyman · 27-11-2009, 13:15

i actually said i think there are cases where vigilantism is excusable and i think i have covered the areas where i think it is.

ie: parents of abused children seeking their own justice that should have been handed out by the law

i wouldnt think it acceptable for a lynch mob to set after a shop lifter for example

Wynonie Harris · 27-11-2009, 14:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by accyman

i actually said i think there are cases where vigilantism is excusable and i think i have covered the areas where i think it is.

ie: parents of abused children seeking their own justice that should have been handed out by the law

i wouldnt think it acceptable for a lynch mob to set after a shop lifter for example

So, who decides what's acceptable and what's not? I admit if someone had abused my daughter, I'd be waiting at the gaol gates, but does that mean the police should turn a blind eye to me? What happens if the next case is someone who has committed GBH being attacked by the victim's family? And the next case is a burglar? Where do you draw the line? Sexual offences only? And who rules where that line should be drawn?

There is a simple and obvious answer to all this. More prison places (and by prison, I mean very basic accommodation with no home comforts) and a wholesale ratching up of sentences, real life sentences for murder, 30-40 years for rapes, serious assaults etc.

Sadly, that won't happen under this or the next government.

accyman · 27-11-2009, 14:13

nope and because it dosnt this is why some feel the need to take the law into tehir own hands.

i think its abouttime the law makers asked teh public what punishments should be handed out for very serious crimes liek rape, pedophilia and murder and alter the punishments accordingly.Also if tehre isnt a cell free for a prisoner make them top and tail in one bed until a bed becomes free or take away things liek computer rooms and stick beds in them until more prisons are built

stop putting peopel in prison for small crimes like pirating dvds ,selling cheap tobbacco or not been able to pay their council tax and put the tagging system to use there and make more room for people who we dont want walking our streets

Wynonie Harris · 27-11-2009, 14:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by accyman

nope and because it dosnt this is why some feel the need to take the law into tehir own hands.

i think its abouttime the law makers asked teh public what punishments should be handed out for very serious crimes liek rape, pedophilia and murder and alter the punishments accordingly.Also if tehre isnt a cell free for a prisoner make them top and tail in one bed until a bed becomes free or take away things liek computer rooms and stick beds in them until more prisons are built

stop putting peopel in prison for small crimes like pirating dvds ,selling cheap tobbacco or not been able to pay their council tax and put the tagging system to use there and make more room for people who we dont want walking our streets

Still don't agree with vigilante justice, but would totally agree with most of what you're saying there.