Keeping Dead Industries Alive....

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by cmonstanley

politics affects every little thing you do in life,to catching the bus(every private bus firm is subsidized .so when here is cuts the bus fare goes up.the railways the prices go up even when the subsidies stay the same as they have to pay their shareholders .the price of food with vat etc.internet charges the tv everything is affected by politics. moving it away from general chat would be impossible.

The easiest way would be to move you away from General Chat.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Restless

I think of myself as kinda borderline agnostic/atheist

Only borderline Rob

[cmonstanley]

Originally Posted by GEaston

2012 was a record year for British car production. We made more cars in Britain than ever before. Land Rover, Range Rover, Jaguar, Rolls Royce, Bentley, Aston Martin and Nissan all hitting production records exporting all over the world, particularly in Asia.

How many here want British Leyland back? And why? A business that was bad to begin with, finished not by Maggie but by union practices combining with a terrible product.

Sure all these companies are now owned overseas, but so what? The manufacturing and jobs are UK and as noted earlier UK pension funds are big investors in these companies. In car technology the UK, and specifically the Midlands today, leads the world (formula 1 type technology).

not quite true matey,when british leyland etc was made here the steel ,the ore was smelted in the uk the parts were made in the uk ,the seats were made and sown here,the tyres were made here .i would like to see the statistics counted by percentage of population as with population growth you are bound to see an increase.from 1997 to 2010 there was 7 million more cars on the roads.this was only possible because labour created wealth for more people not just the chosen few

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by cmonstanley

not quite true matey,when british leyland etc was made here the steel ,the ore was smelted in the uk the parts were made in the uk ,the seats were made and sown here,the tyres were made here .i would like to see the statistics counted by percentage of population as with population growth you are bound to see an increase.from 1997 to 2010 there was 7 million more cars on the roads.this was only possible because labour created wealth for more people not just the chosen few

Ya and back in the 70s and early 80s all the foreign cars parked at the pit head every day. Why do you think we have virtually no car industry today, one out all out brothers, somebody has connected a wire they shouldn't have we cant have that. Companies left this country in droves back in those days, why should they put up with wildcat sticks, flying pickets, when they could get their product made a hell of a site cheaper and what's more without a threat from the likes of Red Robo, advising his members to go on strike at every opportunity.

[Restless]

Originally Posted by jaysay

Only borderline Rob

On the Spectrum Of Theistic Probability I would say 5.7/6

[Neil]

Originally Posted by jaysay

The easiest way would be to move you away from General Chat.

I could arrange that for a modest bribe.
Shall I set up a paypal account for your errrm, donations?

[Neil]

Originally Posted by cmonstanley

.....this was only possible because labour created wealth for more people not just the chosen few

Thats not how I see it. Labour didn't create wealth for more people, they borrowed money to give to people. Thats not creating wealth. All they created was debt.

To create wealth you need to create industry and the jobs that go with it. Then people can work and earn wealth, not sit at home watching Sky TV all day paid for by the state using taxes taken from the workers.

[cmonstanley]

Originally Posted by Neil

Thats not how I see it. Labour didn't create wealth for more people, they borrowed money to give to people. Thats not creating wealth. All they created was debt.

To create wealth you need to create industry and the jobs that go with it. Then people can work and earn wealth, not sit at home watching Sky TV all day paid for by the state using taxes taken from the workers.

well its better giving it to the people than giving multi-millionaires tax breaks.they did create wealth by introducing the national minimum wage.the tories opposed it.

[cmonstanley]

jaysay who started the ball rolling for maggie to get elected?

[cmonstanley]

the op is getting as bad as me lol.he did say dead industry and then say 2012 was a record year. so its not a dead industry.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by jaysay

Ya and back in the 70s and early 80s all the foreign cars parked at the pit head every day. Why do you think we have virtually no car industry today, one out all out brothers, somebody has connected a wire they shouldn't have we cant have that. Companies left this country in droves back in those days, why should they put up with wildcat sticks, flying pickets, when they could get their product made a hell of a site cheaper and what's more without a threat from the likes of Red Robo, advising his members to go on strike at every opportunity.

Whilst its beyond dispute things had gone too far, I hear no mention from yeh,of The flying pickets that were turned back on the M6 n other motorways? People in fact that were ordinary builders going about work away from home, in fact costing one i know personally a great deal of money, through losing a big job. But obviously to Torys "The Ends justify the means" or yeh would be complaining also about stuff like this. By the way i missed out on these wildcat sticks? were they thing to beat em wi? pmsl

[cmonstanley]

i actually agree it went too far.some people were taking advantage but there was genuine reasons to strike for some people like the miners.i blame james callaghan[lucky jim] for not calling a election early in 1978 when he would have won.followed by the snp for calling a vote of no confidence.that encouraged thatcher to call for a no confidence vote. Callaghan lost by 1 vote

[accyman]

Originally Posted by cashman

I hear no mention from yeh,of The flying pickets that were turned back on the M6 n other motorways?

luckily they had a number 1 hit and earned a little cash

[GEaston]

Stanley - you can't seriously be suggesting that British Leyland produced something that people wanted to buy are you?

Striking and high cost of product was certainly part of the problem but the death of the UK car industry was that we produced absolute crap (Princess, Maxi, Rover SD1, the list is long). Compared to Audi, BMW, or any Japanese brand we were a joke. That industry had to go.

With the unions gone and massive private investment (you might want to read that last sentence again....) what emerged in it's place is the same skilled labour force producing quality cars for foreign owners like the giant Nissan plant at Sunderland. The rest were taken over - Tata owns Landrover/Range Rover, VW bought Bentley, BMW took Rolls Royce or closed (British Leyland, MG, TVR). 80% of UK car production on behalf of the now foreign owners is exported from the UK.

By any measure (jobs, suppliers, inward investment, product quality) this is progress. BBC News - UK car exports hit record despite European market slump

Car producing capital of Europe no less Britain now producing MORE cars than Germany: How the UK has become the car production capital of Europe | Mail Online

[Less]

Originally Posted by GEaston

Stanley - you can't seriously be suggesting that British Leyland produced something that people wanted to buy are you?

Striking and high cost of product was certainly part of the problem but the death of the UK car industry was that we produced absolute crap (Princess, Maxi, Rover SD1, the list is long). Compared to Audi, BMW, or any Japanese brand we were a joke. That industry had to go.

With the unions gone and massive private investment (you might want to read that last sentence again....) what emerged in it's place is the same skilled labour force producing quality cars for foreign owners like the giant Nissan plant at Sunderland. The rest were taken over - Tata owns Landrover/Range Rover, VW bought Bentley, BMW took Rolls Royce or closed (British Leyland, MG, TVR). 80% of UK car production on behalf of the now foreign owners is exported from the UK.

By any measure (jobs, suppliers, inward investment, product quality) this is progress. BBC News - UK car exports hit record despite European market slump

Car producing capital of Europe no less Britain now producing MORE cars than Germany: How the UK has become the car production capital of Europe | Mail Online

Strange isn't it, you started this thread claiming it was a debate, a debate that started with a link to someone else's opinions because you didn't put forward any of your own, (c'mon is famous for that kind of thing), now you no longer wish to debate you prefer to lecture, a lecture that no doubt would be fitting for any secondary school class but not for folk that lived through the times.
Yes BL was crap, but it was crap from the top down, inferior designs, materials and man management, huh, man management now that was a joke, yes there were plenty of strikes I've already said I'm against such action, yes there were some that would strike over nothing and yes there was a management system in place that seemed to go out of it's way to ensure that those strikes came about and continued.
It isn't just the Unions that have gone, it is the terrible Management that has also been removed, I think you will find that the system now in place works because everyone in these companies is now proud of their product and at last they all work together.
No longer is work disrupted by either side because there isn't an either side just a team working together with one aim, get the best product we can make through the door on time.
Something that never happened at BL or any of the other divided factories.