Labour Leadership Contest

[accyman]

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

If he wants to re-nationalise the railways we cannot be in the EU - that would be against the monopoly rules.

i couldn't find any mention of it ?

[Wynonie Harris]

A militant vegan as Shadow Minister of Agriculture...hmmm, probably not his best idea.
Meat-eaters should be treated like smokers, says the vegan shadow environment secretary Kerry McCarthy | UK Politics | News | The Independent

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

The Tories had a free hand in 1979. They decimated our industries and caused untold misery in the country, yet they were re-elected in 1983. One of the main reasons was that the Labour Party was led by Michael Foot - a left-wing socialist just like Jeremy Corbyn.

Don't get me wrong - I think Corbyn's a thoroughly decent bloke. It speaks volumes that he chose to help one of his constituents with her housing problems rather than go to Twickenham to watch the rugby - for which he was roundly mocked by that odious, braying ex-public school tosspot, Boris Johnson.

Whether being a decent bloke will be enough to get him to No 10 in 2020, I have my doubts.

In '83 the tories rode to victory on the back of success in the Falkland War. And it still seemed in the 80s that voodoo economics would bring about the general prosperity that had been promised as early as Lloyd George ... "fit country for heroes to live in." When prosperity did arrive, with Teflon Tony at the helm, no one seemed to realize how fragile it was, with, what, thirty per cent of your economy centred in The City. Perhaps there is an argument to be made that Labour can't win by going back to their old ideas. Well the tories won your last election and they haven't had a new idea since 1819 (I picked the year of Peterloo for no particular reason.)

Thing is, I've been reading the news about Corbyn, he might be a decent bloke; his politics may be decent too. But he's starting to come across plainly as so [deleted]ing politically correct ... apologizing for this and that; showing solidarity with Hamas (nice bunch of lads who occasionally get a little too careless with their AKs and rocket launchers). Maybe it's all an image thing; maybe he truly believes in all that warm fuzzy horse manure. I'm not suggesting that, in order to be a strong leader, one has to go out and kick ass (why does George Bush come to mind.) But neither can you go around kissing ass. If you do, eventually, someone is going to [deleted] in your face.

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by Eric

In '83 the tories rode to victory on the back of success in the Falkland War. And it still seemed in the 80s that voodoo economics would bring about the general prosperity that had been promised as early as Lloyd George ... "fit country for heroes to live in." When prosperity did arrive, with Teflon Tony at the helm, no one seemed to realize how fragile it was, with, what, thirty per cent of your economy centred in The City. Perhaps there is an argument to be made that Labour can't win by going back to their old ideas. Well the tories won your last election and they haven't had a new idea since 1819 (I picked the year of Peterloo for no particular reason.)

Thing is, I've been reading the news about Corbyn, he might be a decent bloke; his politics may be decent too. But he's starting to come across plainly as so [deleted]ing politically correct ... apologizing for this and that; showing solidarity with Hamas (nice bunch of lads who occasionally get a little too careless with their AKs and rocket launchers). Maybe it's all an image thing; maybe he truly believes in all that warm fuzzy horse manure. I'm not suggesting that, in order to be a strong leader, one has to go out and kick ass (why does George Bush come to mind.) But neither can you go around kissing ass. If you do, eventually, someone is going to [deleted] in your face.

Yep, a good war always helps and Cameron's already made a start on that one by sending drones to blast a couple of British passport holding ISIS members to kingdom come. Corbyn predictably doesn't approve. No doubt more will follow with perhaps a full-scale bombing campaign, with Corbyn tut-tutting from the sidelines. That'll play well to his leftwing supporters, but not so well with the general electorate. As for "voodoo economics", the Tories are still practicing it and as you say, they won the last election, so it'll take more than Corbyn to shift 'em.

As for Corbyn's political correctness, right on the money. That's what I've been saying from the start of this thread. Corbyn regularly comes out with the sort of ideas that would have him castigated as a "bleeding heart liberal do-gooder" if he aired them on Accyweb. but apparently he's the greatest thing since sliced bread. Go figure.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

As for Corbyn's political correctness

What burns my ass about this is that it gives good ideas a bad name ... takes a good idea like civil rights (well outlined and defined in the US Civil Rights Act, 1964) and ruins the goddam thing by taking it to ridiculous extremes. I care about the environment ... why not, it's where I live ... but I'm not a tree hugger. I'm opposed to capital punishment, not because of any concern about the human rights of murderers and assorted scum, but because it doesn't work ... in the sense that it ain't a deterrent. If it were, there wouldn't have been over 12,000 hand gun homicides in the US last year. One can hold progressive ideas and not be a politically correct idiot. What I see as PCism is the ridiculous response to the picture of that dead kid being washed ashore. Sad, yes; but it's just one dead kid out of thousands who die every day in this sad, [deleted] up world of ours. And most of those thousands died suffering from disease, starvation, genocide, as child soldiers ... you know the picture. PCers focus on the one, because it's dramatic and makes good news on CNN. The others are left forgotten, suffering in silence. I think it's time to stop ranting.

The danger that I see from Corbyn is that he will taint good ideas ... let's lump them together and call them "socialism" ... with his warm fuzzy ideas. But it would still, I believe, be wrong to write him off so soon after his election.

[Barrie Yates]

His shadow cabinet don't seem to be helping much. The Shadow Environment has stated that meat should be treated like tobacco???????? That will certainly go down well with the livestock farmers.

[accyman]

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

The Shadow Environment has stated that meat should be treated like tobacco????????

the guy obviously needs a slap around the head preferably with a pack of smoked bacon

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Barrie Yates

His shadow cabinet don't seem to be helping much. The Shadow Environment has stated that meat should be treated like tobacco???????? That will certainly go down well with the livestock farmers.

It already is treated like tobacco: it comes in small packages which cost and arm and a leg.

But I do get your point. Now, if the shadow health minister had come out and commented about the strain being put on the NHS by obesity and its buddy, diabetes; and state that it would benefit everyone if certain foods ... Rotten Ronnie's burgers come to mind ... carried warning labels, or at least a table of contents, that would be reasonable. But a comment like that from the Environment Shadow is pure PC bullshine. Maybe that person thinks that a major cut in beef production would help slow down global warming, as there would be fewer cattle farting methane into the atmosphere.

What always pees me off about PC politicians is that their pulpit is a position of privilege: An overpaid job which involves little work, and carries with it an obscenely inflated expense account and numerous other perks.

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Eric

What burns my ass about this is that it gives good ideas a bad name ... takes a good idea like civil rights (well outlined and defined in the US Civil Rights Act, 1964) and ruins the goddam thing by taking it to ridiculous extremes. I care about the environment ... why not, it's where I live ... but I'm not a tree hugger. I'm opposed to capital punishment, not because of any concern about the human rights of murderers and assorted scum, but because it doesn't work ... in the sense that it ain't a deterrent. If it were, there wouldn't have been over 12,000 hand gun homicides in the US last year. One can hold progressive ideas and not be a politically correct idiot. What I see as PCism is the ridiculous response to the picture of that dead kid being washed ashore. Sad, yes; but it's just one dead kid out of thousands who die every day in this sad, [deleted] up world of ours. And most of those thousands died suffering from disease, starvation, genocide, as child soldiers ... you know the picture. PCers focus on the one, because it's dramatic and makes good news on CNN. The others are left forgotten, suffering in silence. I think it's time to stop ranting.

The danger that I see from Corbyn is that he will taint good ideas ... let's lump them together and call them "socialism" ... with his warm fuzzy ideas. But it would still, I believe, be wrong to write him off so soon after his election.

Cracking post mate.

True socialism is about common sense and the common good...something that the 'alleged socialist' mainstream Labour party has forgotten. The word 'social' loosely means people working/sharing for the common good. The strong look after the weak, the young care for the old and all the other cliches that people like our Labour MP has forgotten in his attempted rise to power by forcing his colleagues, under threat of deselection, to vote for party rather than conscience.

Yeah, Corbyn has nutjob ideas...then again so does Cameron...Corbyn has a nutjob Shadow agricultural minister..Cameron gives you..Ian Duncan Smith (murderer of the sick and infirm), Michael Gove (Screwed up the school system and is now happily screwing up the justice system), George Osborne (a failed journalist let loose with the finances of the country and despite warnings from learned economists is barreling on with his version of austerity which screws us plebs whilst allowing his rich mates and their companies immunity), Theresa May (a home secretary who has done more stupid U turns than I see at Dill Hall lights)

Point is Corbyn has his faults...he has some crazy ideas and he is far too PC for my liking, but he is a valid alternative. And unlike people like our MP he would not throw his toys out of the pram if things didn't go his way, nor would he deselect party members for having an alternative view to his own...he actually believes in democracy

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Cracking post mate.

True socialism is about common sense

Never a truer statement made ... I know what common sense is; I grew up in Lancashire in the 50s ... seems like it was bred in the bone. And there's the other thing: knowing what's right and what's wrong. We don't need "guidelines", "seminars", "charters of equality", the "ten commandments" and whatever the muslim equivalent is, and all that PC bullcrap ... we know. And it's not hard to know. I believe it's a quality of humanity. And I firmly believe that to be a socialist is to act according to what is right for the majority of people, particularly the ones whose only power comes from solidarity with like-minded and like-situated folks.

[Gordon Booth]

The Labour leadership- a better comedy team than the Goons or Black Adder.
Corbyn- screamed at by his MP's, sat silent. A born leader?
McDonnell- total reversal of policy in two weeks. Oh no, it's a change of tactics?? No it's not.
Watson- accuses a dying man of 'multiple child rape' and being 'close to evil'. No firm evidence, no police arrest, no trial, no arrest , no trial, no conviction- and no apology.
Abbott- 'it's a process story', no problems. What's a 'process story'?
A vegetarian in charge of agriculture and farming. ???

Is it a comedy team or are the inmates now running the asylum?
A once proud party brought low.

[hyndburner]

Whatever the shortcomings of the new Labour leadership, the fact is that they are shortly to become the only refuge for millions of voters about to find out what the Conservative austerity programme is all about.

Many people currently in receipt of tax credits voted Conservative because they liked the message that benefit recipients are scroungers, and as such need to be punished.

What they don't realise is that Osborne doesn't differentiate between benefit recipients and tax credit recipients. They are bot a drain on public spending that has to be eliminated.

So look out for the backlash when Conservative voters find that they themselves are being punished, and there'll be a whole lot of them becoming ex Conservative voters.

And where do they go?

To the party preaching anti austerity.

The further the Tories shift to the right, the more powerful Labour will become.

[cashman]

Correct the numpties will eventually have the penny drop. no sympathy from me,

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth

The Labour leadership- a better comedy team than the Goons or Black Adder.
Corbyn- screamed at by his MP's, sat silent. A born leader?
McDonnell- total reversal of policy in two weeks. Oh no, it's a change of tactics?? No it's not.
Watson- accuses a dying man of 'multiple child rape' and being 'close to evil'. No firm evidence, no police arrest, no trial, no arrest , no trial, no conviction- and no apology.
Abbott- 'it's a process story', no problems. What's a 'process story'?
A vegetarian in charge of agriculture and farming. ???

Is it a comedy team or are the inmates now running the asylum?
A once proud party brought low.

Comedy team leader who totally wiped the floor with Cameron and the rest of his front bench during PMQ's today. (Despite Cameron not answering a single question)

Incidentally a front bench who were openly laughing at questions posed by Corbyn on behalf of real people who were worse off under Camerons policies.

You are half correct..the inmates are ALREADY running the asylum, and you my friend helped put them there

[cashman]

The fact Graham abstained in vote for democratic socialism is disgraceful in my book.