Labour Leadership Contest

[Wynonie Harris]

I can name a few too...Ken Hargreaves, for example, whose only concern was to serve his constituents. And, yep, Jeremy Corbin, who, however wrongheaded his views, has stuck steadfastly to them and not chopped and changed to appeal to the electorate and also has the lowest expenses claims in Parliament. Gordon Bennett, I'm going to end up supporting the bearded, vest-wearing git at this rate!

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by JCB

A poet , she was born in Kenya in 1988 to Somali parents, Warsan Shire was raised and still lives in London......this is one of her poems......

no one leaves home unless
home is the mouth of a shark
you only run for the border
when you see the whole city running as well

your neighbours running faster than you
breath bloody in their throats
the boy you went to school with
who kissed you dizzy behind the old tin factory
is holding a gun bigger than his body
you only leave home
when home won’t let you stay.

no one leaves home unless home chases you
fire under feet
hot blood in your belly
it’s not something you ever thought of doing
until the blade burnt threats into
your neck
and even then you carried the anthem under
your breath
only tearing up your passport in an airport toilets
sobbing as each mouthful of paper
made it clear that you wouldn’t be going back.

you have to understand,
that no one puts their children in a boat
unless the water is safer than the land
no one burns their palms
under trains
beneath carriages
no one spends days and nights in the stomach of a truck
feeding on newspaper unless the miles travelled
means something more than journey.
no one crawls under fences
no one wants to be beaten
pitied

no one chooses refugee camps
or strip searches where your
body is left aching
or prison,
because prison is safer
than a city of fire
and one prison guard
in the night
is better than a truckload
of men who look like your father
no one could take it
no one could stomach it
no one skin would be tough enough

the
go home blacks
refugees
dirty immigrants
asylum seekers
sucking our country dry
niggers with their hands out
they smell strange
savage
messed up their country and now they want
to mess ours up
how do the words
the dirty looks
roll off your backs
maybe because the blow is softer
than a limb torn off

or the words are more tender
than fourteen men between
your legs
or the insults are easier
to swallow
than rubble
than bone
than your child body
in pieces.
i want to go home,
but home is the mouth of a shark
home is the barrel of the gun
and no one would leave home
unless home chased you to the shore
unless home told you
to quicken your legs
leave your clothes behind
crawl through the desert
wade through the oceans
drown
save
be hunger
beg
forget pride
your survival is more important

no one leaves home until home is a sweaty voice in your ear
saying-
leave,
run away from me now
i dont know what i’ve become
but i know that anywhere
is safer than here

Again, something very emotive but irrelevant to the situation.
A young Syrian father was interviewed on the early morning news. He was in Hungary, he was portrayed as a refugee, but this man and his family left Syria five years ago.....it was then that he qualified as a refugee, and should have applied for asylum in the country to which he fled....he is now NOT a refugee, but an economic migrant.

I have had all my sympathy exhausted. I am not moved any more by the plight of these people.
They do not want to abide by the rules. Rules are essential to maintain some kind of order....but they have not left disorder in the country of their origin, they have brought disorder with them.....and we are expected to facilitate this.

Ask those people who are signatories to the petitions for more of these people to be admitted to our country if they want their lives ripped apart in the future by one of these young men who could be in the thrall of ISIS.
Or have their lives put at risk by one of these young men who make their home here, but then feel that our culture is not Muslim enough.....becomes radicalised and we all know what may follow that.
Every home given over to these incomers is one less available for our children.
This is the plain unvarnished truth.....no emotional pictures of drowned toddlers.....but perhaps we should revisit the pictures of 7/7 and remember those victims and who orchestrated that.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by Guinness

Weird ain’t it….that a few days after a heart rending photograph…Cameron is now doing exactly what ‘Jeremy’ is banging on about in the piece that you quote…because, suddenly, it’s no longer ultra left wing rhetoric, it’s political expediency

No he isn't doing what Jeremy Corbyn was banging on about.....or maybe he is....But for totally different reasons.
He is being squeezed by populist opinion.....he is doing what he thinks will win him public approval, never a good reason to change your tack.
It is quite hard when you are up to yor neck in crocodiles to remember that you went into the swamp to drain it!

None of our current incumbents know what to do about the situation.....and the EU politicians are no better.
Reinstate borders, control borders, then at least you should have some idea of who is coming into your country.
Without these measures we are inviting potential terrorists into our countries.

[Barrie Yates]

How many of the asylum seekers/refugees have gone to states that are of the same religion - Saudi Arabia, Bahrain, UAE, Oman, Pakistan, Iran, Kuwait, Jordan, Palestine, Egypt and some of the Stans. The religions are the same, languages are similar, and most have Sharia Law.
How many are the USA, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, Russia and many other countries taking. If it is a world problem, then let the rest of the world take their share, don't leave it all to Europe, especially not England.

[cashman]

The civilized world should sort the cause, not the refugees, people should not want to flee their own country,simple as, but will never happen.

[Gordon Booth]

Germany has opened the floodgates.
The mobile phones will be busy.
Listen carefully, can you hear that distant roar?

[Margaret Pilkington]

Spot on Cashy.
This problem will not go away if countries take in these people....It will just encourage more to come.....it will just line the pockets of those criminals exploiting these people.

They need to be stopped from leaving their own lands..boats need to be turned back every time.....people disembarked and the junks holed and sent to the bottom.

I am sick of the bleating of bleeding heart liberals.
We cannot be the safe haven for the waifs and strays of the world...these children that look so pathetic now will look totally different in 18 years time when they are disaffected by not having a connection with their homeland, they will look different with an automatic rifle or a rucksack full of explosives on an underground train or a bus in one of our cities.

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth

Germany has opened the floodgates.
The mobile phones will be busy.
Listen carefully, can you hear that distant roar?

Don't I know it, there's lots of talk & concern going round the "Volk", but it's not spoken out loudly by most due to the spectre of Germanys' past form, especially around the 1930's to 40's.

[Wynonie Harris]

So just to get back to the main thrust of the thread...Jeremy Corbyn wants us to unilaterally disarm and he wants us to accept a lot more of the current wave of asylum seekers. Now, I'm not personally casting aspersions on either of those standpoints, but can anyone seriously say that this man has a hope in hell of leading the Labour party to electoral success?

[cashman]

It dont matter a jot Wyn, not ONE of em has the balls to ask fer the Cause to be tackled.

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

Jeremy Corbyn wants us to unilaterally disarm and he wants us to accept a lot more of the current wave of asylum seekers.

Immaterial if it's Corbyn, Balls, Burnham, or Kendall, putting forward those kind of ideas within the current situation facing the UK & particularly England, they really can't be serious about ruling the roost.

Surely even the most dogged, dyed in the wool & rabid follower can see the idiocy of their potential "Beloved leaders" idiocy.

(Mind you, we are talking Labour supporters here, pin a red rosette on a degenerate Ape ....... Oh yeah, they did that & we ended up with 13 years of Labour )

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Immaterial if it's Corbyn, Balls, Burnham, or Kendall, putting forward those kind of ideas within the current situation facing the UK & particularly England, they really can't be serious about ruling the roost.

Surely even the most dogged, dyed in the wool & rabid follower can see the idiocy of their potential "Beloved leaders" idiocy.

(Mind you, we are talking Labour supporters here, pin a red rosette on a degenerate Ape ....... Oh yeah, they did that & we ended up with 13 years of Labour )

Don't agree,Dave; Corbyn is the only Labour leadership candidate supporting unilateral disarmament; the others want to retain our nuclear deterrent. As for accepting asylum seekers, the fact is that both major parties are now committed to accepting asylum seekers, but of course, no one's talking numbers.

As for the other comments about beloved leaders idiocy and pinning the red rose on an ape, you could equally direct those comments to Tory voters. How anyone can support shysters and scumbags like Cameron and Osborne and in particular the odious Duncan Smith who are running the NHS and welfare state down, while rewarding their rich mates is beyond me.

However, the point I'm making is this - a lot of people keep banging on about a return to proper full-blooded socialism of the sort advocated by Corbyn. That's fine, but you have to accept that things like unilateral disarmament and a liberal, inclusive attitude to immigration are part and parcel of the socialist package. That's a fact and it isn't going to change.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

Jeremy's view on the present refugee crisis. Personally, I think he makes some fair points, but that's the bleeding heart liberal in me. I very much doubt that his fan club on here would agree.
Our leaders lack courage in this refugee crisis. We are shamed by our European neighbours - Voices - The Independent

I don't agree with much of what he said. The media has jumped on the story of the pointless death of a little boy, his brother and mother. They didn't make a big headline about the family living in Turkey safe from the war for 3 years. The family then decided they could have a better life in Europe and set off across the sea.

One picture of a dead child on a beach has caused a stir but why is the problem in Syria not enough?
Why don't the media show us pictures of what is really going on?
Why do these fit young men think it is right to run away from the trouble in their own country and come here expecting us to fix it for them. They should stay and fight like our grand fathers, fathers, brothers and sons did and still do now.

Here are some pictures taken from facebook of what is really going on over there and not just on a holiday resort beach. Don't look if you don't want to see dead children and destroyed cities and homes. Why are these pictures not on the front page of the newspapers?

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by Neil

I don't agree with much of what he said. The media has jumped on the story of the pointless death of a little boy, his brother and mother. They didn't make a big headline about the family living in Turkey safe from the war for 3 years. The family then decided they could have a better life in Europe and set off across the sea

Because if they had told us that it would be plain that these are economic migrants - NOT refugees.
Refugees will make a home in the first safe place, because they are out of danger.
Refugees do not demonstrate and demand that they be allowed to travel to a country of their choice..Incidentally a non Muslim country where the culture is entirely different.
Wouldn't they be happier in Turkey, a Muslim country that is part of NATO, therefore declared free and democratic.....no of course not, they want to be part of a better economic country.
So we did not kill the mother and her two boys, the parents and the criminal traffickers are totally responsible for their deaths.
And as for all these people who want to hug a refugee...Are they doing it to feel morally superior....are they going to be responsible for feeding them, clothing them, paying for their education and their health care needs??

We should not be accepting any of these people. They do not want to be registered so that we know who they are or where they come from, they do not want to abide by the rules......and as sure as God made little apples they will want US to conform to their ideas of how society should be....More veiled women in black, more disaffected young men with the potential to do harm.

[Barrie Yates]

Sorry Margaret but Turkey is not a Muslim country it is secular and has been since modern Turkey was founded by Kemal Attaturk - therefore no religious antagonism and I have witnessed how Turks of different religions get along with each other. In one way you are correct, Islam is the major religion and so all these refugees - or at least the majority of them, could live in a country where their religion is the majority, unlike Western Europe where it is still a minority religion - for now.