Legalise "Illegal" Drugs?

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by kestrelx

Just looked on Wikipedia and it backs what I say that LSD can't kill you - that you need a massive amount to physically OD on it...

Estimates for the median lethal dose (LD50) of LSD range from 200 µg/kg to more than 1 mg/kg of human body mass, though most sources report that there are no known human cases of such an overdose. Other sources note one report of a suspected fatal overdose of LSD occurring in November 1975 in Kentucky in which there were indications that ~1/3 of a gram (320 mg or 320,000 µg) had been injected intravenously. (This is a very extraordiEstimates for the median lethal dose (LD50) of LSD range from 200 µg/kg to more than 1 mg/kg of human body mass, though most sources report that there are no known human cases of such an overdose. Other sources note one report of a suspected fatal overdose of LSD occurring in November 1975 in Kentucky in which there were indications that ~1/3 of a gram (320 mg or 320,000 µg) had been injected intravenously. (This is a very extraordinary amount, equivalent to over 3,000 times the average LSD dosage of ~100 µg).[17][18] Experiments with LSD have also been done on animals; in 1962, an elephant named Tusko died shortly after being injected with 297 mg, but whether the LSD was the cause of his death is controversial (due, in part, to a plethora of other chemical substances administered simultaneously).nary amount, equivalent to over 3,000 times the average LSD dosage of ~100 µg).[17][18] Experiments with LSD have also been done on animals; in 1962, an elephant named Tusko died shortly after being injected with 297 mg, but whether the LSD was the cause of his death is controversial (due, in part, to a plethora of other chemical substances administered simultaneously).

Lysergic acid diethylamide - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And how much did you contribute to that kestrelx

[cashman]

Originally Posted by kestrelx View Post
Your wrong I have taken LSD and it can't physically kill you unless cut with other chemicals - but in the 60's LSD was so strong it would put you on another planet. So it can be made to varying strengths. So I am talking from experience . ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- See you have NO experience at all of the state of play in the 60s, dont dispute you have taken it, probably in the "Punk Days" you have n uncanny knack of making yerself look dumb.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by cashman

Originally Posted by kestrelx View Post
Your wrong I have taken LSD and it can't physically kill you unless cut with other chemicals - but in the 60's LSD was so strong it would put you on another planet. So it can be made to varying strengths. So I am talking from experience . ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- See you have NO experience at all of the state of play in the 60s, dont dispute you have taken it, probably in the "Punk Days" you have n uncanny knack of making yerself look dumb.

Just an example cashy of why drugs shouldn't be legalised

[DaveinGermany]

Ok Kx, lets give you the fact that LSD won't kill you in itself, but you have no control over it's effects & they CAN KILL YOU ! Various governments have considered it in a military aspect, the fact that those ideas were "Canned" (really?) tells you something about the dubiousness of the Drug & its uses.

Look up "Porten Down UK" or "MK Ultra USA LSD/BZ Gas" especially footage of the British troops, not an ideal advert for legalizing such things really.

[kestrelx]

Originally Posted by cashman

you should learn to tell the TRUTH, have just highlighted where ya said it. or to give ya benefit of the doubt, yer not a liar, so i'll stick wi plonker.

Your talking rot mate! You know your wrong so your basically reverting to name calling! I repeat: LSD can't kill you in a normal dose - get your facts right. You may say to this: "it can if you take enough!" But the same can be said of water - drink enough water and that can kill you to.

So why do you have to rely in personal insults

[kestrelx]

Originally Posted by cashman

Originally Posted by kestrelx View Post
Your wrong I have taken LSD and it can't physically kill you unless cut with other chemicals - but in the 60's LSD was so strong it would put you on another planet. So it can be made to varying strengths. So I am talking from experience . ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- See you have NO experience at all of the state of play in the 60s, dont dispute you have taken it, probably in the "Punk Days" you have n uncanny knack of making yerself look dumb.

What difference does it make when I took it? That's not the issue - I know people who took a lot of LSD in the 60's. Also I have stated that LSD was not as strong in the 80's as it was in the 60's!

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by kestrelx

What difference does it make when I took it? That's not the issue -

No but we can still see the effects

[kestrelx]

Originally Posted by jaysay

No but we can still see the effects

Now you are talking out of your armpits! There is nothing I've said on here that is dodgy - until Cashman started calling me a Plonker!

Cashmen stated that LSD in a normal dose can kill you! Which is not correct. LSD used at Porton Down was obviously massive doses used to get maximum effects for use in warfare. I wish you'd get your facts right! and stop wasting my time.

[DaveinGermany]

Tolerance for LSD is short-lived it is lost if the user stops taking the drug for several days. There is no evidence that LSD produces physical withdrawal symptoms when chronic use is stopped.

Two long-term effects persistent psychosis and hallucinogen persisting perception disorder (HPPD), more commonly referred to as "flashbacks," have been associated with use of LSD. The causes of these effects, which in some users occur after a single experience with the drug, are not known.

Psychosis

The effects of LSD can be described as drug-induced psychosis-distortion or disorganization of a person's capacity to recognize reality, think rationally, or communicate with others. Some LSD users experience devastating psychological effects that persist after the trip has ended, producing a long-lasting psychotic-like state. LSD-induced persistent psychosis may include dramatic mood swings from mania to profound depression, vivid visual disturbances, and hallucinations. These effects may last for years and can affect people who have no history or other symptoms of psychological disorder.

Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder

Some former LSD users report experiences known colloquially as "flashbacks" and called "HPPD" by physicians. These episodes are spontaneous, repeated, sometimes continuous recurrences of some of the sensory distortions originally produced by LSD.

The experience may include hallucinations, but it most commonly consists of visual disturbances such as seeing false motion on the edges of the field of vision, bright or colored flashes, and halos or trails attached to moving objects. This condition is typically persistent and in some cases remains unchanged for years after individuals have stopped using the drug.

Any of this ring any bells Kx ? One minute you're raging on about something or other, the next your bleating on about people picking on you, then you're all pally, pretty much what the above says. For more details see the link below :-

Effects of LSD - What Are the Effects of LSD?

[***Mr D***]

I see the usual few are bullying again.

Dont worry Kes this is how some are on here.

I feel you lot dont really understand Todays drug culture. If LSD is your concern.

LSD is pretty harmless as a addictive drug, not that common and not a use daily type. I agree that you could end up dead, but you could end up dead going to the shop, or having a night out on the booze.

Smack, Crack, Met, Rock are the drugs that are BAD for not only the user but also the community, these are the ones that should be locked down, harsher penatlies for possession, dealing Ect. These are the addictive drugs that ruin lives.

LSD, Coke, Speed, Weed IMO are all harmless compaired to the above list. These should be looked at and laws revamped.

As I have alwawys stated I do not agree with Legalising any drugs, I would prefair Decriminlisation (Sensible).

In fact thinking on I could walk into a few shops in accrington and buy LEGAL HIGHS. that would be more harmfull that smoking a joint.
EXPLAIN that one.

Keeping recrational use drugs 100% Illegal has open a flood gate for new legal drugs (NOT FIT FOR HUMAN CONSUMTION) to be sold.

There is no easy sollution but it needs to be reviewed.

[***Mr D***]

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Tolerance for LSD is short-lived it is lost if the user stops taking the drug for several days. There is no evidence that LSD produces physical withdrawal symptoms when chronic use is stopped.

Two long-term effects persistent psychosis and hallucinogen persisting perception disorder (HPPD), more commonly referred to as "flashbacks," have been associated with use of LSD. The causes of these effects, which in some users occur after a single experience with the drug, are not known.

Psychosis

The effects of LSD can be described as drug-induced psychosis-distortion or disorganization of a person's capacity to recognize reality, think rationally, or communicate with others. Some LSD users experience devastating psychological effects that persist after the trip has ended, producing a long-lasting psychotic-like state. LSD-induced persistent psychosis may include dramatic mood swings from mania to profound depression, vivid visual disturbances, and hallucinations. These effects may last for years and can affect people who have no history or other symptoms of psychological disorder.

Hallucinogen Persisting Perception Disorder

Some former LSD users report experiences known colloquially as "flashbacks" and called "HPPD" by physicians. These episodes are spontaneous, repeated, sometimes continuous recurrences of some of the sensory distortions originally produced by LSD.

The experience may include hallucinations, but it most commonly consists of visual disturbances such as seeing false motion on the edges of the field of vision, bright or colored flashes, and halos or trails attached to moving objects. This condition is typically persistent and in some cases remains unchanged for years after individuals have stopped using the drug.

Any of this ring any bells Kx ? One minute you're raging on about something or other, the next your bleating on about people picking on you, then you're all pally, pretty much what the above says. For more details see the link below :-

Effects of LSD - What Are the Effects of LSD?

We can all copy paste.

Do you have a drinking problem?



You may have a drinking problem if you...

• Feel guilty or ashamed about your drinking.
• Lie to others or hide your drinking habits.
• Have friends or family members who are worried about your drinking.
• Need to drink in order to relax or feel better.
• “Black out” or forget what you did while you were drinking.
• Regularly drink more than you intended to.

Alcoholism and Alcohol Abuse: Signs, Symptoms, and Help for Drinking Problems

[cashman]

Originally Posted by kestrelx

You don't know what your talking about! There was not one manufacturer of this drug in the 60's so how can you know where it was made? You may know one manufacturer - for all I know that could have been someone in Accrington who was trying to be clever with his chemistry set. But LSD was made by many sources, much of it in Holland. I think you don't have a clue about it mate really. If you can't have a intelligent conversation don't waste my time!

Originally Posted by kestrelx

Ha ha ha! I said that the chemical itself can't cause death! By this I mean if someone eats rat poison? That will kill them or it least cause them serious physical pain. What is causing the pain is the chemical of rat poison! But if someone eats LSD the chemical itself will not kill you. What might kill you is the effect of an halucination that makes you jump off a building or may cause you to have some kind of mental breakdown, by making you think awful things.

Also I did not say there was no manufacturing of LSD in the 60's - I said that there was more than one manufacture of LSD in the 60's!

You should have gone to spec savers Cashman!

Originally Posted by kestrelx

Your talking rot mate! You know your wrong so your basically reverting to name calling! I repeat: LSD can't kill you in a normal dose - get your facts right. You may say to this: "it can if you take enough!" But the same can be said of water - drink enough water and that can kill you to.

So why do you have to rely in personal insults

plonker n dumb are not personal insults, but you seem to take em as such, there just a comment of yer opinion on this subject, but as ya keep bleating they are, it leaves me wi the thought that yer a tart,who takes offence at everything that don't suit, i have been called much worse on here, but don't bleat about it, so report tart if it makes ya happy.

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by ***Mr D***

We can all copy paste.

Do you have a drinking problem?



You may have a drinking problem if you...

• Feel guilty or ashamed about your drinking.
• Lie to others or hide your drinking habits.
• Have friends or family members who are worried about your drinking.
• Need to drink in order to relax or feel better.
• “Black out” or forget what you did while you were drinking.
• Regularly drink more than you intended to.

Alcoholism and Alcohol Abuse: Signs, Symptoms, and Help for Drinking Problems

Yes Mr.D we can, but if you read through KX's comments & see for yourself there appears to be these mood swings & differing attitudes that was the reasoning behind posting the extract.

As to the comments about bullying can you justify those please ? As far as I can see the comments I have made are (from my point of view) balanced & fair I haven't been derogatory or abusive that I can see, perhaps a reread of all posts & a reassessment of their contexts, might be advisable ?

[***Mr D***]

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Yes Mr.D we can, but if you read through KX's comments & see for yourself there appears to be these mood swings & differing attitudes that was the reasoning behind posting the extract.

As to the comments about bullying can you justify those please ? As far as I can see the comments I have made are (from my point of view) balanced & fair I haven't been derogatory or abusive that I can see, perhaps a reread of all posts & a reassessment of their contexts, might be advisable ?

Give over, KX's Mood swings. Thats Funny. LSD Flashback (As per you wikipidea Paste?), Thats Also funny.

Read through the thred and see how some people just join in the argument to back up there Karma Buddies. (Did I imply you was a bully) Happen reading my post again is advisable.

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by ***Mr D***

Give over, KX's Mood swings. Thats Funny. LSD Flashback (As per you wikipidea Paste?), Thats Also funny.

Read through the thred and see how some people just join in the argument to back up there Karma Buddies. (Did I imply you was a bully) Happen reading my post again is advisable.

Yes mood swings, this is displayed in the "tone" of his entries. As to the excerpt it is the following :- About.com Health's Disease and Condition content is reviewed by the Medical Review Board. I try where possible not to use Wikipedia for source information as so much is speculative.

And the charge of bullying ? You aren't specific in your accusations so I feel as though by association this is also levelled at myself. Due to the fact my comments aren't exactly agreeing with KX's points of view, he even feels this himself as he so clearly comments in I believe, post #123.

Still the main thrust of the thread is about illegal drugs in general & not specifically LSD, it is just one of the usual divergences that so often happens in these threads that we appear to be focusing on LSD.