Living off the fat of the land.

[katex]

Think this may help :-

http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...tion_Panel.pdf

[Bernard Dawson]

I do suggest there is an issue other than the actual travel allowance rises, and that is whether all these trips are absolutely necessary. An instance of this is every year, four councillors plus an officer attend the Local Government Conference which is usually held somewhere by the seaside. This to me is excessive

[katex]

Originally Posted by Robert Owen

I do suggest there is an issue other than the actual travel allowance rises, and that is whether all these trips are absolutely necessary. An instance of this is every year, four councillors plus an officer attend the Local Government Conference which is usually held somewhere by the seaside. This to me is excessive

We would have to have further details Robert before making judgement .. think they have to seek approval from full council for these events, and probably councillors from different parties attended ?? Don't know.

Sorry, but to me, sounds like a must for Local Government officials.

Still, in business, when a company sent lots of their staff to Conferences, was always viewed as .. "They obviously won't miss this lot at home" Is different though.

In case anyone couldn't open the PDF file I put up, the Independent Board consisted of :-

Phillip Norris - Retired Headmaster.
John Davis - Businessman.
Frank Whitehead - Retired Local Government Chief Officer.
Miss Rahila Hussain . Connexions.

Guess what you would call respected members of the Public.

These were the recommendations accepted . bit long ... LOL.

http://www.hyndburnbc.gov.uk/downloa...ces_Scheme.pdf

[garinda]

Thanks for that Katex x
The file wouldn't open for me.

The more I think about it, the more I can see a need for allowance limits to be set the same for every council in the country. None of this would be a political issue then.

I wonder what criteria the people named on the independent panel used to arrive at their findings? It certainly wasn't inflation.

I wonder why the councils of Burnley and the Ribble Valley have different allowance limits?

Have they also been assessed?

Surely the allowance needs for a councillor from the Ribble Valley are no different from those of a Hyndburn councillor?

I wonder if the independent panel claimed expenses, whilst carrying out this review, and how much their tea and biscuits cost us?

[katex]

Originally Posted by garinda

I wonder if the independent panel claimed expenses, whilst carrying out this review, and how much their tea and biscuits cost us?

Yer never 'appy are you .....

Seems, according to someone I know attending a meeting this week, the HBC put on a very nice lunch ... including Cakes !!

[garinda]

Originally Posted by katex

Yer never 'appy are you .....

Seems, according to someone I know attending a meeting this week, the HBC put on a very nice lunch ... including Cakes !!

The comment was tongue in cheek.

If they are doing a job of course they should be able to claim expenses, and shouldn't be out of pocket.

What I don't understand is why Hyndburn was singled out to have an independent panel assess it's allowances, or did H.B.C. instigate it?:

Four people could assess, and then recommend the limits for the allowances, that are then applicable to every council in the country.

Individual councils could then decide how much of their allowance they take, the sensible ones showing thrift, and visa versa.

I see don't understand why some of our councillors have voted to award themselves an upper limit, which is a lot less than the limit in Burnley and the Ribble Valley.

The whole thing still stinks, in my opinion.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by garinda

I wonder why the councils of Burnley and the Ribble Valley have different allowance limits?

Does it matter? It is a limit not a target and I hope if people were always claiming the top amount something would be said to them.

[Bernard Dawson]

Katex There are Councillors from different parties that attend the Local Government Conference. My point is does really need four Councillors to attend the conference. Lancashire County Council by the way also send Councillors to the conference.

The conference also lasts for three days. That adds up to quite a lot of ratepayers money

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Neil

Does it matter? It is a limit not a target and I hope if people were always claiming the top amount something would be said to them.

Yes it does matter.

As I said earler, the cost of a hotel, or a meal in Harrogate, is the same if you're a councillor from Hyndburn or the Ribble Valley.

In theory the limit should be the same.

How much is taken is then up to the individual councillor.

Other councils appear to manage very well with a lower upper limit than Hyndburn, so voting to increase the limit in Hynburn by such a great a percentage, seems crass to say the very least.

[garinda]

Whilst having a Google this came up from five years ago.

Cllr Peter Britcliffe leader of Hyndburn Council called for councillors' expenses to reflect their individual workloads. He was keen to adopt a performance-related pay scheme instead of paying all councillors the same £3100 basic allowance per year

Expenses review for councillors

Perhaps the related performance of H.B.C. explains why Hyndburn deserves a higher limited allowance than say the Ribble Valley...it's because they're worth it.

[shillelagh]

Ive been out today and got the accy observer and rossendale free press ...anyway i was reading the accy observer and there is a notice in it what the independent review body recommended and what the councillors have agreed. Its on page 19 if you are interested.

Review body:
Remove cap on carers allowance claims
New allowance for chair audit committee (£742)
Evening meal allowance of £15 in Lancashire and £20 elsewhere
Overnight accomodation allowance of up to £170 per night in London and £145 elsewhere
All other allowances to increase in line with inflation

The council has considered these recommendations and accepted some of them but not others the revisions to be made to the members allowance scheme from 1st april 2009 are as follows:

Remove cap on carers allowance claims
New allowance for chair Audit committee (£742)
Evening meal allowance of £25
Overnight accommodation of up to £170 per night in london and £145 per night elsewhere
All other allowances to increase in line with inflation


They've agreed with nearly all of the recommendations that the review body brought up ... except for the meal allowance - the review body says £15 in lancashire and £20 elsewhere - but the council have put it up to £25 no matter where they are.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by shillelagh

Ive been out today and got the accy observer and rossendale free press ...anyway i was reading the accy observer and there is a notice in it what the independent review body recommended and what the councillors have agreed. Its on page 19 if you are interested.

Review body:
Remove cap on carers allowance claims
New allowance for chair audit committee (£742)
Evening meal allowance of £15 in Lancashire and £20 elsewhere
Overnight accomodation allowance of up to £170 per night in London and £145 elsewhere
All other allowances to increase in line with inflation

The council has considered these recommendations and accepted some of them but not others the revisions to be made to the members allowance scheme from 1st april 2009 are as follows:

Remove cap on carers allowance claims
New allowance for chair Audit committee (£742)
Evening meal allowance of £25
Overnight accommodation of up to £170 per night in london and £145 per night elsewhere
All other allowances to increase in line with inflation


They've agreed with nearly all of the recommendations that the review body brought up ... except for the meal allowance - the review body says £15 in lancashire and £20 elsewhere - but the council have put it up to £25 no matter where they are.

That does seem odd.

Especially now we are told by Jaysay that his pal, Cllr. Britcliffe, actually only spent £12.30 on his meal whilst on his recent London trip.

I wonder how he can justify ignoring the independent body's recommendation that the upper limit should be £15, and £20 for London, when he's proved he can feed himself for much less, and without the need for a tourist guide he suggests someone should write?

[andrewb]

Originally Posted by g jones

I voted against that rise and every rise since 2002 above inflation. So have the Independents. Everyone has then accepted them after the vote has been lost to the Conservatives. Bare in mind I lose about £7,000 in lost wages at my place of work to be on the Council. In that respect the The Council (Conservatives) have a point.

Why accept them after the vote is lost? If you're principled and the expenses increase are not needed (which you don't think they are or you wouldn't vote against them, right?), then why do you not show the Conservatives up and not take the increases. By taking the increases you infer that they're required, so voting against them to look good is pretty deceptive.

What a shame that you have £7,000 in lost wages. You could always give up being a councillor if its not for you. You get £6,747 for being leader of the opposition, £742 for being on the planning committee, that makes £7,489. Plus all the expenses that go with it. I'm not sure if there's anything else. Not only this but you get to represent the people of Hyndburn. Not a bad deal I must say.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by andrewb

Why accept them after the vote is lost? If you're principled and the expenses increase are not needed (which you don't think they are or you wouldn't vote against them, right?), then why do you not show the Conservatives up and not take the increases. By taking the increases you infer that they're required, so voting against them to look good is pretty deceptive.

What a shame that you have £7,000 in lost wages. You could always give up being a councillor if its not for you. You get £6,747 for being leader of the opposition, £742 for being on the planning committee, that makes £7,489. Plus all the expenses that go with it. I'm not sure if there's anything else. Not only this but you get to represent the people of Hyndburn. Not a bad deal I must say.

Perhap's he's holding out to see if he can hit the jackpot, and secure the recently awarded expenses the leader of the Council claims, to make up for the shortfall in his income.

Expenses rise sparks fury in council chamber - News - Accrington Observer

[andrewb]

Originally Posted by garinda

Perhap's he's holding out to see if he can hit the jackpot, and secure the recently awarded expenses the leader of the Council claims, to make up for the shortfall in his income.

Expenses rise sparks fury in council chamber - News - Accrington Observer

Expenses and allowances should be independently set. Period.