Men (or Women) on Mars

[accyman]

Originally Posted by katex

What puzzles me is, if the Apollo didn't go to the moon, where did it go ? Into orbit whilst they played a pre-recorded landing, to come down again when prompted. Surely it would have been spotted and tracked easily just going around the Earth for days ?

no idea

these days with all the satelites in orbit nothing could get missed but 40 years ago technology would have been very limited and restricted so god knows what limitations there were back then

mr spoon made countless trips to the moon in the 80's and not once did n.a.s.a pick up one of his flights so if america cant spot a giant heinz baked bean tin with a huge funnel on the top of it hurtling towards teh moon what chances did russia have of seeing apollo

[MargaretR]

Originally Posted by accyman

no idea

what chances did russia have of seeing apollo

Amongst all the websites I read I recall reading that 2 Russian scientists were told to track it and were sacked when they didn't (couldn't?)

[katex]

Originally Posted by accyman

mr spoon made countless trips to the moon in the 80's and not once did n.a.s.a pick up one of his flights so if america cant spot a giant heinz baked bean tin with a huge funnel on the top of it hurtling towards teh moon what chances did russia have of seeing apollo

Ya daft plonker .....

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by katex

What puzzles me is, if the Apollo didn't go to the moon, where did it go ? Into orbit whilst they played a pre-recorded landing, to come down again when prompted. Surely it would have been spotted and tracked easily just going around the Earth for days ?

Ya its not like thy could hide a space craft in a garage whilst it was ready for re-entry, the Ruskies must have monitor every move of every mission, unless they were in on the bluff too

[Guinness]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

Amongst all the websites I read I recall reading that 2 Russian scientists were told to track it and were sacked when they didn't (couldn't?)

Russia knew exactly where Apollo 11 was. Recording from Jodrell Bank.

http://www.jb.man.ac.uk/news/2009/luna15-apollo11/


I also notice that you declined to comment when I totally disproved your statement :-

'Some of the Eleven Apollo astronauts had non space related fatal accidents within a twenty two month period of one another, the odds of this happening are 1 in 10,000...coincidence?'

In fact you disproved it yourself on a later post where you listed some 20 odd astronauts were involved.

Problem with conspiracy theorists is that when you face them with the facts they tend to ignore them anyway.

[MargaretR]

A search for truth is never ending.
I am open to new 'facts' all the time.
At present I believe they did not land.
The Jodrell Bank evidence is interesting, but the proven capacity of governments to perpetrate massive deception, sways me to doubt it.

When lie telling on a huge scale happens in other areas, i begin to regard all 'news' as propoganda.

The deaths of astronauts reported on that link appear an exaggeration, I agree
Edward Givens Died June 6, 1967 Car accident near Houston, Texas
Clifton Williams Died October 5, 1967 Plane crash near Tallahassee, Florida
These are the two I traced, which happened within a very short time.
I have no doubt that governments do 'eliminate' people who threaten to 'upset the applecart'.

Even the death of a munitions expert by suicide is about to be reinvestigated.

There are so many lies told that I despair of ever finding out the truth.
All I have to rely on is my intuition - which is the only way left to many of us.

[MargaretR]

Have you considered why there are so many conspiracy theories going the rounds?
It is because the public has better access to info via the internet and Freedom of Information law.
Some past historic events have been revealed in their true light to be engineered by governments to create situations which happen to suit their purpose at the time.

So, like the boy who cried 'wolf', they cannot be expected to be believed all the time.
If the doubt escalates into widespread 'belief', it is labelled 'conspiracy theory', and derided.
When 'derision' happens, I tend to look for a reason for that too.

Whilst the world is ruled via greed for power and wealth, and deliberate lies
to mislead the population in order to achieve those aims
there will always be those that doubt - I regard it as healthy mistrust.

[Boeing Guy]

The Apollo missions were tracked by the Soviets, yet again some fuzzy ideas here....
Proof, okay this article here, in Russian:

"Ìû «âèäåëè», êàê àìåðèêàíöû ñàäèëèñü íà Ëóíó..." «Íîâîñòè êîñìîíàâòèêè» çà äåêàáðü 2005 ã.

I cannot speak Russian either, but thanks to a web site written by physicist's, here is a literal translation.
Translated:

We "saw",
As Americans
Sat down on the Moon...
E.Molotov specially
For " News of astronautics "

Whether clause(article) of the participant of events of 30-years prescription of E.P.Molotova offered(suggested) to readers throws light on unknown pages of " lunar race " and finally closes a ridiculous question " there Were Americans on the Moon? "

Has passed more than 30 years since as the most expensive race between Soviet Union and the United States of America for superiority(championship) in landing the person to the Moon has been developed(unwrapped). Who has won this race of prestige - it is known. Many events have taken place for this time...

Process of competition was repeatedly described both American, and the Russian party(side). It is represented to us interesting to tell about one of it(him) of earlier not shined(covered) episodes.

Programs of preparation of landing of the person on the Moon in the USSR (flight УР-500 - Л-1, landing(planting) Н-1 - Л-3) and in the USA ("Apollo") were conducted in parallel, and superiority(championship) had powerful political value. The Soviet management(manual) paid the big attention to a state of affairs with realization of the lunar program both in Soviet Union, and in America. For the objective control over performance of the American program the secretary of the Central Committee of the CPSU D.F.Ustinov supervising the defensive industry of the country, at the end of 1967 has entrusted main designer РНИИ КП (at that time SCIENTIFIC RESEARCH INSTITUTE - 885) M.S.Rjazanskomu to develop a special control radio engineering complex with which help it would be possible to accept signals from the American spacecrafts of the program "Apollo", making flight of the Moon and landing(planting) to its(her) surface.

M.S.Rjazansky at that time was responsible for creation of onboard and ground radio engineering control facilities by spacecrafts of the Soviet lunar program. Under his(its) management(manual) for management Soviet пилотируемыми and automatic spacecrafts for research of the Moon the Ground complex of management including two control centres by flight, six ground and three ship items(points) of the management, equipped with corresponding stations of tracking and located on territory of Soviet Union and in the certain points of World ocean has been created. However these means could not be used for reception of the information from the ships "Apollo" as they worked in the other frequency range with the signals having other structure. Therefore it was necessary to create the special control complex, capable to provide reception of the data from "Apollos". It was supposed to accept from the American spacecrafts not only telephone (voice) and telemetering, but also the television information.

Has been solved to include in a control complex aerial TNA-400 with diameter of a mirror 32 m which was placed in Crimea, near to Simferopol (fig. 1). She(it) was used as the reception aerial of a radio engineering complex "Saturn - МС" providing management by the Soviet automatic space vehicles for research of the Moon later: "Moon rovers", devices for delivery of a lunar ground to the Earth, and also lunar satellites.

For work in structure of a control complex aerial TNA-400 has been equipped малошумящим with the reception device working in a range of 13 sm (range S in which transmitters of lunar modules of the program "Apollo" worked). Besides in structure of a complex have come: the demodulator of a group signal transmitted on bearing(carrying) frequency and the signals transmitted on поднесущих frequencies, the equipment of allocation of the voice, telemetering and television information, and also the equipment of display and management of a complex (fig. 2).

The control complex created in short terms РНИИ КП in cooperation with the several industrial enterprises, was ready to reception of signals from spacecrafts of the program "Apollo" in November, 1968.

To trace the ships at their flight on orbits around of the Moon and at landing(planting) to its(her) surface, it was necessary to have the ballistic data of these orbits for calculation целеуказаний to the aerial. However such data were not published by Americans. Therefore the data on orbits of flight were calculated by ballistics on the basis of time of start and arrival to the Moon of the ships "Apollo" which informed by the American radio. On these data paid off целеуказания for prompting the aerial which were specified on signals accepted by a control complex from the lunar ships.

Such approach to calculation целеуказаний has allowed to accept reliably enough signals from "Apollos". The problem(task) of search of signals was facilitated by that the diagram of an orientation of the aerial covered practically half of disk of the Moon.

Tracking was conducted behind spacecrafts of expeditions(dispatches) "Apollo - 8", "Apollo - 10", "Apollo - 11" and "Apollo - 12" from December, 1968 till November, 1969.
From all these ships telephone conversations of astronauts with the Earth and the telemetering information on a condition of onboard systems were accepted with high quality. The accepted television signal had poor quality because of an insufficient level of an energy potential of a radioline on the basis of the 32-meter aerial.

It is necessary to note, that the American network of tracking and management provided practically round-the-clock communication(connection) with spacecrafts "Apollo" while the Soviet control complex could accept signals only in that part of the visibility range which on time coincided with a visibility range of the Madrid station of tracking.

Lunar expedition(dispatch) under F.Bormana's management(manual) on a spacecraft "Apollo - 8" in December, 1968 has carried out the first пилотируемый flight to the Moon, has made 10 coils around of it(her) and, having come back to the Earth with the second space speed, has made soft landing(planting) at ocean.

This flight has formed the basis for a stop of works on the first stage of Soviet program Л-1 though all technics(technical equipment) and crews to пилотируемому to flight of the Moon by then were ready.

Flight of crew "Apollo - 11" with an output(exit) on a surface of the Moon on July, 20, 1969. N.Armstronga and E.Oldrina has finally stopped competition on landing the person to the Moon.

On fig. 3 photos of spectra of the signals accepted by control station from spacecrafts "Apollo", made with the screen of the videocontrol device are submitted.

On fig. 4 the image of rising of the Earth above the lunar horizon, accepted on a telechannel from one of the ships "Apollo" is shown.

As is known, after that Soviet Union has directed the efforts to research of the Moon by automatic space vehicles therefore impressing results have been received.

In summary we shall note, that data on creation and functioning of the Soviet special control radio engineering complex were not published earlier.


Now I know this is still not enough, so have a look at this and all the references on it.
Third-party evidence for Apollo Moon landings - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I am sure you Hoaxer's amongst us will still have more arguments. Still never mind the earth was once believed to be flat....

[garinda]

Originally Posted by MargaretR

Have you considered why there are so many conspiracy theories going the rounds?

Probably the same reason man as sought answers from the numerous religions that he created since the dawn of time, when we as a species began to think of things other than food and shelter
...human frailty.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by garinda

Probably the same reason man as sought answers from the numerous religions that he created since the dawn of time, when we as a species began to think of things other than food and shelter
...human frailty.

Interesting theory ... And I thought that we were just going thro' a period in history when there is an overabundance of nutbars.

[ossy kid]

What a bleedin load of codswollop, but I suppose when you,re trying to convince the world that your con actually happened you have to go overboard. Just like the moon landing hoax, here they go again trying to baffle you with B.S. There isn,t one item in the whole pile of "proof" which could not be fabricated, as was the case 40 years ago. Fortunately common sense can still prevail. 40 years ago America did not have the technology to do what they claimed and, had you been there, you wouldn,t be on their bandwaggon today.

[steeljack]

whenever the conspiricy theorists get going I'm allways reminded of this guy

Edward Makuka Nkoloso - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[garinda]

Originally Posted by steeljack

whenever the conspiricy theorists get going I'm allways reminded of this guy

Edward Makuka Nkoloso - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I'm always reminded that it seems to evoke the same sort of mad fervour that religion elicits in many others.

Keep the faith.

[Boeing Guy]

hehehehehe

[Mancie]

Originally Posted by ossy kid

What a bleedin load of codswollop, but I suppose when you,re trying to convince the world that your con actually happened you have to go overboard. Just like the moon landing hoax, here they go again trying to baffle you with B.S. There isn,t one item in the whole pile of "proof" which could not be fabricated, as was the case 40 years ago. Fortunately common sense can still prevail. 40 years ago America did not have the technology to do what they claimed and, had you been there, you wouldn,t be on their bandwaggon today.

So now you know..we are all stupid..according to the leading historian of technology in the 1960's.. Ossykid...did they have Playstations in those days?