Police and Crime Commissioner elections

[susie123]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

So Clive Grunshaw...a resident of Fleetwood is going to be our new Police and Crime Commissioner at a salary of £85,000 per annum.

Fleetwood...is that local? Will he understand the policing needs of Hyndburn?
More to the point will he be interested in the policing needs of anywhere other than his local (wyre borough) area. Call me cynical, but I don't think he will.

No doubt folks from Fleetwood would be saying the same if a Hyndburn resident had been elected. At least he is already a member of Lancashire Police Authority.

[Lucysgirl]

I was told that the winner had to have 50% of the first votes cast - if this percentage wasn't reached then the 2nd choices would be taken into account.

BTW I see John Prescott didn't get in

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by susie123

No doubt folks from Fleetwood would be saying the same if a Hyndburn resident had been elected. At least he is already a member of Lancashire Police Authority.

Yes, Sue I am sure they would....and your comment underlines why I think this position is useless....just a sop to let us think we can have any influence on how things will be managed.
The money would be better spent malking sure there is easy access to police services.
Small towns are having their police stations closed down.

I saw nothing from any of the candidates, and if I had not the facility to go online I would have known absolutely nothing about them...and what I found online was not particularly helpful.
The management of the election was abysmal. If the candidates appear(prior to election) to have no interest in the areas they are going to represent, then it doesn't give those whose votes they rely on, any confidence in voting for them.

Just my point of view.
And my reason for not voting...it wasn't apathy, but lack of relevant information to make a choice.

[churchfcrules]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Yes, Sue I am sure they would....and your comment underlines why I think this position is useless....just a sop to let us think we can have any influence on how things will be managed.
The money would be better spent malking sure there is easy access to police services.
Small towns are having their police stations closed down.

I saw nothing from any of the candidates, and if I had not the facility to go online I would have known absolutely nothing about them...and what I found online was not particularly helpful.
The management of the election was abysmal. If the candidates appear(prior to election) to have no interest in the areas they are going to represent, then it doesn't give those whose votes they rely on, any confidence in voting for them.

Just my point of view.
And my reason for not voting...it wasn't apathy, but lack of relevant information to make a choice.

yes, nice to see they couldnt be bothered spending any of their money on any sort of campaign, only ours on the salary, tv adverts, polling etc, woulld have been much better spent on the ground

[DaveinGermany]

And the talk now is about throwing good money after bad. The electoral commission are going to start an enquiry as to why it was such a shoddy affair ?? Do they really need an enquiry ? 5 minutes with a pad & pencil, talking to real people, who live in the real world, will give them all the answers they need & so much more .................. unbelievable !

[katex]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

And my reason for not voting...it wasn't apathy, but lack of relevant information to make a choice.

I am one of the few who did vote. I agree with everybody's thoughts about this, lack of information about the candidates, political affiliation, should there be such an appointment in the first place.

Was still puzzling as I got to the booth, however, there was one candidate who made a statement about something I agreed with and voted on that basis.

It was going to happen anyway and cast a vote on that premise, and also in respect to our ancestors who worked hard to give us a democratic government.

[Margaret Pilkington]

I respect our ancestors who worked to give us a democratic government, but somewhere along the way it has gone badly wrong...I thought that democracy meant that you listened to the views of the electorate.....not disregarded them. I don't feel that the electorate are listened to...and that we are given these opportunities to make us think our input matters...when quite clearly it does not have any impact
On the front of the Lancashire Telegraph today it says 'LABOUR WIN POLICE POLL'

That is my biggest gripe.......that politics are being inserted into an organisation which should be above any political wranglings......that and the fact that this money should be being spent on 'putting feet on the street'.

It seems to me that the electorate have no confidence in the political parties...so it comes as no surprise at all that there was such an appalling low turn out.

[MargaretR]

Not voting is the withdrawal of 'consent to be governed'

Consent of the governed - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Consent of the governed" is a phrase synonymous with a political theory where in a government's legitimacy and moral right to use state power is only justified and legal when derived from the people or society over which that political power is exercised. This theory of "consent" is historically contrasted to the divine right of kings and has often been invoked against the legitimacy of colonialism. Article 21 of the Universal Declaration of Human Rights states that "The will of the people shall be the basis of the authority of government."

When consent is witheld the legitimacy of the policy is in doubt - ie. the mandate has not been approved.
Mandate (politics) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The legitimacy of imposing police commissioners onto the population is in doubt.

[DaveinGermany]

All well & good MargR, but then, who or what is the answer ?

[MargaretR]

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

All well & good MargR, but then, who or what is the answer ?

In areas where voting turn out is less than 50%, the previous system should remain in force.

[katex]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

On the front of the Lancashire Telegraph today it says 'LABOUR WIN POLICE POLL'


It seems to me that the electorate have no confidence in the political parties...so it comes as no surprise at all that there was such an appalling low turn out.

I do so agree ... a very controversial headline in most people's heads.

We did, however, vote the present Government into power and they seem to have this right to decide on a Police Commissioner. You never know, could be a good thing at the end of the day.

Did appear to sneak up on us though, didn't it, giving us very little time to object to the proposal.

[MargaretR]

I do not think that the appointment of police commissioners was in the tory mandate presented to us at the general election.

Mandate (politics) - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"The concept of a government having a legitimate mandate to govern via the fair winning of a democratic election is a central idea of democracy. New governments who attempt to introduce policies that they did not make public during an election campaign are said to not have a legitimate mandate to implement such policies."

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by katex

I do so agree ... a very controversial headline in most people's heads.

We did, however, vote the present Government into power and they seem to have this right to decide on a Police Commissioner. You never know, could be a good thing at the end of the day.

Did appear to sneak up on us though, didn't it, giving us very little time to object to the proposal.

I'm not sure that it snook up on us...but there was very little canvassing done by the prospective candidates. I received no information through my letterbox about any of the four candidates.......and no-one came door to door canvassing.
This leads me to believe that our views are not important.
And if candidates appear to have no real committment to those who are putting the cross on the ballot paper, you can be pretty sure they aren't going to be interested in doing anything for the electorate once they are elected.

I am very disillusioned by the whole system......if voting changes nothing then not voting has to be tried...just to see if it will make those in power sit up and take notice......if this doesn't work, then we might be in for a revolution.

[MargaretR]

The historic method of revolution - violence - isn't a desirable option.

The police and the army have high tech weaponry to disable any protestors.

A policy of non cooperation is a way.
Abstaining from voting might cause a 'vote of no confidence' in parliament, and a general election.

If the same corrupt and blackmailed politicians are put forward as candidates, you have the choice to abstain yet again.

The existing mechanisms of government will continue to operate - tax collection and benefit distribution are done by the civil service, but no new legislation would be passed.

Belgium didn't have a government for a long time and their population survived

[Margaret Pilkington]

Margaret, I do not advocate a revolution based on violence...not even civil disobedience.
Just one where the population sees the bloated political system as a fraud......to dupe those who feel they can make a difference by voting. When experience should tell them that their vote and their voice means very little.
Would - be politicians are good at making promises, but not good on the delivery of them.

I am fed up of dining on a breakfast of hope but remaining hungry at suppertime.