Positive discrimination flourishes in Hyndburn.

garinda · 31-07-2007, 11:07

I have a real bug bear against positive discrimination. I think it is divisive, and creates more problems than it ever solves.

Both Moorhead and Rhyddings are taking part in this government sponsored scheme, to encourage Pakistani and Bangladeshi school girls to pursue a career in science or engineering.

Children of all backgrounds, regardless of sex or ethnic background, should have the same availability to education of all kinds. In my opinion if they don't the system needs changing, rather than the targeting any specific group.

I seriously think initatives such as this stir up all kinds of resentment, and should be stopped, especially when we are all paying for it. Education should be equally accessible to all.

Daily Times - Leading News Resource of Pakistan

slinky · 31-07-2007, 11:12

I agree!! you never hear them saying " I think all the British/white people should take up I.T, and pursue jobs after they leave school in this area"

NO cos that would discriminate against the majority wouldn't it?? - OOOOP's did I say majority I mean Minority!!

garinda · 31-07-2007, 11:12

Before anyone accuses me of racism, I'd be against schemes like this which targeted any specific group.

Happily the days when girls did cookery whilst boys did metalwork, are long since gone.

flashy · 31-07-2007, 11:12

well said rindy, karma sent

Gayle · 31-07-2007, 11:12

Whilst I agree with you in lots of ways on this (for instance I would have been upset during the selection process for the election, when I stood for council, if they'd have suggested a woman only candidate list), there is the other side of the coin. They've identified that Asian women aren't taking up those courses so they're positively promoting it to them as an option - I suppose the cut off point would be whether a mediocre Asian woman gets on a course and a talented bloke didn't. But if it's just trying to encourage a few more to apply then I suppose I'd be in support of that because all that's really doing is promoting equal opportunities.

garinda · 31-07-2007, 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

Whilst I agree with you in lots of ways on this (for instance I would have been upset during the selection process for the election, when I stood for council, if they'd have suggested a woman only candidate list), there is the other side of the coin. They've identified that Asian women aren't taking up those courses so they're positively promoting it to them as an option - I suppose the cut off point would be whether a mediocre Asian woman gets on a course and a talented bloke didn't. But if it's just trying to encourage a few more to apply then I suppose I'd be in support of that because all that's really doing is promoting equal opportunities.

I fear we're going to disagree on this point. All areas of education shoud be available for all young people to study.

What next?

Chinese lesbian students aren't going into floristry? Better start a course to help them.

In my opinion all positive discrimination is wrong. In areas were it is practised it invariably fails. The best person should always get the job, regardless of sex or ethnicity, and if they don't it's patronising and morally wrong.

Gayle · 31-07-2007, 11:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

I fear we're going to disagree on this point. All areas of education shoud be available for all young people to study.

I have to disagree with you, I think we're agreeing - totally.

All, I'm saying is that one group of people (Asian girls) haven't taken up the courses and so should be told that they can. However, if the selection process were to choose them over a talented boy simply because of who they were then I don't like that.

In other words, I approve of positive promotion but not positive selection.

slinky · 31-07-2007, 11:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

Chinese lesbian students aren't going into floristry? Better start a course to help them.

LMAO!!!!

Oh what a shame I have to spread it around a bit ( karma) That cracked me up.

lancsdave · 31-07-2007, 11:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

All, I'm saying is that one group of people (Asian girls) haven't taken up the courses and so should be told that they can.

Given that the same information about courses is given to them as anybody else then I would say an inability to be able to read English would not be a good asset

garinda · 31-07-2007, 11:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

That's the point that we're agreeing on - totally.

All, I'm saying is that one group of people (Asian girls) haven't taken up the courses and so should be told that they can. However, if the selection process were to choose them over a talented boy simply because of who they were then I don't like that.

If girls, regardless of ethnic backgroud, weren't allowed to study certain subjects such as I.T. and engineering, I'd argue that that was wrong, and the system should be changed. This is not the case. All young people have equal access to all areas of education, and I think schemes like this are totally wrong.

Gayle · 31-07-2007, 11:28

I think the word that I'm picking up on is 'encourage' - I see nothing wrong with encouraging girls to compete with boys in all subjects and telling them that they are perfectly capable of doing subjects that they have not traditionally gone for. Just as I would 'encourage' boys to take up dance or fashion.

garinda · 31-07-2007, 11:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gayle

I think the word that I'm picking up on is 'encourage' - I see nothing wrong with encouraging girls to compete with boys in all subjects and telling them that they are perfectly capable of doing subjects that they have not traditionally gone for.

That should be, and is being done in an all inclusive way. If girls weren't studying these subjects now, there maybe an argument for this. This quite rightly isn't the case.

garinda · 31-07-2007, 11:36

If there was a scheme to encourage white boys to study medecine because they were under represented, there would be quite rightly a massive protest.

Ianto.W. · 31-07-2007, 11:38

Golden Crest awards for making, bath bombs and jewelry? the jewelry I can understand, but not the 'Bath Bombs', what are these for?

entwisi · 31-07-2007, 11:40

Last year I signed up to a scheme to go into schools and help girls become interested in IT Its a goverment sponsored scheme called "Computer Club 4 Girls". It was supported by my then employers and I was effectively allowed to do up to 2 hours/month in helping at schools who wanted to partake in teh scheme. There was never any mention or emphasis put on what race or religion thE girls had to be. I had to undergo CRB checks, training on the scheme and what it aimed to do etc. Unfortuantely I left that company before it got in full swing but I have emailed my new employers to see if I can continue this work under our Charity volunteering scheme.

I believe that we can and should encourage people EQUALLY to partake in courses and training where there are identified shortages but we should never focus on a paricular demographic as this is unfair on the others.