Referendum is a load of crap.!! - Page 126

cashman · 09-07-2018, 06:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

A decent man steps down because of DisMay & her petulant attitude, there were also two others

https://www.breitbart.com/london/201...s-own-country/

DisMay needs to go now! And according to the rumour mill the 1922 committee is getting a fair bit of mail, the sooner the useless mare is gone the better, but the replacement MUST be an out & out Brexiteer!

I agree Dave she was always a bull****ting remainer,imho, trouble is who is going to get us out of this damn thing? too many after lining their own pockets to get it through i think.

monkey hanger · 09-07-2018, 07:50

it will happen cashy but still not in the way we voted for. that is the problem for as i see it we will be only out of the club in name only and all the rubbish the EU has given us will continue. brown envelopes all around.

Exile on Spencer St · 09-07-2018, 12:25

So, after two wasted years of dissembling, May has finally revealed herself to be just another lying politician.
Don't know what the Leavers in the Tory party now have to lose. If May an Hammond get their way the UK will become even more enslaved to the Holy Roman EU, but the Tories will be decimated at the next election.
Might as well go for an internal coup now and get her out as May really must be delusional if, at the next election, she thinks that those 'old, stupid, racist' (BBC sic) Tory voters who also voted leave will forget and forgive her betrayal.

Margaret Pilkington · 09-07-2018, 13:23

The proposals made at the Chequers meeting would NEVER be acceptable to those so called negotiators at the EU....so we would have ended up with a 'no deal' situation.

Who is there that could be trusted to govern if TM is unseated?
I cannot see anyone that I would trust.
All that said, I do think that David Davis was left with very little choice.
I could not sign up to something that went against my principles.

cashman · 09-07-2018, 13:53

No Deal to me is much better than this load of crap, but doubt very much if they mean it.

Exile on Spencer St · 09-07-2018, 14:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

....Who is there that could be trusted to govern if TM is unseated?
I cannot see anyone that I would trust.

Margaret, you're right.
The inevitable (if not deliberate) diminishing of Parliament since the political rise of the EU and the 'federalisation' of the UK under both main parties has left Parliament little better than a glorified English County Council. No wonder there are so many paltry politicians.
But the worrying question is not who is there to govern but exactly what will they be governing if, as seems increasingly likely, May and her Quisling civil service renege on what the British electorate voted for.

cashman · 09-07-2018, 14:24

Boris has also resigned they should remove T.M. pretty damn quick. and appoint one of the Leavers, nobody can do a worse job than May. simple as.

Less · 09-07-2018, 15:00

Two years on, I'm getting a little weary and confused.

I seem to remember voting stay or leave being the choice, the majority voted leave, when did that choice get watered down to begging the EU to let us leave nicely?

That perhaps should have been a third choice on the ballot sheet?

As it is I want to stick by my guns and I hope other leave voters are the same, (we are leavers not brexiters like the press have branded us).
We leave and let the continent struggle on its own, they need us more than we need them.
Otherwise they wouldn't make it so difficult would they?

Margaret Pilkington · 09-07-2018, 15:18

I am with you on that one Less.
I am a leaver too...not a Brexiteer....and I do not like the way those in the elite use this term sneeringly to criticise our choice. Implying that we have the brains of a goldfish.

It is the civil servants(who never wanted to leave the EU anyway) who determine policy....not as we might believe, politicians.
These civil servants are NOT elected....they work for the government in power...regardless of who that is....so it begs the question....
Why do we have elections?
Why do we have political parties.....
Why do we bother to vote at all if our vote makes so little difference?

The proposals put forward at Chequers would not have got us any kind of deal in the EU....because there IS NO DEAL to be had....that has been crystal clear from the outset.

This means that we pay nothing and leave with no customs agreement, no single market.
To me, that is preferable than a deal which ties us to the EU as a feudal state in perpetuity.

cashman · 09-07-2018, 15:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Why do we have elections?
Why do we have political parties.....
Why do we bother to vote at all if our vote makes so little difference?.

Why indeed? i wonder the same,

Less · 09-07-2018, 16:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Less

Two years on, I'm getting a little weary and confused.

I seem to remember voting stay or leave being the choice, the majority voted leave, when did that choice get watered down to begging the EU to let us leave nicely?

That perhaps should have been a third choice on the ballot sheet?

As it is I want to stick by my guns and I hope other leave voters are the same, (we are leavers not brexiters like the press have branded us).
We leave and let the continent struggle on its own, they need us more than we need them.
Otherwise they wouldn't make it so difficult would they?

There are some that may say the above is a rather simplistic point of view, I would agree with them, the reason it's simplistic is simple, we were offered stay or leave, had the powers that be any fore site and considered that the vote might have gone the way it did, no doubt they would have found a way not to offer us this choice in the first place, because, as has been proven over the last two years, they had no plans put into place in case this was the result.

They expected a nice little whimpering STAY from the electorate, this has given them pause for thought and left them wondering what on Earth can they do?

Well I think two years is long enough for a pause, if they haven't got an idea together it's time for them all to go.

Give us a general election with truthful manifesto's about how we are going to say screw you EU this is us and we'll find other markets to deal with, (just like so many citizens of Accrington now go to Bury or Burnley markets rather than put up with a poor show at home).

DaveinGermany · 09-07-2018, 19:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Who is there that could be trusted to govern if TM is unseated?I cannot see anyone that I would trust.

We've been over this point far to often & nothing has changed! every likely candidate has some deficiency & will not suit all the people or all their views. At the present juncture that's damned inconvenient but not insurmountable, right here & now we need a hardnosed, arrogant, aggressive singleminded authoritarian B'stard whose mandate should be clear & simple, we want out now, no ties no quibbles or compromise, get it done now & have us walking by the week-end!

All the other shiite can wait, clear this & the rest will fall into place. Sounds to simplistic? Not really, if there's a determined will, there's a way, proper governments elsewhere are showing the way, their peple have got issues their govt listens & things get done. Italy-Salvini or Hungary-Orban. Mind you, they've got politicoes with clunking great brass nads whereas us ....

Margaret Pilkington · 09-07-2018, 20:36

Yes...I know son...and you have outlined the kind of person who would go and kick the bejasus out of JCJ....MB....and maybe even the Tusk guy.
But. Who is this person you describe....I cannot see him or her. I cannot see anyone who even vaguely approximates to what is required.

To be totally honest.....if David Davis had hung onto his hat....and Boris too.....there would not be a snowflakes chance in hell of TM getting her proposals through the final stages of negotiations.....because those in the position of negotiators do NOT want to negotiate....they never have and they never will.
Whatever the UK comes up with it will not meet with anything near approval because they want to see the UK walk off the cliff...they really want us to fail...and fail spectacularly.

It is grinding their nuts that we have not suffered trade losses and that our finances are beating what the doom mongers predicted.
So, if these chaps had held their nerve then our position would have been much stronger.
But hey, I get principles...but sometimes they cost too dear.

Margaret Pilkington · 09-07-2018, 20:40

The other thing is....that if the government are overthrown it leaves the door wide open to that Commie Corbyn....and believe me things would be a damn sight worse under his malign rule...we really would slide down the gurgler.

Less · 09-07-2018, 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

we need a hardnosed, arrogant, aggressive singleminded authoritarian B'stard whose mandate should be clear & simple, we want out now, no ties no quibbles or compromise, get it done now & have us walking by the week-end!

I was with you all the way, I would have been perfect, really prepared to take on the job, tell the lot of them where they can go, what they could stick up their brexit how far and how hard it should be pushed and would have even given a hand making sure it was placed into the perfect position, but...

I don't work week-ends.