Referendum is a load of crap.!!

[Margaret Pilkington]

It is only democracy if the plebs(that is you and me Less) fall into line with what our patrician politicians(who know far better than the great, I'll educated unwashed) like.

They have forgotten that they are there to support and represent their voters.
They believe they are there to line their own pockets...book a place on the lucrative gravy train....that is their definition of democracy.

As for the current wrangling. I have lost track of what each of these amendments by spineless, gutless MP's mean in real terms.
If one of them is that the PM goes back to Brussels to wring something out of them, then I think she is on a vinegar trip.

The delaying of our leaving was never going to happen as Michel Barnier said they would not permit Article 50 to be extended....it could be revoked...but not extended.

I feel like you Less....wake me up when we are sat on the step outside the EU.....and I will spit through their letter box.

[Margaret Pilkington]

The golden rule of democracy is :- The people vote, the politicians implement actions that support that vote, they do what is required to ensure that the voters wishes are followed...they do not go through the details and decide which bits they like and which bits they do not.
They are not there to tell us that they know better than us...if that is the case why would we vote?

[cashman]

I have honestly begun to think voting is a complete waste of time and effort,after a lifetime,its taken me that long for the penny to drop. unless there is damn big change in the mentality of those prats that are elected.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Well, it is when you are made to believe that you can change something with your vote...then find that your vote means nothing, is worth nothing, because the political elite know better what is good for us.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Well, it is when you are made to believe that you can change something with your vote...then find that your vote means nothing, is worth nothing, because the political elite know better what is good for us.

This lot, by that i mean all parties have completely destroyed the thought,that my vote means something, sad but true.

[Margaret Pilkington]

I think that there are many more like us who are very disaffected by the way things are going at present.

[Ryewolf90]

According to various media outlets:

"The EU's chief negotiator Michel Barnier says the Irish backstop is "part and parcel" of the UK's Brexit deal and will not be renegotiated."

I must admit I'm getting confused now, the EU won't renegotiate, so we're still stuck with TM's deal which has already been voted against.

60 days to go...... are we in or out????

[cashman]

Originally Posted by Ryewolf90

According to various media outlets:

"The EU's chief negotiator Michel Barnier says the Irish backstop is "part and parcel" of the UK's Brexit deal and will not be renegotiated."

I must admit I'm getting confused now, the EU won't renegotiate, so we're still stuck with TM's deal which has already been voted against.

60 days to go...... are we in or out????

Dont be confused just sit back and see what occurs, the E.U. have said exactly that quite a few times, then backtracked at the last min. i and no-one has any idea if that will be the case, just sit back sod it and see,no good at all bothering until theres summat to bother oer. Besides bothering never did nobody any good.

[Margaret Pilkington]

I think that unless the crew in Brussels give some leeway(which they won't).....and I cannot see the deal as it is(it has already been rejected) getting through parliament(it is a crap deal anyway) then the legal position (as I understand it) is that we will make a disorderly exit.
And come the 30th of March, the sun will still rise and set....the sky won't fall in.

All the doom mongers that keep telling us it will be Armageddon are only guessing because no one knows what will happen....or how things will pan out.
I am not saying it will be easy or without lumps...but it has to be better in the long term.

We are strong enough to survive and eventually prosper.
(That will really stick in the craw of Barnier, Juncker, Tusk, Verhofstad, Merkel et al)

[AccyMad]

Originally Posted by Ryewolf90

According to various media outlets:

"The EU's chief negotiator Michel Barnier says the Irish backstop is "part and parcel" of the UK's Brexit deal and will not be renegotiated."

I must admit I'm getting confused now, the EU won't renegotiate, so we're still stuck with TM's deal which has already been voted against.

60 days to go...... are we in or out????

Neither - we're still 'shaking it all about' . .. . .

[Margaret Pilkington]

Oh....Accymad....that so made me laugh!

[Ryewolf90]

In the words of Katy Perry, I think this sums it all up:

You're yes then you're no
You're in and you're out
You're up and you're down
You're wrong when it's right
It's black and it's white
We fight, we break up
We kiss, we make up
You, You don't really want to stay, no
You, but you don't really want to go-o
You're hot then you're cold
You're yes then you're no
You're in and you're out
You're up and you're down

[Margaret Pilkington]

It is interesting to note that our own representative abstained on all the recent momentous votes regarding the issues with our exit from the EU.
Now I suppose it depends on how you look at things.
He did not follow the instructions of the Labour whip, but the neither did he represent those who put him in Westminster.
He did nothing. I suppose that sums up our representative very neatly.

[accybeme]

cat among the pigeons Nigel Farage new Brexit Party

[Margaret Pilkington]

I do not see that solving anything until proportional representation is implemented.
It will just further dilute the options and lead to more wishy-washy government because no one has a majority.
There is absolutely no doubt in my mind that the two party systeam is beyond repair, but until proportional representation is implemented there is never going to be a government chosen by the people