Referendum is a load of crap.!!

[Margaret Pilkington]

Like Exile, I think that this is not to the advantage of the UK.....did you see all those pictures of the smiling members of countries in the EU(Angela Merkel, Macron, Juncker, Barnier et al)?that has to be ringing alarm bells.
It means that they think we have been bamboozled. That they have got one over on us.
It is not Brexit.

I don't think the MP's will vote for this WA.....and I think this is because it is BJ that has achieved it......but I really do hope they vote it down because then we have to leave by default....and Juncker has said emphatically that there will be NO extension(not that I really believe that).

This is not leaving....and we would be in a worse position than we are now.
The only way is a clean break.
No ECJ, no single market, no customs union.
If we are signed up to this withdrawal agreement then the PM has sold us out.

[Margaret Pilkington]

My feelings on these proposals....and you all know what a cynical baggage I am, are that these delays and the obstacles to a straightforward exit have been calculated, manipulated to create 'Brexit fatigue' so that the population will accept anything....just because they want the wrangling to end.

The media are portraying this as a good development but they are all remainers.....and this so called deal sees us trapped.....and still paying in and having NO say in how rules, regulations and how laws are formulated.
The Backstop was a red herring.....and while it seems that this has been ditched.....no other parts of The May Withdrawal Agreement has changed.
The EU has given us nothing....the EU will give us nothing....they have no desire to do anything for us.....all they want is our money.

[accybeme]

The full implications of the Boris deal are unclear to me and to many others no doubt, but from what I’ve read we will still not be a free of the EU, in the event of MP’s forcing a second referendum, I can envisage that (leave and no-deal) would be absent from the ballot paper, otherwise the second referendum would be pointless as the vote would result in a small split majority, which wouldn’t solve anything

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by accybeme

The full implications of the Boris deal are unclear to me and to many others no doubt, but from what I’ve read we will still not be a free of the EU, in the event of MP’s forcing a second referendum, I can envisage that (leave and no-deal) would be absent from the ballot paper, otherwise the second referendum would be pointless as the vote would result in a small split majority, which wouldn’t solve anything

and that is just the way the political classes want to keep it...the less we know the less we can object to.


As for a second referendum...this is a denial of democracy.....the first one has not been acted upon...despite all the parties saying in their election manifesto that they would honour the will of the people...none of them have.


None of the parties know the meaning of honour or democracy...it is only democratic if it is in line with their wishes...so there is no point in another one.


However, if a second referendum were to happen, then the option to remain should not be in the options....it was already decided that we were leaving.
So it should be Leave with the TM/BJ WA or leave by default.


After Juncker saying that no further extension to article 50 would be allowed, Mrs Merkel has said that if this WA is voted down then there would have to be a delay in Brexit......which all makes this current WA stink more fishy than before.


The EU are scared witless of us leaving by default...they want our money and they want to have control of the strings.

[Gremlin]

I'm scared there will be another referendum, especially one I heard a remoaner MP discussing on TV recently.

3 choices.

A- leave with no deal.
B- leave with a deal.
C- remain.
Scenario 40% remain. 30% leave with no deal. 30% leave with a deal. That's the cunning plan to split the leavers.
Out means out. for goodness sake please do as you're told Mr and Mrs M.P's..

[cashman]

sorry gremlin theres no chance of traitors reforming.

[accybeme]

the problem has always been that the majority of MP’s have betrayed their constituencies by voting against their wishes, come the general election there is going to be a huge rebellion against these MP’s, labour seats in the north will take the biggest hit

[monkey hanger]

Originally Posted by accybeme

the problem has always been that the majority of MP’s have betrayed their constituencies by voting against their wishes, come the general election there is going to be a huge rebellion against these MP’s, labour seats in the north will take the biggest hit

or there might be a few like sarah champion in rotherham who will vote for the wishes of her constituents and not herself. they know they are being watched especially if they read comments on here.

[monkey hanger]

[QUOTE=Margaret Pilkington;


The EU are scared witless of us leaving by default...they want our money and they want to have control of the strings.[/QUOTE]

they are scared because if we leave and are succesful by doing it then others might follow quickly. its the only way they can keep all the members under control. would really love to see the pointless organisation crash and burn.

[Exile on Spencer St]

Originally Posted by monkey hanger

....would really love to see the pointless organisation crash and burn.

So just stay fit and healthy, MH, because the EU will crash and burn eventually.
It’s merely a jumbo version of Yugoslavia.

[Gremlin]

Originally Posted by accybeme

the problem has always been that the majority of MP’s have betrayed their constituencies by voting against their wishes, come the general election there is going to be a huge rebellion against these MP’s, labour seats in the north will take the biggest hit

Anybody in mind?

[Jimmy Clitheroe]

I get fed up with being labelled as some kind of racist or fascist when I own up to voting out in the presence of the rabid remainers. Excuse me, but pretty much every constituent government of the EU contains REAL overt fascist parties in their midst. In many cases they are a major force in government. The French National Front is practically the opposition party, Vlaamse Bloc had to be disbanded in Flemish Belgium due to it's rabid policies only to reappear as a (slightly) sanitised Vlaamse Belang. The Italian Liga seems to be espousing the fine tradition of Il Duce.

EU policies are the causing the rise of the extreme right on mainland Europe along with the dogma by the EU that the dream of their European 'project' must be fulfilled.
It annoys me that they label any one with an alternative view to theirs as fascist - REAL fascists are quite easy to find - in the parliaments of many EU constituent governments.

[cashman]

Corbyn has said a second referendum within 6 months after an election, Labour have completely SOLD OUT the working class imho. anyone voting labour is completly stupid and do not know what Democracy Means, in my view breaks my heart to say that but its the truth.

[Margaret Pilkington]

What do these MP's want?(don't tell me....I know they want to remain in the EU, disregarding the will of the electorate)

They said they did not want a disorderly Brexit(dubbed 'no deal').....so a deal is on the table but they don't want THAT either.
They want the PM to write to Brussels requesting an extension.....wouldn't it be wonderful if the EU told them that 'time is up'.

They are a shower of Fisons.
The sooner we can get rid of them the better.

Local MP's indicated their voting intentions to the Lancashire Telegraph.....what about our own representative.....well, he was 'unavailable for comment' no surprise there then.

[Jimmy Clitheroe]

Originally Posted by cashman

Corbyn has said a second referendum within 6 months after an election, Labour have completely SOLD OUT the working class imho. anyone voting labour is completly stupid and do not know what Democracy Means, in my view breaks my heart to say that but its the truth.

I fear you are right and the Labour Party are in severe danger of losing their traditional support in their efforts to appease the controlling luvvies, dovies and trendies who have lost touch with ordinary people.