Sick and fed up!

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by shillelagh

but what about the stuff you dont hear about .. how do you know for certain that they theyre not up to mischief out of sight of their parents .. did you tell your parents everything you got up to .. did you hell as like .. you knew what would happen .. and when you were daddy ... werent you a bit easier on your kids than your parents were on you .. you werent as strict .. and thats what im getting at .. your kids probably arent as strict as you were on their parents .. just like you werent on your kids ..

Well mine are 42 and 41 and noughts come back to my doorstep Jen

[webglynne]

Thank you katex.


I think there was a case in Lancaster years ago of a shop keeper being harrassed all the time with nothing happening.

"A booky banning a man for the actions of youths"? So no good calling the cops?

[Less]

Originally Posted by jaysay

I hear what your saying Less, and in a way I can agree, but I think government has to take some responsibility down the line, for letting things get as bad as it is today, after all its they who set out legislation on the way we have to live our lives

But who let these successive Governments get away with it?

The mess was left with us all saying, let someone else sort it, now if MargeR is even 1% right, we are Doomed, Doomed I tell ye! It's no use blaming others, even by being passive, never mind blinkered, isn't it time we all stopped blaming other peoples 'yoof', and admitted we are the ones that cocked up, don't pass it on, take responsibility for all we've done.

Then maybe the next lot can sort it out because it's a problem, not, because the old farts didn't give them a chance.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by shillelagh

but jaysay .. teenagers today are your grandchildren or maybe great grandchildren .. the parents of the teenagers are your children .. now does this mean you didnt bring your kids up right to be the parents they are today.

A very good point.

Parenting it learned from example, even if it means you do the opposite from your own parents.

I firmly believe our national psyche changed for the worse in the eighties. We began to care less about others in our society, and wanted what was best for us individually. The me, me, me generation.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by webglynne

Thank you katex.


I think there was a case in Lancaster years ago of a shop keeper being harrassed all the time with nothing happening.

"A booky banning a man for the actions of youths"? So no good calling the cops?

I actually worked in that shop WG many moons ago, it was a fortress even then, the owner was an Asian guy, nice bloke, but I think he eventually gave in and sold up

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by garinda

A very good point.

Parenting it learned from example, even if it means you do the opposite from your own parents.

I firmly believe our national psyche changed for the worse in the eighties. We began to care less about others in our society, and wanted what was best for us individually. The me, me, me generation.

It started long before the 80s Rindi, with the trendy lefty teachers in the late sixties early seventies, don't call me sir call me Jim, peace bothers and sisters, cool, sandals in class, corduroy trousers, polo neck sweaters, that was the start of the down turn

[Margaret Pilkington]

It all started when people abdicated responsibility for anything.......actions stopped having consequences.
Parents blamed teachers and schools,but when teachers and schools tried to instill some discipline the parents rounded on them for 'bullying little johnny/Geraldine' and did not see/accept their own role in the awful picture.
children were allowed to do what they wanted, no boundaries were set.......children had rights but not, it seems, responsibilities.
Social workers took the rights of errant teens seriously and parents were wiped out of the picture.

Children having children doesn't help either.
That's my two pennorth.

[accyman]

i got a text forwarded to me naming this calvert chap as the new identity of venables saying to pass it on, god knows what whoever started this text off thought i was going to do with this nugget of information even if it was real and i declined to pass it on

[garinda]

Originally Posted by jaysay

It started long before the 80s Rindi, with the trendy lefty teachers in the late sixties early seventies, don't call me sir call me Jim, peace bothers and sisters, cool, sandals in class, corduroy trousers, polo neck sweaters, that was the start of the down turn

...and who brought up that feckless, egalitarian generation?

Oh yes, that's right, the well disciplined, salt of the earth people, who'd survived under rationing, and who'd just won the second World War.

[Less]

Originally Posted by garinda

...and who brought up that feckless, egalitarian generation?

Oh yes, that's right, the well disciplined, salt of the earth people, who'd survived under rationing, and who'd just won the second World War.

Strange, but I thought I'd blamed the spoilt generation after that, the one I and lots of other moaners came from.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Less

Strange, but I thought I'd blamed the spoilt generation after that, the one I and lots of other moaners came from.

I think it was hard for you, not neatly fitting generational groupings, such as baby boomers, Generation X etc, but having to settle for being balanced on the cusp.

[katex]

Originally Posted by webglynne

I think there was a case in Lancaster years ago of a shop keeper being harrassed all the time with nothing happening.

"A booky banning a man for the actions of youths"? So no good calling the cops?

I think in this case, David Askew was well supported by the police .... they even installed CCTV, and spent nights in the house with him. Unfortunately, nothing happened on these nights.

The neighbours were very supportive too, except they were too scared to confront the teenagers. Seemed had been going on for about 20 years and 'the tradition' had been passed on from one generation to another.

One of the neighbours that was interviewed stated that she knew the parents of some of the 'yobs' and they were decent people. As Shill has said, you never know what they are up to out of sight do you.

[Less]

Originally Posted by garinda

I think it was hard for you, not neatly fitting generational groupings, such as baby boomers, Generation X etc, but having to settle for being balanced on the cusp.

Oi, we were classed as baby boomers right up to 1954 anything after that was put down to very keen amateurs, except for our poor Catholic brethren they were forced to do it whether they wanted to or not.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Less

Oi, we were classed as baby boomers right up to 1954 anything after that was put down to very keen amateurs, except for our poor Catholic brethren that were forced to do it whether they wanted to or not.

Ok, we'll label you a 'late' baby boomer, on the understanding that it took some people longer than others to disrobe from their de-mob suits.

Apparently many years in some cases.

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by katex

I think in this case, David Askew was well supported by the police .... they even installed CCTV, and spent nights in the house with him. Unfortunately, nothing happened on these nights.

The neighbours were very supportive too, except they were too scared to confront the teenagers. Seemed had been going on for about 20 years and 'the tradition' had been passed on from one generation to another.

One of the neighbours that was interviewed stated that she knew the parents of some of the 'yobs' and they were decent people. As Shill has said, you never know what they are up to out of sight do you.

Therein lies part of the problem, when they are out of site from their parents some will get up to no good & others wont, but when we were kids the neighbours were on speaking terms & communal. If we got up to no good somewhere in the locality you could guarantee our parents would know within a day or two & we would be confronted with our wrong doing & "Punished".

Nowadays people lock themselves away in their houses of an evening & mostly look the other way when something happens. On occasion someone will make a stand & look what happens to them ! If they aren't beaten, killed & abused & they apprehend one of the yobs, our wonderful Police force & their assistants turn to & do the "Vigilante / offender" (read upright citizen here), not the yob & are up on a charge of ABH, GBH wrongful arrest take your pick !

One minute Government are saying, have a go , stand up for your rights & put these people in their place, offenders shall be punished. You do & what ? A slapped butt never killed anyone but if gave the Kids then a short sharp reminder of "Actions & Consequences" but do it & you're a Criminal, pussy attitudes of broken homes & absent parents, growing up in a rough area, pure pish ! plenty have gone through the same circumstances & become good, honest, reliable & responsible Adults who go on to raise offspring of the same values & morals.

Still on the flip side of that particular coin there is the complete opposite, Parents who really care more about themselves & their selfish wants & needs & this is reflected in their donation to the gene pool, "Children" who have no respect, discipline or social skills worth mentioning. This has been the story through the generations it would be wrong to try & pinpoint a particular time or group to place responsibility on, it is ongoing. So who really is responsible ? We all are !

What is required is a return to, standards of decency, honesty & fairness to all & until we reinstate these values whether it be from the 40's & 50's or the good points from modern times, the sad & depressing situation will continue to blight our society. We need to make those improvements now each & every one of us, we can all in our own way contribute, so what's stopping you ?