Teenagers jailed

[blazey]

Originally Posted by Bonnyboy

If we ever started to have a problem round here, I’d have a word with all the neighbours and suggest that every time there was trouble, we contact each other on our phones and go out as a group to face the gits ( pool cue’s, metal bars etc. in hand ) Don’t let anyone face ‘em alone. Not much point calling the cops these days, if they responded at all it would be far too late.

Isn't that how gypsies deal with things? I remember when I lived in Spring Hill when I was younger and loads of them where walking up Spring Hill road armed just as you suggested.

I don't think these sentences are lenient, the best part of their lives is going to be spent in prison, and when they get out they will struggle to build up their lives because not enough is done to help rehabilitate offenders, hence why people reoffend.

I know people aren't going to like my response but I genuinely believe this is true, and the truth hurts I guess.

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by blazey

I don't think these sentences are lenient, the best part of their lives is going to be spent in prison, and when they get out they will struggle to build up their lives because not enough is done to help rehabilitate offenders, hence why people reoffend.

Totally disagree. These three animals have callously and cold-bloodedly ended a man's life and ruined his family's lives. They will still have a large part of their lives in front of them when they emerge from jail. That doesn't seem to be justice to me. As far as I'm concerned, they should be locked up in the harshest conditions until they die.

[Margaret Pilkington]

I agree, they will be relatively young men who will still be able to get up to violent behaviour...they will be able to do drink and drugs and generally make some poor families life a misery....they have done that once and should be stopped from doing it ever again.
If I had my way I would rehabilitate them alright......I would work them at something physically hard until they were longing to see their bed each night.

[blazey]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

Totally disagree. These three animals have callously and cold-bloodedly ended a man's life and ruined his family's lives. They will still have a large part of their lives in front of them when they emerge from jail. That doesn't seem to be justice to me. As far as I'm concerned, they should be locked up in the harshest conditions until they die.

See, if they were adults when they commited the crime I might agree, but the fact that they are young makes me think otherwise. Maybe its the fact that people keep saying to me 'when you are older you will see' and 'you'll learn one day'. I think they will see one day that what they did as teenagers was wrong, and they will have had plenty of time to dwell on that.

Why bother with prisons if we aren't willing to make room for improvement for the prisoners? Surely it would just be wasting money if they weren't ever going to be released?

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by blazey

See, if they were adults when they commited the crime I might agree, but the fact that they are young makes me think otherwise. Maybe its the fact that people keep saying to me 'when you are older you will see' and 'you'll learn one day'. I think they will see one day that what they did as teenagers was wrong, and they will have had plenty of time to dwell on that.

Why bother with prisons if we aren't willing to make room for improvement for the prisoners? Surely it would just be wasting money if they weren't ever going to be released?

They were old enough to know that what they were doing was terribly, terribly wrong, so they are old enough to take the consequences. And as for prisons, as far as I'm concerned, they're for punishment, as well as rehabilitation.

[blazey]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

They were old enough to know that what they were doing was terribly, terribly wrong, so they are old enough to take the consequences. And as for prisons, as far as I'm concerned, they're for punishment, as well as rehabilitation.

So murderers can't be rehabiliated? I'm not quite sure what you are trying to say.

I think we live in a society where we think prison is the only way of solving things like this, and we're so closed into the box ourselves that nobody bothers to think of alternative methods for class A offenders. Prison allows us to move the problem from our society to a closed one which affects only prisoners only, and once they're there we feel better about our lives again that we never want them back in our lives because we see them as a threat to ourselves. Our fear is what makes us demand longer prison sentences, not the fact that we want to rehabiliate anyone. Just like love makes people like Maxine Carr protect criminals, like hate and greed creates criminals.

All natural emotions create problems, and that includes fear of prisoners being released and reoffending. I thought thats why we had the legal system, for an objective trial free from the natural emotions and compassion.

[Wynonie Harris]

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody commits murder in cold blood, then the only appropriate sentence for them is to be locked up for the rest of their days. I couldn't care less about "alternative methods" or rehabilitating them, because, in my opinion, they don't deserve a second chance. In my book, that's justice!

[blazey]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

As far as I'm concerned, if somebody commits murder in cold blood, then the only appropriate sentence for them is to be locked up for the rest of their days. I couldn't care less about "alternative methods" or rehabilitating them, because, in my opinion, they don't deserve a second chance. In my book, that's justice!

Well your taxes pay for it so who am I to complain about what you want from the prison service? its £40,000 per prisoner per year isn't it for standard care in prison, add a bit extra for the suicide watch of many young murderers, bit more for the extra protection against the other inmates...


Hmm I think I now know why the NHS doesn't get as much funding as we'd hope. It all goes to prisons instead

[cashman]

well if as you want,release em after so long, then "New Identity" kicks in at least for the high profile scumbags, n the good old taxpayer carries on funding this farce. so if yer still paying taxes for this scum, i prefer it to be spent on keeping em in jail.

[blazey]

Originally Posted by cashman

well if as you want,release em after so long, then "New Identity" kicks in at least for the high profile scumbags, n the good old taxpayer carries on funding this farce. so if yer still paying taxes for this scum, i prefer it to be spent on keeping em in jail.

The only time people get new identities is when they are at risk from people who want to seek revenge, normally people who aren't even involved in the first place.

Its often people who have nothing better to do that make it their duty to carry out this revenge. People who want to make a hero status for themselves in the eyes of the rest of the rabble.

I think this has already been mentioned before though in the thread about Maxine Carr

[cashman]

Originally Posted by blazey

The only time people get new identities is when they are at risk from people who want to seek revenge, normally people who aren't even involved in the first place.

Its often people who have nothing better to do that make it their duty to carry out this revenge. People who want to make a hero status for themselves in the eyes of the rest of the rabble.

I think this has already been mentioned before though in the thread about Maxine Carr

dont matter who gets em the TAXPAYER is paying for it.

[blazey]

Originally Posted by cashman

dont matter who gets em the TAXPAYER is paying for it.

There are a lot less people with protected identities than people in prison. It costs less as well as those with protected identities are often helped into work too so they can pay taxes themselves, and they must feed, clothe, and pay for their own lives.

Protecting identities and giving new names enables those who have been rehabiliated to have lives and work and pay back what it cost to 'fix' them.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by blazey

There are a lot less people with protected identities than people in prison. It costs less as well as those with protected identities are often helped into work too so they can pay taxes themselves, and they must feed, clothe, and pay for their own lives.

Protecting identities and giving new names enables those who have been rehabiliated to have lives and work and pay back what it cost to 'fix' them.

they can never pay back the damage they have caused to families lives,but that dont seem to bother you, the scum should not be released.

[blazey]

Originally Posted by cashman

they can never pay back the damage they have caused to families lives,but that dont seem to bother you, the scum should not be released.

If they cant pay it back then why spend more money keeping them in prison. I've already said that I think prisons are pointless, they obviously aren't doing what they're meant to do, so whats the point of the money being spent on prisons?

Would be cheaper to get them visa's to live abroad and pay for their one way ticket. Surprised nobody has suggested that yet instead.

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by blazey

Well your taxes pay for it so who am I to complain about what you want from the prison service? its £40,000 per prisoner per year isn't it for standard care in prison, add a bit extra for the suicide watch of many young murderers, bit more for the extra protection against the other inmates...


Hmm I think I now know why the NHS doesn't get as much funding as we'd hope. It all goes to prisons instead

You can't put a price on justice. And, anyway, whose fault is it that it costs £40,000 per year? Successive governments and their do-gooder accomplices who care far more about the rights and comforts of criminals than they do about their victims. I would think that "bed and board" in a hard labour camp with the minimum of creature comforts would cost far less!