The Tories

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth

....And to cut the 50 pence tax at this time- talk about timing! Osbourne says it raised little income- does he think the millionares will bring all their money back from offshore because they'll only pay 45 pence tax? Of course he doesn't. Does he think we believe him-does he care?....

He is just trying to keep those millionaires on his side because he needs them to keep their business in the UK and not take it abroad.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Neil

It's easy saying things are wrong but not so easy when you have to decide how to fix them.

As for MP's pay, I think they are underpaid. Pay peanuts get monkeys springs to mind. You might not think what they are paid is peanuts but compared to other sectors it is

There are Chief executives in council offices get more than the Prime Minister gets, that's how stupid it is

[Gordon Booth]

Originally Posted by Neil

He is just trying to keep those millionaires on his side because he needs them to keep their business in the UK and not take it abroad.

Of course he does- there's a few top paying directors jobs there.

Example- how can you trust a government that puts a highly paid director of a wind energy company in charge of the committee deciding our policy on green energy?

It's just barefaced cheek. I can see why they don't know how the bulk of us live and think, they come from a different world. But when they show they don't care either- that's too much.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Neil

He is just trying to keep those millionaires on his side because he needs them to keep their business in the UK and not take it abroad.

Then he's wasting his time ... the millionaire businessmen, given the opportunity to increase their income and their portfolios, will leave anyway. The government could scrap the minimum wage, re-introduce child labour ... slavery even; but if they can make a few extra bucks by moving offshore, the businessmen will pull up stakes and move. Instead of begging them to stay, penalize them if they leave. Ooops ... I forgot, you guys are in the EU. What a silly bunt I am

Here followeth a little wander. Heard on the news today that the unemployment rate in Germany is less than 6% ... and in many other EU countries it's through the roof ... youth unemployment in Sapin is over 50%. Seems like things are a little out of whack in the good ol' EU

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by Neil

What is your plan for those in 1 who have never paid into the system? Will you leave them to starve to death on the street?

Gated community/Sheltered accommodation (it's good enough for our pensioners). There is no need for them to have a house, accommodation blocks (good enough for the military/nursing staff & police in training.) this way they've a roof over their head, they may not like it but the basic human need for shelter is met.

Communal messing/canteen with set meal times & a varied menu to cater for various dietary requirements, turn up & eat or go hungry. This also forms a routine so people get back into getting up & out of their pits & getting to bed at a reasonable time.

Through the day work parties are allocated objectives, some will deal with catering, some with maintenance, others education, life skills, mentors/teachers should come from the people within the complex & only limited recourse to outside assets, thereby bringing about self sufficiency & the learning of skills amongst those involved.

No one should be exempted & all should be encouraged to move round the various positions to broaden the individuals knowledge & skill base. Admittedly somewhat regimented & authoritarian but hopefully this will give them the impetus to improve themselves & the determination to get away but with a better set of rounded out qualities/skills.

That should be enough to be getting on with.

[Eric]

Originally Posted by Neil

I was asking for your definition. Its easy to say give it to them that need it, we all agree with that. What's hard is writing a definition that can then be applied to everyone

This reminds me of the gay marriage debate ... we don't need definitions, 'cause, while we will all differ in some points, we all have a fair idea what things means Just like we all have a fair idea of what it means to be "British" or "Canadian" even (unarmed Americans with health care) If you are sitting on the sloping deck of "Titanic" you don't waste your time trying to define "iceberg"; you look for a goddam lifeboat.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Originally Posted by Neil

It's easy saying things are wrong but not so easy when you have to decide how to fix them.

As for MP's pay, I think they are underpaid. Pay peanuts get monkeys springs to mind. You might not think what they are paid is peanuts but compared to other sectors it is

You think that their pay is peanuts...well, it might be, but whe you look at all the perks they get, they aren't doing so badly at all...and if you tell me that if we paid them better they would not embezzle the tax payer out of expenses.......I would need a good size pinch of salt to swallow that.
Not only that, many of them have other jobs as well......how come they have the time. I was so weary after my work...I knew I had earned my pay.

[Gordon Booth]

Originally Posted by DaveinGermany

Gated community/Sheltered accommodation (it's good enough for our pensioners). There is no need for them to have a house, accommodation blocks (good enough for the military/nursing staff & police in training.) this way they've a roof over their head, they may not like it but the basic human need for shelter is met.

Communal messing/canteen with set meal times & a varied menu to cater for various dietary requirements, turn up & eat or go hungry. This also forms a routine so people get back into getting up & out of their pits & getting to bed at a reasonable time.

Through the day work parties are allocated objectives, some will deal with catering, some with maintenance, others education, life skills, mentors/teachers should come from the people within the complex & only limited recourse to outside assets, thereby bringing about self sufficiency & the learning of skills amongst those involved.

No one should be exempted & all should be encouraged to move round the various positions to broaden the individuals knowledge & skill base. Admittedly somewhat regimented & authoritarian but hopefully this will give them the impetus to improve themselves & the determination to get away but with a better set of rounded out qualities/skills.

That should be enough to be getting on with.

Steady on Din G.

'Arbeit macht frei'?

[walkinman221]

Mp's pay is £65,738 if the mp has only one term in office (5 years) if you take into consideration his/her severance package his/her salary is in fact £77,738.The severance package is generally 50% of his/her yearly salary after 5 years service.Then of course there are the expenses to consider which it seems are incalculable even if you put receipts in for everything including the odd mars bar

[DaveinGermany]

Originally Posted by Gordon Booth

Steady on Din G.

'Arbeit macht frei'?

Some may see it so, but extreme situations require extreme actions. On top of that it' just basically a civilian version of how the military used to be, self sufficient & with their own tradesmen & skill sets.

[walkinman221]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

You think that their pay is peanuts...well, it might be, but whe you look at all the perks they get, they aren't doing so badly at all...and if you tell me that if we paid them better they would not embezzle the tax payer out of expenses.......I would need a good size pinch of salt to swallow that.
Not only that, many of them have other jobs as well......how come they have the time. I was so weary after my work...I knew I had earned my pay.

The low pay must be why we have to drag the buggers in there kicking and screaming,eh Margaret.Bet theres not many of them weary after a shift.

[davebtelford]

I think one thing about MPs pay is the fact that you don't actually need any formal qualifications to do the job - just have a good gob on you and convince enough idiots to vote for you. They are paid enough.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by Eric

This reminds me of the gay marriage debate ... we don't need definitions, 'cause, while we will all differ in some points, we all have a fair idea what things means Just like we all have a fair idea of what it means to be "British" or "Canadian" even (unarmed Americans with health care) If you are sitting on the sloping deck of "Titanic" you don't waste your time trying to define "iceberg"; you look for a goddam lifeboat.

Of course you need definitions. If you are going to make a law where only British people in need get paid you have to define what that means. You need to define "British" and "in need".

[Neil]

Originally Posted by davebtelford

I think one thing about MPs pay is the fact that you don't actually need any formal qualifications to do the job - just have a good gob on you and convince enough idiots to vote for you. They are paid enough.

You say they are paid enough - are you comparing that to what you are paid?

If you think of the Country as a big company which in effect it is then you need the best business minds to run it. We don't appear to have them and we are in a mess.

[Less]

Originally Posted by jaysay

Any Ideas Less

Of course, it's the same one you've ignored all the time.

Do not blame the innocent and vulnerable claimants along with the guilty scroungers just because this is the easiest method to make it look like you are doing something.
Using propaganda to blame all the Countries hardships on this group of people isn't fair nor is it useful.
There are investigators to find the thieves without punishing the legitimate Citizens.