The Tory "dirty tricks brigade" and the media

[Wynonie Harris]

Originally Posted by garinda

Before I'm jumped on, I would like to state he is a very good local councillor, and that's why he has been one for so long.

Historically Ossy has been traditionally Labour, like many of the other towns and villages that make up the borough.

So it's nothing to do with Ossy being some sort of 'safe seat'. It isn't.

I know lots of people who have benefited from his work as a councillor. On that level you'll rarely hear a word of criticism.

I think he's re-elected because of the man he is. A man with a proven track record.

He might be a pompous tyrant in council chambers, I don't know, but face to face he's a nice bloke.

...and he was a good paper boy. The people in the newsagents down Charter Street thought very highly of him (just trying to contribute to Garinda's positive assessment of him).

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

...and he was a good paper boy. The people in the newsagents down Charter Street thought very highly of him (just trying to contribute to Garinda's positive assessment of him).

Paper boy, teacher, frock and sweetie shop empresario, 1970's David Cassidy looky-likey, politican.

Truly a Renaissance man.

[Wynonie Harris]

...just to add to the accolades being heaped on his head, my old dear who was a regular customer at his dress shop in Whalley Road still speaks of him in glowing terms (and if she could read what some of you lot write about him, you'd be in for a severe handbagging, believe me).

I also recall someone I used to know who lived up Ossy, a dyed-in-the-wool Labour voter, who was very fulsome in their praise for him.

As for his conduct on the council, it's hard for me to judge because, as Jaysay will be the first to tell you, I live in Cheshire now. However, as I'm continually saying, perhaps if more local Tories had the bottle to join Accyweb, they'd be able to leap to his defence!

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Wynonie Harris

As for his conduct on the council, it's hard for me to judge because, as Jaysay will be the first to tell you, I live in Cheshire now. However, as I'm continually saying, perhaps if more local Tories had the bottle to join Accyweb, they'd be able to leap to his defence!

Quite agree.

Someone was seen as the Devil incarnate, at the height of the Panopticon furore.

Until she joined the debate herself, put a human face to her arguments, and even if people disagreed with her, won one hunded percent respect, for having the guts to face the critics.

...and of course we then got the chance to know Gayle, and that she isn't a one trick pony, but has many differing interests, plus a sense of humour.

[Stumped]

Originally Posted by garinda

You just seemed, er...a little stumped, and unaware that people in work are entitled to social benefits, that your post seemed to hint were just available to those not working.

I find it hard to fathom how someone of your generation never received some social benefits in your working life.

Perhaps you were luckly enough never to have had a day off sick in those fifty years, and perhaps you weren't married, and had children, and therefore your spouse didn't receive any maternity leave, or child benefit payments, like every other parent of that generation, as it wasn't means tested, and available to all workers.

People work and benefit everyday.

People work, hoping they'll be able to carry on working, but knowing if they can't, because they lose their job, or they develop an illness etc, they will hopefully be cushioned by social benefits, that they've helped to fund.

People work and hope they don't pop their clogs before their retirement, so they can benefit from their old age pension, in later years.

There just a few benefits that are called as such, which workers in the past benefited from. Today there's a whole range more, as I linked in my earler reply, working tax credits etc.

We could also discuss worker's benefiting a from free education for their children, and a free health care system, if you wish, but perhaps we'll leave that for another day, when you've had time to realise, as a worker you might have benefited yourself, quite a lot in the past.

Indeed, my good lady received child benefit for our four offspring and my ocasional bouts of sickness/injuries on duty were covered by my employers, but I maintain that I have contributed more in taxation of one kind or another and national insurance over my working life than I would ever hope to achieve in benefits. Time will tell. In the meantime I am happy to sit back and watch the prospective parliamentary candidates continue to knock lumps off each other in the unseemly fashion that they seem to relish.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Stumped

Indeed, my good lady received child benefit for our four offspring and my ocasional bouts of sickness/injuries on duty were covered by my employers, but I maintain that I have contributed more in taxation of one kind or another and national insurance over my working life than I would ever hope to achieve in benefits. Time will tell. In the meantime I am happy to sit back and watch the prospective parliamentary candidates continue to knock lumps off each other in the unseemly fashion that they seem to relish.

Well you were lucky to receive so little benefits. Only receiving such things as child benefit, and sick pay, and happily never needed the social benefits you were entitled to, because an employer no longer needed you, for example, or that you developed an illness that prevented you from working, and which would have seen you claim more of your entitled benefits.

I wish you a long and happy retirement, on your pension.

I know plenty of people, who work all their lives, paying into the pot, and who snuff it before they even get their pension book/card, posted through their letterbox.

My father was one such person. Though he was the kind of man who counted his blessings in life, and wouldn't have moaned about paying money into a social benefit system, and not get his 'fair share' out.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Stumped

Indeed, my good lady received child benefit for our four offspring and my ocasional bouts of sickness/injuries on duty were covered by my employers, but I maintain that I have contributed more in taxation of one kind or another and national insurance over my working life than I would ever hope to achieve in benefits. Time will tell. In the meantime I am happy to sit back and watch the prospective parliamentary candidates continue to knock lumps off each other in the unseemly fashion that they seem to relish.

It's a good job your children benefited from an education funded by the tax payer.

Sending four kids to Eton would have cost a fortune in fees.

[Less]

Originally Posted by garinda

It's a good job your children benefited from an education funded by the tax payer.

Sending four kids to Eton would have cost a fortune in fees.

That isn't the same as benefits, paid for in a completely different way isn't it?

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Less

That isn't the same as benefits, paid for in a completely different way isn't it?

No, education isn't a 'social benefit'.

Just pointing out, to anyone who might have wanted to have a moan about 'paying a lot in', and 'not getting much out', that taxes go to fund a whole range of things, we all benefit from.

From books in schools, and soldiers in tanks, to social benefits if some losed their job.

It's all funded by the tax payer, and society at large benefits.

[Stumped]

Originally Posted by garinda

It's a good job your children benefited from an education funded by the tax payer.

Sending four kids to Eton would have cost a fortune in fees.

Don't I know it. Two of my kids went through university funded by ME as they were refused grants of any kind. Not that I regret a penny of it. You are quick to criticise, but families suffered hard times even in the 'olden days' of Wilson and Callaghan, which you seem to have conveniently forgotten.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Stumped

Don't I know it. Two of my kids went through university funded by ME as they were refused grants of any kind. Not that I regret a penny of it. You are quick to criticise, but families suffered hard times even in the 'olden days' of Wilson and Callaghan, which you seem to have conveniently forgotten.

Whom I criticising?

I was merely pointing out to those who seem to enjoy a little moan, about the unfairness of life, and paying more into a sysyem than they were lucky enough not to get more out of, that our taxes fund a whole range of things, other than social benefits. Social benefits, such as sick pay, and child benefit, you seemed to have completely forgotten you'd been paid, until it I helpfully pointed out to you...and then it all came flooding back, and you agreed you did in fact receive more than 'a penny' in benefits, as a worker.

Originally Posted by Stumped

Maybe I just don't understand the benefits system - or rather, how to fiddle it! Having worked from the age of 15 to 65-years and having never received a penny in benefits until I drew my pension some years ago!

Since I've personally made no mention of some halycon 'olden day', or mentioned Harold Wilson or James Callaghan, I'm stumped as to why you've brought them into the discussion, in relation to myself.

Perhaps it's time one of us had a little nap, in a nice quiet room, and it'll all make perfect sense later.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Stumped

Don't I know it. Two of my kids went through university funded by ME as they were refused grants of any kind.

Again, I'd just like to point out that the majority of funding for further education, doesn't come from student tuition fees. They receive funding and subsidy from central government, which of course is funded by all those little tax payers, some of who might be childless, or whose children decide they don't want to go to university.

Such is life.

You win some, you lose some.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by garinda

Before I'm jumped on, I would like to state he is a very good local councillor, and that's why he has been one for so long.

Historically Ossy has been traditionally Labour, like many of the other towns and villages that make up the borough.

So it's nothing to do with Ossy being some sort of 'safe seat'. It isn't.

I know lots of people who have benefited from his work as a councillor. On that level you'll rarely hear a word of criticism.

I think he's re-elected because of the man he is. A man with a proven track record.

He might be a pompous tyrant in council chambers, I don't know, but face to face he's a nice bloke.

Are you sure you weren't a politician in previous life, i'll take it back you don't wear two hats, That statement is very true in every aspect, including the bit about the council chamber, but in that respect there are two of them on on each side

[Stumped]

Originally Posted by garinda

Again, I'd just like to point out that the majority of funding for further education, doesn't come from student tuition fees. They receive funding and subsidy from central government, which of course is funded by all those little tax payers, some of who might be childless, or whose children decide they don't want to go to university.

Such is life.

You win some, you lose some.

The greatest joys in my life are - and always will be - family based, and I am thankful of the benefits provided me through honesty, integrity, a long and happy marriage, and an insight into the rare freedoms that are currently being eroded on an almost daily basis by those I deem to refer to as a bunch of politically correct nerds.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Stumped

The greatest joys in my life are - and always will be - family based, and I am thankful of the benefits provided me through honesty, integrity, a long and happy marriage, and an insight into the rare freedoms that are currently being eroded on an almost daily basis by those I deem to refer to as a bunch of politically correct nerds.

Jolly good.

Personally I'm decidedly in the camp that believes the glass is half full.

For those who gloomily insist that life's glass in half empty, I do understand their need to have a little moan, and grumble.

However, when those moaners start to whine about things that aren't factually correct, I do have this overwhelming urge to redress the inaccuracies, and offer the truth of the matter.

Just a little quirk of mine.

Turning fiction into fact.