Today's EU question: how would you vote?

[Boeing Guy]

That's enough of my rant, we could start a new thread on it. But i wanted to add it to the Europe Issue as I believe it is relevent to the argument here about the referendum, which I am a strong supporter for.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by g jones

*I note *today’s Ecofin meeting has been cancelled & more than £18bn was wiped off the value of shares in London in just 20 minutes when EU officials also warned of the *consequences of the crises engulfing Europe. An EU in out referendum would have been a tragedy at this time. Bare in mind the low value of shares is hitting retiring pensioners hard. Playing this kind of politics with people's lives is not right.

And out the dust the truth emerges. I have repeated this many times. Labour voters should run a million miles from Euroskeptisism.

Cameron, Gove and Co are trying now to buy off Eurosceptics with threat to employment rights’ such as maternity and paternity leave, paid holidays, agency workers rights, TUPE etc..

Whe you are privileged to be on the inside, these are the things you see more clearly and decisively.

I can understand Tories and right wingers being anti EU. Working class people should not be supporting the Jacksons, the Holloways and the Nuttalls. With the dust settling and the Tory party fighting in public over the issue, we should take a good long hard look at the people we shod be worried about, Tory EU rebels and what they have really meant by anti EU.

Their mistaken idea (fundamentally flawed actually) is a Britain that is isolated from Europe on protections, employment, food and drink, environment where as Redwood stated (and it says is it all) "we can still buy German cars and French wine".

I believe it is common sense for working people to step away from supporting these arguments.

By carrying on your pro-European Union argument, after the event, don't you realise you're weakening your stance even further?

You've now made it very clear what you believe in.

What the people believe is now rendered irrelevant.

Because despite stating just over two weeks ago that you didn't have a problem with a referendum, as it would settle the issue democratically, you voted against it.

It could be argued that you used your position to protect the U.K's membership of the E.U., and in doing so denied people their right to have their democratic right to have their view counted.

What are you so afraid of, if there's a debate, both for and against, and then the people of Britain can decide what they want?

As far as the European Union is concerned, the British people have never been allowed a say in the matter, so far.

[Boeing Guy]

Actually, were are the usual gaggle of die hard socialists, Mancie, Cmon etc, surely they must have something to say?

[jaysay]

The bottom line is the MP for Hyndburn, put the wishes of Ed Miliband before the wishes of the people he purports to represents, I remember an MP who's only wish was to be the MP for Hyndburn, to represent, in Westminster, the people he grew up with and lived amongst, he wasn't interested in feathering his own nest, by becoming a whip or a PPS, he was a backbencher through and through, it would appear that his like will never be seen again mores the pity

[garinda]

Originally Posted by g jones

If your point is I am out of touch then say so.

Er...I think everyone's made that perfectly clear.

You are out of touch with what people think.

People are demanding, for the very first time, the right to vote in a referendum on the European Union.

That's perfectly clear.

To everyone.

But not apparently to yourself.

[garinda]

If this vote had been a vote concerning a moral issue, such as abortion, or embryonic stem cell research, people might not have agreed with how you voted, but would have respected your decision.

Monday night's vote was not like that.

It was a clear-cut vote about what is right, versus what is wrong.

It's right people are at least given the chance to decide what they want our relationship with the European Union to be.

Because so far, they've never been afforded that right...ever.

[Wynonie Harris]

Graham, what's the point of propounding all these pro-EU arguments now? It's not as if we can reflect on them and then vote in a referendum...because you've denied us that chance.

If we were having a referendum, it wouldn't happen next week...it'd probably be years away, giving you and other pro-EU-ers the opportunity to put forward all the facts and figures you want. Then we could decide and vote on it. But you don't seem to want us to be able to do that...I wonder why?

[Barrie Yates]

Very disappointed. Far from being the voice of, and supporting the people who voted for him, it appears that following the 3 line whip - and perhaps thereby furthering his political career, he denied what is suggested as being the wish of the electorate of his constituency.
Beware the lengthy memories of the local populace.