Travellers on Arden Hall Playing Field - Page 6

Gobbiner17 · 23-06-2011, 17:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

I can't see how saying something that is true can be construed as prejudice.
Prejudice in my book, is when you have no personal experience of a situation, yet make derogatory comments about it.
OK, I agree that racist language does not make for the best discussion.
The bottom line is that many people do not like travellers living close to them because they know that they have a justifiably bad reputation.

As you say Margaret, "Prejudice in my book, is when you have no personal experience of a situation, yet make derogatory comments about it" and it was that sort of prejudice that I was referring to. How many people on here actually experienced the bad part of those 2 cases? But even if you were on the receiving end, I'm just saying that you must respond in an adult to adult way, rather than a parent to child way like many do - eg "I'm not going to discuss this because you are wrong and I am right and no matter what you say I am right" sort of thing. Alternatively people sometimes react like children - eg "it's not fair, this is where I want to play and they've come and spoiled it. Daddy (council, police) go and give them a good hiding."

The adult way is to do as has been done in these 2 cases. If G Jones or Clare Pritchard had not got involved would anybody else have taken the same steps? As you say "many people do not like travellers living close to them because they know that they have a justifiably bad reputation" but how many would just complain, moan, whinge and use racist language, how many would have a go at the travellers and abuse them, and how many would take the course that was successful?

jaysay · 23-06-2011, 17:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil

Sorry if this is a daft question but how long does it take to get a court order and why cant it be the same day?

To my mind I think it takes around 3 days, which don't include weekends and of course that is if there are over 6 vehicles involved, the annoying thing is they can be moved from one site in Hyndburn only to set up only a few hundred yards away, always remembering that they usually know the law inside out, and how to get round it

jaysay · 23-06-2011, 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

As you say Margaret, "Prejudice in my book, is when you have no personal experience of a situation, yet make derogatory comments about it" and it was that sort of prejudice that I was referring to. How many people on here actually experienced the bad part of those 2 cases? But even if you were on the receiving end, I'm just saying that you must respond in an adult to adult way, rather than a parent to child way like many do - eg "I'm not going to discuss this because you are wrong and I am right and no matter what you say I am right" sort of thing. Alternatively people sometimes react like children - eg "it's not fair, this is where I want to play and they've come and spoiled it. Daddy (council, police) go and give them a good hiding."

The adult way is to do as has been done in these 2 cases. If G Jones or Clare Pritchard had not got involved would anybody else have taken the same steps? As you say "many people do not like travellers living close to them because they know that they have a justifiably bad reputation" but how many would just complain, moan, whinge and use racist language, how many would have a go at the travellers and abuse them, and how many would take the course that was successful?

Step one from Joe Public would be to phone the police, where they would be told that it was out of their jurisdiction, it is up to the land owner to get an injunction to get them moved, the only time the police will get involved is if the people (land owners, that being the council or private individual whose land they are encamped on) are having trouble enforcing the injunction, although in most cases the police will be on hand anyway. The other point is these illegal sites do effect everybody because its the council tax payer who has to pick up the tab for cleaning up the mess they always, and I stress always leave behind, which in some cases has run into thousands of pounds, is it any wonder people get upset when this happens time and time again

Tealeaf · 23-06-2011, 17:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

The adult way is to do as has been done in these 2 cases. If G Jones or Clare Pritchard had not got involved would anybody else have taken the same steps? As you say "many people do not like travellers living close to them because they know that they have a justifiably bad reputation" but how many would just complain, moan, whinge and use racist language, how many would have a go at the travellers and abuse them, and how many would take the course that was successful?

Give me an RPG7 or a LAWS and I would have no hesitation about blowing these anus holes off the face of this planet.

Gobbiner, most people in this borough are sick to the teeth of having to bear the results of liberal, do-gooding legislation which gives all rights to criminal and anti-social scum; I in particular do not wish to read your nauseous drivel in defence of so called Travellers. If you like 'em so much, then go and join 'em = providing, of course, you stay well clear of Hyndburn.

garinda · 23-06-2011, 17:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

As you say Margaret, "Prejudice in my book, is when you have no personal experience of a situation, yet make derogatory comments about it" and it was that sort of prejudice that I was referring to. How many people on here actually experienced the bad part of those 2 cases? But even if you were on the receiving end, I'm just saying that you must respond in an adult to adult way, rather than a parent to child way like many do - eg "I'm not going to discuss this because you are wrong and I am right and no matter what you say I am right" sort of thing. Alternatively people sometimes react like children - eg "it's not fair, this is where I want to play and they've come and spoiled it. Daddy (council, police) go and give them a good hiding."

The adult way is to do as has been done in these 2 cases. If G Jones or Clare Pritchard had not got involved would anybody else have taken the same steps? As you say "many people do not like travellers living close to them because they know that they have a justifiably bad reputation" but how many would just complain, moan, whinge and use racist language, how many would have a go at the travellers and abuse them, and how many would take the course that was successful?

Er...I don't think most of us need a lesson in how to behave in an 'adult way', when discussing travellers.

(Ignoring the fact that this is a bit of an oxymoron. Seeing as there are plenty of childishly immature adults.)

This forum has rules we agree to abide by.

Anything that's deemed to be racist or offensive by the site owner, and his moderators, is removed. Which satisfies this forum's rules, and the law.

Gobbiner17 · 23-06-2011, 17:42

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaysay

The other point is these illegal sites do effect everybody because its the council tax payer who has to pick up the tab for cleaning up the mess they always, and I stress always leave behind, which in some cases has run into thousands of pounds, is it any wonder people get upset when this happens time and time again

I wasn't lying, Jaysay, or making it up to defend travellers, when I said the travellers left Church traffic lights clean and tidy. I saw it myself. So please think before you stress always because it is obviously an exaggeration. How could you possibly know if it was always? As you say, is it any wonder people get upset when this (exaggeration in this case) happens time and time again?

walkinman221 · 23-06-2011, 17:44

I think people who are willing to defend the "travelling" people generally have not had them camped on their doorsteps,it seems also to be the case when you get some do gooder banging on about criminals rights they tend not to live in places where they come across the sort of scum bags that most ordinary folk have to put up with on a day to day basis. Anyway back to the "travellers" they know there are designated sites for them, funded by the tax payer i might add, but they choose to set up camp illegally so in my opinion deserve to be moved on at the earliest opportunity,as non contributing citizens their rights are limited unless they conform to the laws of the land how can they expect to be treated on an equal footing and as jaysay has stated they ALWAYS leave their short term abodes a **** mess.

Tealeaf · 23-06-2011, 17:46

I would assume that the land at Church Traffic Lights belongs to someone; did your gypo friends seek permission before they set up camp there? Yes or no?

garinda · 23-06-2011, 17:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

I wasn't lying, Jaysay, or making it up to defend travellers, when I said the travellers left Church traffic lights clean and tidy. I saw it myself. So please think before you stress always because it is obviously an exaggeration. How could you possibly know if it was always? As you say, is it any wonder people get upset when this (exaggeration in this case) happens time and time again?

Did you search where they were illegally camped with a fine toothed comb?

Did they carefully pack and take away every dog turd?

walkinman221 · 23-06-2011, 17:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

I wasn't lying, Jaysay, or making it up to defend travellers, when I said the travellers left Church traffic lights clean and tidy. I saw it myself. So please think before you stress always because it is obviously an exaggeration. How could you possibly know if it was always? As you say, is it any wonder people get upset when this (exaggeration in this case) happens time and time again?

Well i can say that i went to a1 motor store shortly after they left there and the amount of HUMAN faeces left in and around the planting beds in the car park was disgusting , and i cant see the lads from a1 taking a dump in their own car park can you?

Then again if you dont mind somebody taking a crap in public places on a regular basis invite them to your garden for a get together.

Margaret Pilkington · 23-06-2011, 17:50

Gobbiner, people whinge and moan because frequently the travellers leave the place a mess.
I have never known a group of travellers clear up the place where they have been encamped, but you have...so there our, experiences differ.
They seem to drive about in un-taxed vehicles...which usually means they are uninsured too. They are not abiding by the laws which the majority of us have to adhere to.
And whatever communty they foist themselves onto has the unsavoury task of cleaning up their mess and paying for it.
So it isn't any wonder that people get fed up and in those circumstances may resort to language which could be construed as derogatory and racial...this is because it is born out of frustration.

Tealeaf · 23-06-2011, 17:54

The reason that the site at Church Traffic Lights was clean and tidy was because the council cleaners went in there immeadiatly after the gypos left.

jaysay · 23-06-2011, 17:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

I wasn't lying, Jaysay, or making it up to defend travellers, when I said the travellers left Church traffic lights clean and tidy. I saw it myself. So please think before you stress always because it is obviously an exaggeration. How could you possibly know if it was always? As you say, is it any wonder people get upset when this (exaggeration in this case) happens time and time again?

There is one thing I can say (and I'm not exaggerating) is that over the last 25 years they have cost council tax payers in Hyndburn hundreds of thousands of pounds to clear up after them, plus a lot of money by private individuals too, I've lost count of the number of times they have ruined football pitches and other council land, whiteash playing fields being a prime example

garinda · 23-06-2011, 18:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tealeaf

The reason that the site at Church Traffic Lights was clean and tidy was because the council cleaners went in there immeadiatly after the gypos left.

No, you're wrong.

It wasn't our council who cleared up the mess.

We have an eye-witness.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gobbiner17

...the travellers left Church traffic lights clean and tidy. I saw it myself.

I wonder where they eventually got rid of their rubbish, when they so thoughtfully took it all away?

Tealeaf · 23-06-2011, 18:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by garinda

No, you're wrong.

It wasn't our council who cleared up the mess.

We have an eye-witness.

I wonder where they eventually got rid of their rubbish, when they so thoughtfully took it all away?

Lets have the time line:

a) Exactly what time did the gypos leave the site?

b) Exactly what time did our do-gooding chum Gobbiner inspect the site?