UKIP win a seat.

cashman · 10-10-2014, 11:02

Seeing UKIP have now got a voice in the house, It amuses me to listen to the tripe the tories are spouting big time, Saying a vote fer UKIP is a vote fer labour, never heard more pathetic tripe in me life.

The question the big two SHOULD be asking is WHY people are voting UKIP. Its cos people are fed up to the back teeth of the lies n crap spouted by em, I and many of me mates have voted Labour all our lives, and are now voting UKIP, how is that putting Milliband in?

Unless these pillocks address the real reasons, i can personally see UKIP ending up wi more seats than the idiotic Lib Dems come the next election. They only just lost in heywood by 617 votes n that was a safe labour seat, I hope the big 2 are crapping themselves, yeh only get outa life what yeh deserve in the long run imho.

Margaret Pilkington · 10-10-2014, 11:11

The Clacton bye election was caused by Douglas Carswells defection from the tory party...so in essence nothing has changed...just the banner the man travels under
He has a strong reputation there and many people voted for him not because he is UKIP, but because they know he has their interests at heart......he listens to them. He is well liked in that area.

As far as voting for UKIP in a general election...well some people will do it just to give the other parties a fat lip....but they have not got any kind of manifesto......they are a one trick pony.
We haven't got a clue(because they haven't told us of their strategies) how they would manage welfare, the economy or other important issues......we only know that they would stop those with HIV from coming into the country.

I can see where voting for UKIP would give Labour a seat......it dilutes the vote for other parties...all of them.
That is not to say that they would not be in a position to cosy up to whoever does win the next general election.

Margaret Pilkington · 10-10-2014, 11:25

Cashy, there are only so many votes to go around......the more parties there are on the ballot sheet, then the more the vote for the major parties is diluted.

Low turnouts also affect the results...that may seem obvious, but the turnout in the two bye elections was below 40%......only two fifths of those entitled to vote actually did so...that means that although the person who won got a majority, it also means that he doesn't engage with three fifths(the majority) of the electorate.

This disillusionment with politics is rife......and I think it can be squarely laid upon the shoulders of politicians in the past.......they told lies(as always)they took money from the public purse that they were not entitled to...they sold out our sovereignty to the pack in Brussels...they promised we could have a say in whether we stayed in Europe.

It is going to take a lot of reform, a lot of work to get people to engage in politics again, because those who have a vote feel that which ever way they cast it, it won't make a jot of difference to their own lives. Because politicians say one thing when they want your vote, but do something entirely different once they have got your vote...they toe the party line.
We have seen this and know this to be true.
I can't think of any current politician who is worth me putting my cross on a ballot paper.
Politicians are all the same...no matter which party banner they trade under.

cashman · 10-10-2014, 11:43

I know UKIP will never actually win n election, as do most folk i imagine, but if it makes the clowns actually perform in the circus its well worth frightening em i think.

Eric · 10-10-2014, 12:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

We haven't got a clue(because they haven't told us of their strategies) how they would manage welfare, the economy or other important issues.

Let's think about this one for a second ... ok done ... One of the major complaints voiced on here, and in all parliamentary democracies for that matter, is that manifestos, platforms, ... call 'em whatever you like ... are just a bunch of lies hammered together to get votes. They are something politicians can conveniently dump once a party gains power. Economic targets missed, tax cuts delayed, promised referendums put off until some J. Wellington Wimpy future tuesday ... bottom line is that they are a crock of horse manure. So what does it matter that they don't have a detailed list of promises to break? And how, by the way, are your "big two" parties "manag[ing] welfare, the economy or other important issues"? Maybe a lot of folks are just voting for change, opting to give the new guy a shot.

accyman · 10-10-2014, 12:34

ukip may be a one trick pony but their one trick is the one no other party is willing to address and its getting them more and more votes

hyndburn even had a UKIP councilor for about 2 mins

hopefully in the next election we will have an elected government because since blair we havnt had one or should i say an elected priminister

US Angel · 10-10-2014, 14:17

Our circus is about to begin as we

Eric · 10-10-2014, 14:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by US Angel

Our circus is about to begin as we

You guys are lucky ... we get a double dose: once in English and again in French

Margaret Pilkington · 10-10-2014, 15:28

Politics should not be a 'circus'. So we should need no clowns.

What you are saying, is that if the parties ceased to produce manifesto's then it would all be alright...we wouldn't feel so cheated(or at least that is what I think you are saying...I'm pretty sure you will enlighten me if I have got it wrong).
So how would you decide who to vote for in the absence of this pack of lies?
Do you vote for someone because of the banner they trade under....or what?

I prefer to think about who to vote for...to see if the values of the party sync with my core values.......I have never been someone who voted for a party just because it was Labour, or Tory, or Green.
Perhaps that is where I have gone wrong.
I sure as hell misread our current MP.

Margaret Pilkington · 10-10-2014, 15:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by cashman

I know UKIP will never actually win n election, as do most folk i imagine, but if it makes the clowns actually perform in the circus its well worth frightening em i think.

Well if they cannot win an election they are taking votes away from parties that might win.......as well as taking votes from the party that might lose and put someone who we don't want, in power. Dividing the vote.
The only way to avoid this is for there to be voting reform...proportional representation......I can't see that happening anytime soon.

What should really concern all parties is the disaffection for politics.
It doesn't matter who gets in...they haven't got the support of the majority, because the majority didn't vote.

There have been a number of times when I have trailed myself off to the polling station and written none of the above on the ballot paper......because the lot of them were a shower of Fisons.
It isn't that I am too idle, or apathetic, it is just that the people on the paper do not deserve to have my vote.

cashman · 10-10-2014, 17:43

The arrogance of labour is amazing, We will listen is complete BS. They think no-one is interested in an E.U. Referendum well most of my friends certainly are n Paris, who has a completely different circle of friends, tells me hers are the same, A simple fact like criminals, murderers, n the like come here, Human rights says if we find out we cannot kick em out. Well they shouldn't have been here in the first place, At least Cameron has had the good sense to promise one, even that is i n many others aint sure they will, But Labour - Sod All, If you think thats not ok on parties that may win Margaret, then we must disagree, I honestly do not want em to win as they are now.

Rowlf · 10-10-2014, 17:45

I am a firm believer in everyone voting. As far as I'm concerned anyone who does not vote should have no opinion at all on what ever the government or local council does. I am told that in Australia it is an offence not to vote and folk are fined for not doing so.

Barrie Yates · 10-10-2014, 17:47

Cameron needs to have a pint with Farage and decide which seats UKIP will not stand and which the Tories will not, settle for a coalition with UKIP, re-arrange the parliamentary boundaries and that then screws Labour for the foreseeable future - LDs left to wither on the vine.
That way we will be sure of an In/Out referendum and the necessary border security.

Rowlf · 10-10-2014, 17:48

If I remember rightly Cashman, Cameron promised before the last election that is the Tories won he would give us a referendum on Europe so don't see why anyone would believe him this time round.

cashman · 10-10-2014, 19:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rowlf

If I remember rightly Cashman, Cameron promised before the last election that is the Tories won he would give us a referendum on Europe so don't see why anyone would believe him this time round.

Thats why i said i aint sure they will deliver.