Unions

[Royboy39]

Does anyone take any notice of resolutions passed by Unions?
I did not vote for any union member nor did I vote for the Millbands or the Balls set up.
I have had my fill over the years of the unions who destroyed the car industry,
the ship building and mining industry not forgetting the coal industry.
The present resolutions are based on pension payouts, something that the
majority of people do not get.
I think these resolutions are cobblers and will pass them by.

[gynn]

Originally Posted by Royboy39

The present resolutions are based on pension payouts, something that the majority of people do not get.

I think these resolutions are cobblers and will pass them by.

But many millions of people ARE affected by the pensions changes, and someone has to stand up and voice their concern.

We are not talking just about pensions for fat-cat bureaucrats, but for nurses, cleaners, dinner ladies and carers. They are being made to suffer by the actions of previous governments who saw pension funds as an easy target for "stealing" cash. The Thatcher government in the 1980's reduced the contributions to pension funds which left them underfunded, and this was exacerbated by Gordon Brown's removal of tax concessions for profits made by the funds during the 1990's.

It has left the pension funds in a precarious state. Hyndburn Council's fund, for example, is 48 million pounds underfunded. And so the present government is reducing the amount that people retiring will get from the fund. Future generations are being made to pay for the excesses of the past.

It is not a party political issue, because the sufferers are both Labour and Conservative voters, and the blame lies with previous Labour and Conservative governments. It is something of a national scandal, and the Unions are right to kick up a fuss, as should any organisation representing the interests of older people.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by gynn

But many millions of people ARE affected by the pensions changes, and someone has to stand up and voice their concern.

We are not talking just about pensions for fat-cat bureaucrats, but for nurses, cleaners, dinner ladies and carers. They are being made to suffer by the actions of previous governments who saw pension funds as an easy target for "stealing" cash. The Thatcher government in the 1980's reduced the contributions to pension funds which left them underfunded, and this was exacerbated by Gordon Brown's removal of tax concessions for profits made by the funds during the 1990's.

It has left the pension funds in a precarious state. Hyndburn Council's fund, for example, is 48 million pounds underfunded. And so the present government is reducing the amount that people retiring will get from the fund. Future generations are being made to pay for the excesses of the past.

It is not a party political issue, because the sufferers are both Labour and Conservative voters, and the blame lies with previous Labour and Conservative governments. It is something of a national scandal, and the Unions are right to kick up a fuss, as should any organisation representing the interests of older people.

That's all well and good but I never notices anybody taking to the streets when private pensions were hijacked, leaving millions sort on their pensions, if lower pensions is okay for the private sector it sure as hell should be for the public sector, after all the public sector pensions are funded by millions who will never benefit from them in any way shape or form

[cmonstanley]

actually there has been lots of protests at shareholder meetings the mainstream press dont report it because most of these companies have an interest in these corporations or vice versa

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by cmonstanley

actually there has been lots of protests at shareholder meetings the mainstream press dont report it because most of these companies have an interest in these corporations or vice versa

What the hell has that got to do with the price of fish

[Josie Bloggs]

Maybe if more private sector people joined unions they'd've had more protection. Public sector union members do pay subs out of their wages after all.

[steeljack]

Originally Posted by Josie Bloggs

Public sector union members do pay subs out of their wages after all.

since Public sector employees are paid through the Public purse its the Private (Tax Paying) employees who are paying these union dues.

something for you to note , the "taxes" paid by Pubic employees are only re-cycled £s collected by taxation that have been previously contributed by folks who create wealth .

[gynn]

Originally Posted by steeljack

since Public sector employees are paid through the Public purse its the Private (Tax Paying) employees who are paying these union dues.

something for you to note , the "taxes" paid by Pubic employees are only re-cycled £s collected by taxation that have been previously contributed by folks who create wealth .

Are you sitting comfortably, steeljack? Then I'll begin........(again!)

Once Upon a Time, there was a big bad public sector worker. He was a happy chappie, protected from the realities of life with his inflation linked salary and his gold plated pension. But he spent his life sponging off everybody else, so something had to be done about him.
Then one day, he lost his job, and couldn’t go to work that morning.
He didn’t get in his car, which stayed in the garage, and didn’t need filling up. So the petrol pump attendant wasn’t needed. Nor did the car need servicing, so the garage mechanic wasn’t needed. He didn’t get the bus, so the bus driver wasn’t needed. Nor did he get the train, so the train driver wasn’t needed, and the conductor on the train wasn’t needed, and the ticket collector wasn’t needed.
He didn’t buy a paper on the way into work, so the news vendor wasn’t needed. He didn’t buy a bar of chocolate, so the kiosk seller wasn’t needed.
He didn’t enter his office, so the receptionist wasn’t needed. He didn’t make a mess, so the cleaner wasn’t needed.
At dinner time, he didn’t go for lunch. So the canteen assistant wasn’t needed. He didn’t nip out for a sandwich, so the sandwich maker wasn’t needed. He didn’t get a drink from the vending machine, so the machine operator wasn’t needed.
On the way home, he hadn’t parked his car, so the car park attendant wasn’t needed. He hadn’t parked his car illegally so the traffic warden wasn’t needed.
He didn’t need to call in the pub on the way home, so the bar worker wasn’t needed.
Instead, he spent the day getting ready to go to the job centre to look for a job in the big bad world. After all, he’d been told that he and 499,999 of his colleagues would be absorbed by the private sector.
But when he got there, he couldn’t get through the door for the crowds of ex petrol pump attendants, garage mechanics, bus drivers, train drivers, conductors, ticket collectors, news vendors, kiosk sellers, receptionists, cleaners, canteen assistants, sandwich makers, machine operators, car park attendants, traffic wardens and bar workers.
So he couldn’t get a job and had to sign on, only to be told there was no money left to give him. And with his gold plated pension gone, there was no way he could possibly live happily ever after.................
The End.

[Benipete]

Was that the year after he took 16 weeks paid sick leave 10 weeks paid holidays and 26 weeks paternity leave.

[andrewb]

Originally Posted by gynn

Are you sitting comfortably, steeljack? Then I'll begin........(again!)

Once Upon a Time, there was a big bad public sector worker. He was a happy chappie, protected from the realities of life with his inflation linked salary and his gold plated pension. But he spent his life sponging off everybody else, so something had to be done about him.
Then one day, he lost his job, and couldn’t go to work that morning.
He didn’t get in his car, which stayed in the garage, and didn’t need filling up. So the petrol pump attendant wasn’t needed. Nor did the car need servicing, so the garage mechanic wasn’t needed. He didn’t get the bus, so the bus driver wasn’t needed. Nor did he get the train, so the train driver wasn’t needed, and the conductor on the train wasn’t needed, and the ticket collector wasn’t needed.
He didn’t buy a paper on the way into work, so the news vendor wasn’t needed. He didn’t buy a bar of chocolate, so the kiosk seller wasn’t needed.
He didn’t enter his office, so the receptionist wasn’t needed. He didn’t make a mess, so the cleaner wasn’t needed.
At dinner time, he didn’t go for lunch. So the canteen assistant wasn’t needed. He didn’t nip out for a sandwich, so the sandwich maker wasn’t needed. He didn’t get a drink from the vending machine, so the machine operator wasn’t needed.
On the way home, he hadn’t parked his car, so the car park attendant wasn’t needed. He hadn’t parked his car illegally so the traffic warden wasn’t needed.
He didn’t need to call in the pub on the way home, so the bar worker wasn’t needed.
Instead, he spent the day getting ready to go to the job centre to look for a job in the big bad world. After all, he’d been told that he and 499,999 of his colleagues would be absorbed by the private sector.
But when he got there, he couldn’t get through the door for the crowds of ex petrol pump attendants, garage mechanics, bus drivers, train drivers, conductors, ticket collectors, news vendors, kiosk sellers, receptionists, cleaners, canteen assistants, sandwich makers, machine operators, car park attendants, traffic wardens and bar workers.
So he couldn’t get a job and had to sign on, only to be told there was no money left to give him. And with his gold plated pension gone, there was no way he could possibly live happily ever after.................
The End.

That is a nice story but doesn't add up.

The private sector employees taxes pay for the public sector jobs. Money in the economy is not lost by reducing public sector jobs. Reducing them leaves room for the private sector to grow.

The story is supposed to make you think the whole of the private sector relys on the public sector which is rubbish. It could only be the case if the Government funded the public sector by borrowing rather than taxing the private sector. That is unsustainable and clearly can't continue forever. If that's the case then an urgent rebalancing of the economy is needed.

The second reason the story is a load of nonsense is recent history. In the 1990s for every public sector job lost there were 3 private sector jobs created.

[jaysay]

Originally Posted by Benipete

Was that the year after he took 16 weeks paid sick leave 10 weeks paid holidays and 26 weeks paternity leave.

No that was the year before Beni, I know a chap that worked in the public sector and they were allowed 13 weeks a year off sick with full pay, he was very lucky in that respect as he wasn't that good health wise, he was of ill 13 weeks every year

[MargaretR]

Instead of griping that public sector workers get a better deal than those in the private sector, why not demand the same 'so called' priviledges for all workers?

I expect the response will be 'the country can't afford it' - who says? - it is just a matter of diverting money from war to the benefit of workers.

[gynn]

Originally Posted by andrewb

That is a nice story but doesn't add up.

Spending goes in a circle. Yes, the private sector creates the wealth and pays taxes which fund the public sector. But the story doesn't end there. Part of the wealth the private sector creates is recycled money from the pockets of the public sector, which parts of the private sector come to rely on. It's one big circle, and getting rid of the public sector isn't the answer, because many jobs by definition are not wealth creating..

Yes the public sector have been protected from the market place in the past, and are certainly being made to psy the price in terms of reduced jobs. But on the pensions issue the complaint is that promises previously given, on which personal financial decisions have been made, have been broken.

You can't blame them for protesting about that!

[walkinman221]

So what if public sector workers are given good conditions on pensions ,sick pay, holidays etc, that doesnt mean they dont do valuable jobs ,police, nurses, doctors,firemen and many others do hard jobs in poor conditions and under a lot of stress.Many taking off no time on the sick for years on end.Do they not contribute to society ? Or is it only private sector workers who keep this country afloat? Also i dont think our armed forces would be to pleased with hearing people complaining about the public sector not contributing do you.

[Josie Bloggs]

Originally Posted by steeljack

since Public sector employees are paid through the Public purse its the Private (Tax Paying) employees who are paying these union dues.:

The employees have still worked to earn that money though, mainly motivated by wanting to provide a great service to resident's. So its their money.