What do you make of this?

[LYNX1]

Something that annoys me is when public people like musicians complain about TV and newspapers. Without TV and newspapers they are nothing anyway. They want to be on the front page every week but it would appear to be only when it suits them.[/quote]


Agree with you completely on that score Neil........but have to admit he seemed to keep out of the limelight when he wasn't promoting stuff with the band, sad as a death is for someone so young I won't be charging round the internet looking for things to sign, the lad's dead lets leave it at that, and let his family mourn in peace.

[Acrylic-bob]

I think I am with John Donne on this one; to an extent, that is.

"Any man's death diminishes me, because I am involved in Mankind; And therefore never send to know for whom the bell tolls; it tolls for thee."

So, it is unfortunate that this young man is now dead. May he rest in peace. One feels for the parents, naturally, it is a hard burden to bear to have to bury one's child. One feels a little also for the loss felt by friends; one is sad that they are grieved.

But there it ends. And it ends because I did not know the deceased personally. Of course I had seen him cavorting on television once or twice and I was vaguely aware of his reputation as a gay person, but that is all. And I would argue that this will be true for the vast majority of people who have worked themselves up into such a fine fury over the comments of a Daily Mail journalist, variously described as 'hateful', 'homophobic', 'bigoted', etc etc. . I mean, The Daily Mail, for heaven's sake!

I don't think that there was any need for the Jacksonesque weepfest that his funeral became, with Ronan Keating apparently usurping the position of chief mourner; if you are intent on looking for skeletons, that would be a closet case well worth examining. It strikes me that there is too much wearing of one's (in)sincerity on one's sleeve in all this, to be justified by Gately's meagre contribution to the national cultural life. Does every 'celebrity' death have to bring the country to a grinding halt and dominate the national consciousness for days? And which particular celebrity list does one draw the line at; 'C', 'F', --- 'Z'?

As for Jan Moir's observations on the relative value of Civil Partnerships, I think that she has got it pretty much right. It is a truism that men have a roving eye and nowhere is this more true than among gay men; and before anyone starts, I'm gay, so I know whereof I speak! And so to expect that Gately's Civil Partnership was as pure and untarnished as those he sang about in his mawkish ditties is naieve, in the extreme!

To those who have rushed out to have "Stephen I will remember you forever" tattooed across their forheads in vain attempt to out-Keating Keating, I would offer the following observation: the world is a big place, you really should get out more!

[jaysay]

To me the death of any one is sad, especially for those left behind, but when people court the headlines for their own publicity, they must remember its a two way street. I think what this article was pointing out was that gay partnerships are just as likely to have ups and downs like any other

[garinda]

He was the first boyband member to come out as gay, even if it was just before he was about to be outed by the press.

Even though their fan base was mainly young girls, the public acknowledgement of his sexuality didn't affect their popularity, and that shows just how far we've come, certainly amongst the younger generation, who couldn't really give two figs about the gender of someone else's partner.

I've read the article, and there is a subtle homophobia, by the use of words such as natural, strange, and lonely. It's the Daily Mail for goodness sake, edited by a right-wing Catholic, who thinks contraception is evil, so I'm not greatly shocked they employ a columnist who makes use of such terminology to get across her distaste of his lifestyle.

He died very young, and like any such death, that's sad. Though no more sad than anyone else's, which happens before their time.

I suppose if I'd been a fan, and he'd been part of my growing up, I might have found the public brouhaha, The People's Pop Princess's flower strewn journey to his final resting place on Craggy Island, a little more palatable.

Like others have said, what disgusts me more isn't the early natural death of a popular singer, but the pointless, daily deaths of our armed services.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Well Gary, I read that article and I didn't see the comments as subtle homophobia....to me they were more objective observations........not coloured by the mawkish penchant for grieving over someone, who none of us knew as a human being.
We only knew of Stephen Gately what the magazines and press wanted to tell us....and how much of that you choose to believe....well it is all relative.

I am sorry for his family, because they will be experiencing emotional turmoil at the moment....and it cannot be good for them to have the media inferring or alluding to events that might have been responsible for his untimely death.
Whether his death was natural or unnatural will be of no comfort to his family....and neither will the well orchestrated internet campaign to castigate a columnist for her perceived slights against him.

I think the post by Acrylic Bob says it all......and says it all so well.
There are other, more important issues that we should be concerning ourselves with.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Well Gary, I read that article and I didn't see the comments as subtle homophobia....to me they were more objective observations.

I'm afraid I disagree.

Her choice of words, 'natural/strange/lonely' etc, hark back to an earlier time, when homosexuality was medically recognised as a mental illness, and it's sufferers were seen as being incapable of living fulfilling and happy lives.

She has no evidence to support the use of any of those terms.

He was doing what many young people were doing last weekend, socialising with friends.

[Margaret Pilkington]

Well, with the greatest respect, we will have to disagree on that point Gary.....but hey you are entitled to your opinion. I didn't look for homophobic references(either implied or overt) in the article....and as a result of not being open to those possibilities, I didn't see them.
Maybe that is because I view the situation from a different perspective.

I think that there is far too much interest in the lives of these so called celebs...not least their sexuality.......and Stephen Gately proclaimed his sexuality......OK, he was going to be 'outed'...but this implies that his sexuality was bigger than him as a human being......and his death has added to the speculation as to what he was doing......as if it really matters to the rest of us......does it matter to you?
It certainly doesn't matter to me......other than he died after probably, having a very good time with his friends....this is wildly different from the way the lads and lasses overseas are dying.......and their deaths rate only a third class mention. That is a lamentable fact.....parents are losing sons and daughters while they are doing a job for this country......and we get all precious about some columnist who is perceived to have cast a slur on a fading pop star.
Somehow, we seem to have our values skewed.

[Neil]

Originally Posted by garinda

Her choice of words, 'natural/strange/lonely' etc, hark back to an earlier time, when homosexuality was medically recognised as a mental illness, and it's sufferers were seen as being incapable of living fulfilling and happy lives.

It probably still is in Catholic Ireland.

[gdm27]

Yet again the Mail publishing a story plucked out of the air. How many times has this happened with this paper??

[MargaretR]

Unless you need the newspaper for polishing your windows I can see no logical reason for buying them.
They are just propoganda leaflets.
Why pay to have your mind modified with biased info?

[Margaret Pilkington]

The Mail didn't publish a story...they published a column.....and a columnists opinion.
I really think that you need to read the column before you can comment on its contents.

[garinda]

Originally Posted by Margaret Pilkington

Well, with the greatest respect, we will have to disagree on that point Gary.....but hey you are entitled to your opinion. I didn't look for homophobic references(either implied or overt) in the article....and as a result of not being open to those possibilities, I didn't see them.
Maybe that is because I view the situation from a different perspective.

I think that there is far too much interest in the lives of these so called celebs...not least their sexuality.......and Stephen Gately proclaimed his sexuality......OK, he was going to be 'outed'...but this implies that his sexuality was bigger than him as a human being......and his death has added to the speculation as to what he was doing......as if it really matters to the rest of us......does it matter to you?
It certainly doesn't matter to me......other than he died after probably, having a very good time with his friends....this is wildly different from the way the lads and lasses overseas are dying.......and their deaths rate only a third class mention. That is a lamentable fact.....parents are losing sons and daughters while they are doing a job for this country......and we get all precious about some columnist who is perceived to have cast a slur on a fading pop star.
Somehow, we seem to have our values skewed.

Without any evidence, the columnist's use of the words 'natural', 'strange', and 'lonely', to describe someone who was going out with their mates, as many thousands of other young people did last weekend, implies that there was something seedy about this boy's life...again without giving any shred of evidence to back up her claim.

People's obsession with celebrity has been going on since there has been affordable mass media, be it music hall performers, or early Hollywood actors. Some people like vocariously escaping their hum-drum lives, by knowing all this is to know about seemingly more glamorous ones.

I quite agree that our newspapers don't pay enough coverage to the many deaths that are happening in areas of armed conflict. Certainly not in the Daily Mail, which is why I don't buy it.

As we've both said, we'll have to agree to disagree on this one.

[Margaret Pilkington]

As long as we can agree to remain friends....a difference of opinion, I can live with that.

I cannot quite remember the context in which the words were used....and I no longer have access to the article........and to be perfectly honest I don't pay a lot of attention to so called celebrity gossip...which is why I abhor those magazines that are full of the stuff.
I have enough going on in my own hum-drum life to contend with.......I don't need the reports on folk who have no bearing in my life......but saying that, I do feel sad for his parents and his immediate family...parents should not have to bury a child...it is the wrong order.