What’s In A Name?

[jambutty]

Has anyone noticed that more and more people in the spotlight, so to speak, have got double-barrelled surnames?

Double-barrelled surnames used to be the sole prerogative of the aristocracy and the ruling classes but now it seems that any Tom, Dick or Harry can have a double-barrelled name. Maybe we, are rather our descendants, will all end up with a double-barrelled surname. It would be something else to argue about as to which name is used first.

So to forestall arguments when two people marry, instead of the woman taking the man's name, they both have each other's names. Thus if Mr. Smith marries Miss Brown then he uses the name Mr. Smith-Brown and she Mrs. Brown-Smith. Their children would then take their surname according to their sex. Any sons would be called Master Smith-Brown and daughters, Miss Brown-Smith. Then when they marry they drop the last part of their name. So when Miss Brown-Smith marries Mr. Taylor-Green she drops Smith and he drops Green and she becomes Mrs Brown-Taylor and he becomes Mr Taylor-Brown.

However I suppose that by the time a different way of naming people is developed we will all be just numbers in some massive computer database.

Now sit up straight and pay attention because here is a history lesson on surnames.

According to my information surnames as we know them today, were first assumed in Europe from the 11th to the 15th century. They were not in use in England and Scotland before the Norman conquest of 1066 and were first found in the Doomsday Book. The use of a second name, a custom introduced by the Normans, who themselves had not long before adopted it, became in course of time a mark of gentle blood. It was deemed a disgrace for a gentleman to have one single name, as the peasants had. It was not until about 1310 that the practice of using surnames became general amongst all people.

Surnames were adopted according to fairly general principles and can be divided into four classifications: Local names taken from places of origin. (Mr. Lancaster came from the town of Lancaster) Occupational names denote the trade or profession. (Mr. Cooper made barrels) Nicknames describe mental and physical characteristics, complexion, clothes etc. The patronymic was the method of taking the first name of the father as the last name of the son. (Mr. Thompson is the son of Thomas)

In my case the surname of Buckley is local of Buckley a parish in St. Albans, a township of the County of Cheshire. To this day there is a small town called Buckley in North Wales, (530 10' North, 30 5' West) which I believe was at one time in Cheshire. Over the years politics has moved county boundaries for reasons best known to the politicians. Many years ago I passed through the town of Buckley on the way to a holiday camp in North Wales. All I can say is that it only took a few minutes to drive through.

The name Buckley appears to be derived from the olde worlde spelling Bukkelegh. Early parish records dated 1332 mention a Christian de Bukkelegh who seems to have been a gentleman living in the parish of St. Albans. His family had a coat of arms the motto on which was Nec Temere Nec Timide, which means Neither Rashly Nor Timidly. It seems that I have unknowingly adopted this motto as I have approached life with this in mind long before I ever knew of the mottos existence. Whether I am descended from him or not, I do not know but I do know that my father's family lived in the Manchester area and their ancestors moved to that area during the Industrial Revolution. In those days people didn't travel great distances even to re-locate for work reasons so it is quite possible that they came from Buckley as it isn't all that far from Manchester. If I am descended from Christian de Bukkelegh it is quite likely by way of an illegitimate birth to a peasant girl in the parish, rather than by legitimate means. In those days noblemen often had there way with the local virgins to abandon them afterwards. They seemed to treat it as their right to do so.

In our local telephone directory which covers Blackburn and surrounding districts, an area containing about half a million people, there are only about 100 Buckleys listed only one of whom is, as far as I know, directly related to me. So we Buckleys are not very rare but each one of us is unique. But then we are all unique.

[kerrie l]

:engsmil: :engsmil: so if my son sydney married an australian girl called harbor and our last name is bridge.does that make my son the biggest thing in australia, or if the former game show hostess ISLA ST CLAIR married BARRY WHITE then divorced him and then married BRIAN FERRY would she be called ISLA WIGHT FERRY,

[katex]

Tee hee Kerrie, these things do happen, don't they? My daughter's boyfriend is called Hind and my grandaughter is hoping that, if they get married, she would not be persuaded to take his name, becoming Abbie Hind.

Actually, Jambutty, think how double-barrelled names came about was if say the Lord of the Manor had his way with one of the local ladies, and an offspring was produced, then that offspring would bear both their names, pointing out that it was a b*stard. So always amuses me when people adopt this type of surname.

[lettie]

Hehehe, an interesting history lesson Jambutty.. It's not the double-barrelling of surnames which bothers me, it's the stupidity of some of the christian names, a phenomenon favoured by celebs. In a recent interview Geri Halliwell claimed that there was no way that she would give her daughter a daft name as she wanted something a little more traditional.......Hence, 'Bluebell Madonna.' How many other children have had to suffer horrendous names. Fifi-Trixibell, Apple, Heavenly Hiranu Tiger-Lily, Brooklyn etc... These people should be done for child abuse.

For some reason when I hear the word bluebell.........I think farmyard animals.

[jambutty]

Surnames only kerrie I but it was a good try and quite funny too.

I never knew that about the origin of double-barrelled names katex. I always thought that it was some people trying to be posh and emphasising or rather trying to emphasise that they were better than us. So thanks! I’ve just been educated – again!

Ah! Yes! The choice of first names and the acronym they, with the surname, could produce. I knew a guy in the navy who was named Frank Arthur Roger Thompson. Imagine the ribbing that he got at school? Don't imagine what we called him. I also knew a guy with 3 first names and the acronym starting and ending with a T.

It was Clinton who started all this place name as a first name nonsense with his daughter Chelsea wasn’t it? Although I remember many years ago a die hard Liverpool supporter named his off spring after all the Liverpool first team.

[Gayle]

My pre marriage surname was Highton which very boringly means 'from a high town'. I never once considered the double barralled approach but it did take me a while to get used to the new name. When anyone asked for Mrs Knight I kept looking around waiting for Chris' mother to show up - most disconcerting on our honeymoon! hehe

My friends aren't married so they have gone for the double barrell thing for their sons.

[steeljack]

Have to agree with Katex , whenever I hear a double barrel name I allways think the same.
It seems to be becomming more popular amongst "BSBs", women employed in middle management corporate/Govt. jobs, usually the insecure ones who are in affirmitive action created positions.

BSB.... Back Stabbing Bitch

[katex]

Poor Frank, eh Jambutty. Was just going to say once probably not a common euphenism when he was born, but, of course, Shakespeare used this word, did he not on occasions ?

When I was on holiday last week, the Cruise Director pulled a guy out of the audience and asked his name. "Little" he replied, and first name "Dick". Perfectly true, some parents do not think, do they ?

[Busman747]

Willow and I both use a double-barrel name - and the reason has nothing to do with snobbery or self ego.

Willow has two daughters as many accywebbers will know, both at an impressionable age. Their father died a couple of years before I came on the scene and we were both a little worried about the effect of a new man (me) coming into the house and mum changing her name away from the surname given her by marriage and of course, used by the girls.

I also have a step-daughter down south and when she was at school, there were quite a few difficulties getting the school to accept that my late wife (who carried my surname) was actually the mother - and that I was my step-daughters legal guardian.

It is for these two reasons that Willow and I took the step of using a double-barrel name. It is quite easy for a woman as they are expected to change surnames after marriage. I have had many an argument with banks, D.V.L.A. etc but one year on, I have only my passport left to change

[katex]

Well, just hope you and Willow stick together or else will be a right condundrum. Think they would have understood better the original process.

[WillowTheWhisp]

Not sure what you mean there katex by "original process" but it is very important to me to retain in my surname the name of my first husband and father of my children, and importnt for hem to keep the surname of their father. Had I been divorced from him and then married Busman I would simply have taken Busman's name and the children may well have changed their name to his as well but when their father died he was still very much part of the family and very much loved by all. The girls will of course adopt their husband's names when they marry but until such time they retain their father's name and in my opinion rightly so because that is whose daughters they are.

It is probably more important to us as a Latter-day Saint family as we believe the family relationships continue for eternity so although they now have a stepfather they still have a father too.

I have LDS friends who have been divorced and who have taken the surname of the new husband on marrying, and whose children have taken the surname of the new step father but as I said divorce is a different situation to death.

Incidentally, there is legally absolutely nothing to stop anyone adopting any surname on marriage. It's only the fact that most organisations are used to the woman taking the man's name that anything other than that tends to confuse them. Once we'd got one organisation to accept and understand that it was perfectly legal the others took that as a precedent and followed suit.

[grannyclaret]

Well if its all right for Cilla on Corrie to have a double barrelled surname,,then its good enough for anyone else...
Mind you I quite like Cilla Battersby Brown ,,,its got a nice ring to it..

[katex]

[QUOTE=WillowTheWhisp]Not sure what you mean there katex by "original process" but it is very important to me to retain in my surname the name of my first husband and father of my children, and importnt for hem to keep the surname of their father. Had I been divorced from him and then married Busman I would simply have taken Busman's name and the children may well have changed their name to his as well but when their father died he was still very much part of the family and very much loved by all.[/QUOT

Believe me, no criticism intended here at all, just thought better to stick to the norm. and change your name, because this is how society understands it and the children will be questioned more by your double-barrel than anything.

Just one question, if you had another child of your own, then what name would that child adopt ?

[West Ender]

My maiden name was Sleddon and as far as I can ascertain it derives from Slaidburn, where my earliest traceable ancestors originated. It seems to me to be a good thing my ancestors used their birthplace as a surname rather than their occupation as they were, right up to my grandfather, all blacksmiths and my name would, in that case, have been Smith which would have made ancestry research extremely difficult.

I used to have a Spanish friend whose name was Manuel Martinez-Gammez. His father's name was Martinez and his mother's was Gammez but if he married, say, a senorina José his children would be known as Martinez-José. If his daughter then married a Senor Cadiz her children would then be known as Cadiz-Martinez.

Personally, I like the Icelandic way of surnaming where the offspring take the father's first name with the addition of gender. In that way my surname would have been Harrisdotter and my brothers would be Harrison. My son would be Colinsen, my daughters Colinsdotters, my grandson Garisen and my granddaughter Simonsdotter.

I can empathise with anyone who has children adopted by a step-father, who opts for a double barreled name, but it can get very complicated.

[Madhatter]

The same name logically, otherwise it would be different to the rest of the children. The idea is to bring the two, or three seperate children together to be one family. It's always difficult when a parent dies, I think It's important to show the kids that your not trying to forget, just that your moving on with the next stage in your life, something that they would have wanted.