Maclaren To Manage England FC.

jambutty · 28-04-2006, 13:17

I’m not being xenophobic but I take the view that a national football team should be managed by a national of that country.

All it does to bring in a foreign coach to manage our national team is prevent our home grown club managers from attaining a level of expertise needed for International football.

Sven was brought in amidst much trumpeting of his past record but what has he done for the England team? Did we win the World Cup? Did we win the European Cup? Did we even get close? No! No! And thrice no! He wasn’t worth the reported £5,000,000 per year salary.

After the current World Cup our next International competition is the European Cup in two years time and that is plenty of time for a new English manager to blossom. No doubt an Englishman would give his eye teeth to manage our national side and would probably do so for free although £1,000,000 pa on a 2 years contract would help.

Let me take you back to 1966 when Alf Ramsey (who? – manager of Ipswich – now there was a team with European credentials – er not really) took us to International glory.

Steve Maclaren has been assistant coach to Sven for quite some time and is his natural successor and he could well have a European competition cup under his belt with Middlesbro by the time that Sven runs laughing all the way to the bank – a Swiss one probably.

If Steve Maclaren can motivate his team to come back from the jaws of defeat against all the odds, not just once but TWICE, to win two European cup matches then surely those are credentials enough to manage a national side. The Middlesbro players, good as they are, are not the best in the world but their manager motivated them to make supreme efforts and made a few tactical changes. The rest as they say is history and it sort of repeated itself too.

Just a small aside – I thoroughly enjoyed both games.

The FA should take note and appoint Curbishley as his assistant.

Bazf · 28-04-2006, 15:58

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I’m not being xenophobic

Yes you are.

jambutty · 28-04-2006, 18:43

The last time that I looked Bazf:
Xenophobia – noun intense or irrational dislike or fear of people from other countries
Xenophobic – adjective
Just exactly where did I show an intense or irrational dislike or fear of people from other countries?

Bazf · 28-04-2006, 19:40

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national football team should be managed by a national of that country

For xenophobia there are two main objects of the phobia. The first is a population group present within a society, which is not considered part of that society.The second form of xenophobia is primarily cultural, and the object of the phobia is cultural elements which are considered alien.

Is that a new record for the British Press then. They've actually hounded the England manager out of his job BEFORE he actually started.

jambutty · 28-04-2006, 22:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bazf

For xenophobia there are two main objects of the phobia. The first is a population group present within a society, which is not considered part of that society.The second form of xenophobia is primarily cultural, and the object of the phobia is cultural elements which are considered alien.

Is that a new record for the British Press then. They've actually hounded the England manager out of his job BEFORE he actually started.

What’s that got to do with my opinion about whom should manage the national football team?

mani · 29-04-2006, 03:52

oh yeah lets pit a 40K a week player agianst a romanian that is such a level playin field

they shud've hammered steau - as novel the last min goals are mclaren wont last two yrs. and lest we not forget this is the same mclaren who was sittin on the bench as sven when england was losing against brazil and didtn suggest anything.

so if maccy does become one week we can lose 7-0 to italy and then next week we can win germany 3-0? tactically macccy is as unsafe choice as his boro career suggests it is...

as for the alf ramsey comparison

He retired from playing in 1955 to become manager of Ipswich Town, which he managed very successfully, taking the team from the Third Division South to First Division champions in 1962,a truly momentous achievement for a club whose status was very minor to this point,and ambitions were equally modest.

i really missed that season when boro won the premiership...

mani · 29-04-2006, 04:01

and i'm not certain if alf got the job straight after or if he had a chance to manage them for another season as he became manager in 63... either way ipswich drew ac milan in the champions cup who losin 4-2 on aggregate and ac went on to win eventually in the final....

now lets look at the career of the 2nd most successful england manager...

sir bobby robson...

Robson made his debut as a manager in the dug-out of his old club Fulham in January 1968, but did not last long there, leaving the London club in November. He moved on to Ipswich Town F.C. in 1969, and it was here that he first established his reputation as a successful manager. His reign at Ipswich lasted 13 years and during this time he re-shaped a side whose results had consistently placed them in the lower half of the First Divsion table. The team would go on to finish as league vice-champions twice, and began to make regular appearances in European competition, capturing both the FA Cup and UEFA Cup. During his tenure he only brought in 14 players from other clubs, relying instead on players developed through Ipswich's youth programs. Robson's achievements with the previously unheralded side merited him the call of his country, and in 1982 he succeeded the late Ron Greenwood as coach of the English national football team after the World Cup in Spain.

mani · 29-04-2006, 04:38

and i'm not certain if alf got the job straight after or if he had a chance to manage them for another season as he became manager in 63... either way ipswich drew ac milan in the champions cup who losin 4-2 on aggregate and ac went on to win eventually in the final....

now lets look at the career of the 2nd most successful england manager...

sir bobby robson...

Robson made his debut as a manager in the dug-out of his old club Fulham in January 1968, but did not last long there, leaving the London club in November. He moved on to Ipswich Town F.C. in 1969, and it was here that he first established his reputation as a successful manager. His reign at Ipswich lasted 13 years and during this time he re-shaped a side whose results had consistently placed them in the lower half of the First Divsion table. The team would go on to finish as league vice-champions twice, and began to make regular appearances in European competition, capturing both the FA Cup and UEFA Cup. During his tenure he only brought in 14 players from other clubs, relying instead on players developed through Ipswich's youth programs. Robson's achievements with the previously unheralded side merited him the call of his country, and in 1982 he succeeded the late Ron Greenwood as coach of the English national football team after the World Cup in Spain.

jambutty · 29-04-2006, 12:57

As assistant to Sven, Steve is the ideal English manager to take over after the current World Cup. As a club manager he may not have won anything of note but then neither had Alf Ramsey when he became England manager. However both of them were excellent motivators much in the same vein as Brian Clough. They could get more than the best out of players. A player’s earnings don’t come into the equation and only reflect that state of the market and perceived player’s ability.

So to discard Steve Maclaren just because he manages Middlesbro, a team without too many footballing honours is meaningless.

Quote:

and lest we not forget this is the same mclaren who was sittin on the bench as sven when england was losing against brazil and didtn suggest anything.

I wasn’t aware that you were sat on the England bench and was privy to what Steve Maclaren did or didn’t do.

The assistant coach’s job is to assist the manager and not dictate how a team plays. That honour falls to the manager and if he chooses to ignore his assistant’s suggestions then there is nothing that the assistant can do other than keep his counsel or resign.

mani · 29-04-2006, 14:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by jambutty

As a club manager he may not have won anything of note but then neither had Alf Ramsey when he became England manager.

*L* i just said he'd won the div 1 title with a team from div 3 after successive promotions!!!

Bazf · 29-04-2006, 18:19

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The assistant coach’s job is to assist the manager and not dictate how a team plays. That honour falls to the manager and if he chooses to ignore his assistant’s suggestions then there is nothing that the assistant can do other than keep his counsel or resign.

That is Bull S hit, its team work and in modern day football a manager relays more and more on his assistant and 9 times out of 10 will ask and implement his assistants suggestions, most assistants are as qualified as the manager without having to do the more mundane tasks.
As for living in the past the game has moved on considerably since 1966 and Alfs day, if you want to go back to that era then get Fat Sam in charge we an hoof the ball to to the new england captain Davis and his fellow striking partner Nolan, while sitting on the bench will be Rooney and Gerrard because they questioned his decsion.

jambutty · 30-04-2006, 12:03

Wow! I’ve certainly ruffled your feathers Bazf. What’s the matter? Can you not stand someone having an opinion different to yours?

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That is Bull S hit, its team work and in modern day football a manager relays more and more on his assistant and 9 times out of 10 will ask and implement his assistants suggestions

It really is comforting to know that you KNOW exactly what goes on between a manager and his assistant. Who wins if there is a conflict of opinion? I am sure that a manager worth his salt will seek the counsel of his assistant but only to see if there is a better option to the one the manager is considering. I would suggest that most high profile managers rarely if ever do as the assistant suggests. They are too confident of their own ‘expertise’ to risk their reputation on the opinion of someone else.

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most assistants are as qualified as the manager without having to do the more mundane tasks.

In that case what is so wrong in Steve Maclaren taking over as England manager? Sorry I forgot – you don’t approve so it shouldn’t happen.

Bazf · 30-04-2006, 20:34

Sorry not living the past like yourself, all the coaching courses and Football seminars I have been on all tend to emphasise team work between manager and assistant and yes I do know what goes on as an invitee to the dug out at Old Trafford, Riverside, Plainmoor, Withdean and a few more. (Next time they show the dug outs on TV look for someone with a note pad asking questions, he probably on an FA coaching course.)
As for someone with a different opinion I don't mind in the least but someone who has no clue what hes talking about then thats a different matter.

RossendaleRed · 30-04-2006, 21:27

I personally don't think Mclaren is a good choice if he gets it. All the other english candidates don't do it for me I'm afraid.. All the good managers are tied into contracts...I think Gus Hiddink would have been good but the FA let him go to Russia, after the World Cup!!! Fancy offering it to scolari for less money than Sven....It's an insult to a World Cup Winner!!

KIPAX · 02-05-2006, 00:34

I would rather get knocked out in the first round with an English manager than win it with a foriegner in charge... If England win the world cup I would at best feel like a cheat and at worse feel ambarresed that an Englishman couldn't lead us and half the glory should go to Sweden or wherever..

Give the job to an Englishman and stand by him.. I would rather have pride than excuses.