FANs not criminals!!!!

[DAV007]

My friends and I must be hard of hearing.

[cashman]

Depends where ya are i reckon on Clayton End, we hear the tannoy SOMETIMES, then many times NOTHING, n we stand left behind goal. maybe intermittent fault.

[yonmon]

Tannoy functions ?, Till Rolls ?, Banners ?, Police Horses ?, Stewards who used to be Stewards but are no longer Stewards ?, and who might be Stanley Stewards or 'Bought-in' Stewards ?,Over-zealous Policemen and Policewomen who might be Local or from the North-East ?..
Club Safety Officer (s), their function, and whether or not this was fulfilled ?...etc...etc...

All are secondary to the main thrust of this thread which, in my humble opinion is, that again by inadequate Management, this time of an important Game, those at the Club responsible for constructing a strategy to deal successfully with this situation have once more demonstrated inadequacies which have resulted in abject failure to direct and maintain good-order and stirred up
dismay, disappointment, and a strong measure of anger amongst it's Supporters.

If the past is anything to judge by, I fear that little will be learnt by Club Officials from this episode to prevent a similar occurence at some point in the future.although I fervently hope that I am wrong in this prediction !. and unlike the Club I openly express the real sadness felt when hearing of the Physical and Emotional injuries suffered by Stanley Fans last Wednesday evening !.

[cmonstanley]

the thing is theres always been a fault on the tannoy on the clayton end on the left hand side i could never hear it and that was 2 and a half years ago

[Willie Miller]

Thanks for all the support, I have been in contact with the FSF & they are appointing a solicitor as we speak. I was right in my concern about Danny being led away & they wouldn't tell me why. I was wrong in my actions although the police put their hands on me first.

Danny & I had just spent 36 hours, sewing, painting & displaying a massive pre game display. We also both did all 63 games last year & barring some shenanigans at Crewe & Cheltenham, nothing happened.

I urge the support to stick together & not fight over this issue. Its done, lessons will be learnt from our end on how to handle a similar situation. I don't know if the club, stewards or police will learn, nor do I care.

The Clayton End & ASFC is a special place, it shouldn't have been full of police at the end of a game. We are not hooligans. We started SU to encourage loud, passionate, unique support. It is not everyone's cup of tea but it is certainly better than many similar aged supporters at other clubs who look to "Football Factory" for inspiration. Who stand making V signs to the away support for 90 minutes & who throw stuff at away supporters coaches.

I will take any punishment firmly on the chin, as will Danny, but I am hopeful that a football banning order will not be made.

If it is I hope that the colour & noise created by the SU & the Clayton End will carry on until I am back in 2013.

Love you all, live life & prosper.

PS Any character references, get out of jail free cards, help, advice, cakes with "files" in. Can you send to [email protected]

[lancsdave]

Originally Posted by Willie Miller

.

PS Any character references, get out of jail free cards, help, advice, cakes with "files" in. Can you send to [email protected]

FREE JASE t-shirt any good

[CEF]

Originally Posted by DAV007

CEF

your new on here and your clearly a steward

you talk alot of crap

no one was drunk

20 or 30 people where not running at the police, they where climbing over chairs, walking down steps, ducking under bars - you make it sound like a stampede

no one ran at any stewards, the stewards decided to get involved on their own accord

There is a difference between backing a blokes character and condoning illegal activity.
There is also a commercial interest, as the club potentially could lose alot of fans from a young generation, this would also have a knock on effect on the teams performance as their is a direct link towards the boost the players recieve from the fans noise and the intimidation an away keeper/player feels playing in front of the clayton end.

intimidation of away players and officials is a positive thing, it occurs at every football ground to varying degrees.
Never get a penalty at old trafford, anfield or stoke?
pleas dont link intimidation to throwing till rolls, again incase you didnt read it, the till rolls where designed to leave an effect in the goal nets with the rolls hanging down, as seen in many football grounds across europe. It looks impressive.

Its convienent and 100% false for the police/stewards to link till roll throwing to an incient 40 minutes later, which the police and stewards instigated.

one thing the new stewards have been unable to understand or accept, the ultras and the fans in general at accrington self govern and sort out any problems.
This is a unique positive set up.

Dont forget, stewards are their to act as police on the cheap, collect their minimum wage, do a fake NVQ and fulfil their egos.

btw - i just like everyone else was searched by a line of stewards going into the ground. they are useless.

pathetic.

I would love to meet you.

Hi DAV007

I hope everything i have posted isn't crap as i did mention that i hope that Jase & Danny manage not to get banned and that if anyone was mistreated by the officials then they should report them

I am not a steward sorry to disappoint and i have no issue with the original throwing of till rolls it did indeed look pretty impressive. I posted what i actually saw on the night each person has a different account and that makes for a healthy debate

[DAV007]

CEF

fair point.
Im happy to stand corrected.

[choirboy]

I was at the Newcastle match last Wednesday and stayed on singing with the Ultras after the match and saw the distressing scenes that produced a very sour ending to a fabulous night.
I have read every entry on this post and have reflected carefully over the last few days.
The main point that I would like to comment on is that we have to look at the CONTEXT of the events during the evening and how this affects people's behaviour.

Context;
1) BIG GAME - Possibly the biggest game in Stanley's modern history along with the Fulham match last season. Everyone at the club; officials, staff, management and players and many fans, especially some of the Ultras, had worked very hard to get Accrington Stanley seen in the public TV domain noticed in a POSITITVE way. (Read some of the comments by Newcastle supporters on their websites which were very complimentary.)
2) PASSION - Passions run high at football matches and none more so than amongst the Ultras who put so much into their support. (Pound for pound they must be just about the best supporters in the land.)
3) STEWARDING AND POLICING - Extra stewards and police were brought in. In my view there seemed to be an overreaction by some stewards and some police who are not usually at Stanley matches.
4) Finally BEHAVIOUR - Bearing in mind the first two points - BIG GAME atmosphere and PASSION, Behaviour is easily changed both individuallyand as a group.

My Conclusions;
a) A few individuals in the Ultras may have behaved a bit too enthusiastically, eg. throwing a few till rolls during the match. Surely such a small amount of silliness could have been tolerated.
b) Some police and Stewards too were affected by the same atmospheric factors and similarly went over the top, OTT, in the way they treated some of the fans.
c) The result to one attempted "questioning" of a fan was a total escalation into unnecessary mayhem.

Lessons to learn;
Ultras – Better to have no till roll throwing and definitely no smoke flares. Also don’t get involved if anything kicks off even the smallest problem.
ASFC – Club stewards must be allowed to be “In charge” and to fully brief any additional stewards / police before the match. It should also be the ASFC senior stewards who make any decisions about approaching individual supporters.
Police and Additional Stewards – Learn to apply some common sense and respect the people who they are supposed to be helping. ie The fans.

I was in the middle of the Clayton End and stayed there singing and blowing my horn until the police came over the wall as the real fuss was going on. One LARGE policemen laid a hand on my back and rudely told me to leave the ground. I had to ask him politly THREE times to take his hand off me before I would move. In my opinion he was unnecessarilly rude and disrespectful to a fan who had done absolutley no wrong. He did not offer any kind of apology. As I deprted through the gates I was nearly trodden on by an even larger Police horse!
I hope the the Ultra lads who have been charged are treated fairly and that they receive no banning orders. I think a warning not to get involved in the future should be sufficient.

[cashman]

i hope ya put these events that happened to ya mate in n e-mail to the link jase put up?

[lancsdave]

Article on Telegraph website which also gives a couple of quotes from the club
Stanley fans rally round accused supporters' group leader (From Lancashire Telegraph)

[Chimer]

Choirboy is just about spot on. As a southern exile, my rare pilgrimage to the frozen north (with the missus) was made fantastic by the Ultras' efforts. For Jase to be banned would be a serious blow to ASFC as a whole.

We didn't hang about after the game (my throat was a bit dry!) so we have nothing to offer the defence. The only thing I would add to Choirboy's analysis is to note that the Ultras are a bunch of committed individuals plus whoever, pre-teen nutter or boring old git, attaches themselves at the edges for an evening, so can't be controlled - or, therefore, self-policed - as the committed ones might wish.

Imho, the second salvo of till rolls at half time (after the stewards had cleared off the first lot) was unnecessary, the subsequent individual till rolls aimed at their keeper stupid, and the smoke flares moronic and asking for trouble. And I don't like seeing eight-year olds watching the crowd rather than the game, only turning round to wave v-signs at the opposition (especially when they're getting in the way of me seeing the pitch!) On the other hand, the reported post-game performance of police and stewards can't be justified by anything that went before

The overall Ultra effect was still fantastic, and it was a real blow to get home (not till Sunday) and read about the fracas on the board.

Fingers crossed for Jase next week, and all respect for his post above.

[cashman]

Originally Posted by lancsdave

Article on Telegraph website which also gives a couple of quotes from the club
Stanley fans rally round accused supporters' group leader (From Lancashire Telegraph)

Whilst i can understand the club are unable to comment on matters that are in the police hands, its lamentable they aint commented on the imported stewards n imported police regarding "WHO" actually briefed these people? who's behavior led to the stuff they are unable to comment on.

[Revived Red]

There is one aspect of all this that no-one has commented on and that is the total inaction of the stewards when the till rolls were being thrown.

For the people sitting near me, it was a huge joke that the stewards simply stood and watched the tills rolls being thrown before the game and at half-time. Their attempt to clear them away was slow and laughable. Why were the stewards not near/in the Clayton End to prevent the till rolls being thrown?

Surely prevention is always better than cure.

[Bagpuss]

Originally Posted by Revived Red

There is one aspect of all this that no-one has commented on and that is the total inaction of the stewards when the till rolls were being thrown.

Because permission was given to throw till rolls before play started.