Today's Programme

[Doug]

Originally Posted by maccawozzagod

Doug, I probably wouldn't have done it neither if I am honest. But anyone with a pair of eyes can see how much we have struggled to raise £100k and it is strongly believed that we owe a total of around 7 times this figure.

It is more than probable that ASFC and O'Neil will survive this month and assume that the hard work is over, wrong IMHO.

The club is still nowhere near being self sufficient and O'Neil is not going to put money in to cover the debts. The accounts just published that showed a deficit of a hundred and odd thousand pounds were for 2007-2008 season. The following season I could see no evidence of having turned that figure around plus we had the unpaid Fraser Eagle money (that would have shown on those figures) in addition to further crowd dwindles. It is more than feasible that the figures for 2008-2009 will be show even further losses. Without Eric putting his hand in his own pocket I cant see who will. So 2009-2010, what has changed to make us think that we will not only make up those losses but can move the club forward whilst servicing the debts?

ASSF would have done this.

However, it is more than clear that this will not now happen so we will have to just fade into the background again and be ready to attempt a bail out if and when we find ourselves in this position again.

Rob, the last thing you should do is fade; Spear head the bloody future; get into bed with whoever you have too and work away in the knowledge that sooner or later, with experience the ASSF is the best supporter’s body to take the Name of Accrington Stanley and advance it as a commercial organisation, Mr. Colman & Mr. Bell will do the rest; in fact there doing it and that alone makes this bloody struggle so worth while.

I was never saying that the ASSF was wrong; it’s just the wrong time.

[shakermaker]

Doug, you speak of the ASSF needing a "a clear framework, long term action plan and a strong constitution" in order to be involved with the club. As far as we know, David O'Neill has none of these things; neither has he the finances that the ASSF had, which is what the club are in desperate need of at the moment. Long term plans won't satisfy HMRC.

The club have been saying that the ASSF offer would've just been a quick fix offering no long term solution, which is absolutely ridiculous. It was the only long term solution.

Some expect us to survive by the skin of our teeth come judgment day, whereas I'm pretty much resigned to defeat. I think either O'Neill & Co will come up with some silly offer which will be laughed off by HMRC, or a large amount of debt will be created in the form of directors' loans in order to pay the tax. Davo07 is completely correct in my opinion when he says that David O'Neill has a track record of spin over substance as far as ASFC is concerned.

Both Mr Khan and Mr O'Neill stated that they won't let the club fold. Only one of them backed up their statement with a large cash offer, and he was turned away.

[DAV007]

We still do not know what the 'other' offer was if indeed another offer existed in competition to the ASSF?

[Stanleymad]

To be honest nowt we can do but see is there? Im sick of worrying about it, sick of all the tripe so far simply the club are going to leave it to the wire as to whether we have a club or not to support, seriously if they dont care why should we do it all?! enough is enough now

[VALAIRIAN]

Originally Posted by DAV007

We still do not know what the 'other' offer was if indeed another offer existed in competition to the ASSF?

I believe very strongly, that there was not any other offer

[simon]

DOUG....................... shut up


Dont mean to upset you doug, but you are sounding like a politician with all spin and words...

The ASSF is a good framework, and the plan Macca has outlined above seems very logical.

WE ALL want stanley to survive..... WE ALL want it now.... BUT many of us can see the chance to see Stanley survive now and prosper into the future .

[simon]

Originally Posted by DAV007

How much does O'Neill/Whalley want for their shares?

further debt at this level of football is avoiding the inevitable.

Good question indeed. BUT 1 major shareholder whoever that is ... is not my ideal solution....

[Doug]

Originally Posted by shakermaker

Doug, you speak of the ASSF needing a "a clear framework, long term action plan and a strong constitution" in order to be involved with the club. As far as we know, David O'Neill has none of these things; neither has he the finances that the ASSF had, which is what the club are in desperate need of at the moment. Long term plans won't satisfy HMRC.

The club have been saying that the ASSF offer would've just been a quick fix offering no long term solution, which is absolutely ridiculous. It was the only long term solution.

Some expect us to survive by the skin of our teeth come judgment day, whereas I'm pretty much resigned to defeat. I think either O'Neill & Co will come up with some silly offer which will be laughed off by HMRC, or a large amount of debt will be created in the form of directors' loans in order to pay the tax. Davo07 is completely correct in my opinion when he says that David O'Neill has a track record of spin over substance as far as ASFC is concerned.

Both Mr Khan and Mr O'Neill stated that they won't let the club fold. Only one of them backed up their statement with a large cash offer, and he was turned away.

I almost wholly agree and that’s pretty much my point at this time…

The Tax issue is out of our hands now; there isn’t the time remaining for us to do anything all we can hope for is that Mr. O’Neil isn’t being a Pratt and pays the tax bill on or before court; if he makes an offer for less than the total amount then I agree we’d be ****ed.

But what I am trying to say is now’s the time for all the ASFC supporter groups to come together with the club and get into bed with them, work with them so that we can at least be ready next with a portfolio of funding streams and experience of managing both the ASSF and working partnerships, we would be much stronger and not dependent of anyone man; either in the ASSF or outside of it.

There where many ways in which Mr. Khan could have displayed is contempt of those elements on the board, Mr. O’Neil & Ms. Larsarse included, but he chose withdrawal we as a supporter organisation can’t be left exposed in that way again. Please Note that I have the utmost respect for Mr. Khan, this isn’t a dig.

The Stanley Ultras in a highly relevant committed group whose support behind the goal line is astronomical but it is a almost wholly localised supporter organisation based on physical support of the team in action, it is locally manned with limitations on mass recruitment and management on its own, that said it as provide itself a fantastic fund raising machine as well.

It’s strength and power has a group would be quadrupled working in partnership with other organisations,

It the same argument for the OSC, although we have to keep open a supporters organisation for those who just want to support the club at a basic level but again it’s strength and power has a supporters club would be quadrupled.

The ASSF could be seen as a hub of the supporter groups with international affiliations, i.e. North America, Norway, Asia, and Ireland amongst others. It could well be the basis of a future takeover if and when this crises repeats itself, but unless we as organisations come together and work with the club the outcome will be the same as now……in there hands and there hands alone.

[bdc]

I think that the ASSF is probably the only idea that could've worked for the long-term future of the club. It worries me a lot that I have seen comments like those from Ms Lazarus regarding doing deals with HMRC. the fact is either the money is paid or the club is gone. Also, if the DON is hoping to raise capital and put it in as Director Loans, I don't think that will solve the long-term issue. At the end of the day, the ASSF offered to wipe the slate clean and start again on a level footing which would over the long-term helped to stabilise the club. The fundamental problem is that the club does not generate enough income to pay all of the bills add to this the fact that the historical debt is still outstanding what is the best way to solve it other than ASSF? I do feel that with the right management team in place the club can be self-sufficient but I don't that will be with the current management team.

[Doug]

Originally Posted by simon

DOUG....................... shut up

In a way it used to be my Job

But nothing come of it; it hit a brick wall and stalled....

Agreed

No problem Simon, I'll do just that now, I've said what I wanted to say.

But think on; I can’t meet you lot at the pub or at the ground and have these discussions, none of my mates are near to me to bounce views and ideas off, all I have is a message board. But I’ll leave well alone now.

[simon]

At the END of the day we dont know as much as the men at ASFC but 2 men who are reputable business men and have Stanley in there hearts and know more than US have seperated themselves from the current plan..

Huge Statement............

[lancsdave]

Originally Posted by Doug

But what I am trying to say is now’s the time for all the ASFC supporter groups to come together with the club and get into bed with them,

How many times do they need to try? I don't just mean during the current crisis.

[katei77]

I thought someone may of picked up on page 19 of the programme

Partnership with the University of Central Lancashire

Accrington Stanley FC are close to announcing a new partnership with academic institute the University of Central Lancashire(UCLan)

The deal is due to be complete over the next couple days which will raise the profile of both parties.

The deal will be mutually beneficial as the club will gain from the knowledge and support of the academic staff and students.

(UCLan)has a pool of high quality students in which ASFC can provide experiential learning for them in such areas as sports journalism,physiotherapy,video analysis and fitness testing.

The partnership aims to develop over the next twelve months with ASFC planning to take on a 3rd year undergraduate to do comprehensive video analysis assisting John and Jimmy.

(this is not the full write up just some points from it )

It would seem strange for a body like UCLan to enter into a partnership unless they are certain that the partnership could be fullfilled by both parties

This is by all means going to be a long running partnership(min 12 months)

You would of thought that a body like UCLan would not risk the education of its students with a company who could well not be trading in a few weeks time

Makes you think doesnt it

[lancsdave]

Originally Posted by katei77

I thought someone may of picked up on page 19 of the programme

Partnership with the University of Central Lancashire

Accrington Stanley FC are close to announcing a new partnership with academic institute the University of Central Lancashire(UCLan)

The deal is due to be complete over the next couple days which will raise the profile of both parties.

The deal will be mutually beneficial as the club will gain from the knowledge and support of the academic staff and students.

(UCLan)has a pool of high quality students in which ASFC can provide experiential learning for them in such areas as sports journalism,physiotherapy,video analysis and fitness testing.

The partnership aims to develop over the next twelve months with ASFC planning to take on a 3rd year undergraduate to do comprehensive video analysis assisting John and Jimmy.

(this is not the full write up just some points from it )

It would seem strange for a body like UCLan to enter into a partnership unless they certain that the partnership could be fullfilled by both parties

This is by all means going to be a long running partnership(min 12 months)

You would of thought that a body like UCLan would not risk the education of its students with a company who could well not be trading in a few weeks time

Makes you think doesnt it

They appointed a student the other day to be responsible for coverage of the reserve and youth teams.

[katei77]

That is my point why would a body as the UCLan even entertain the idea of going into partnership with ASFC unless there was firm assurances from ASFC(in a legal contract i would of thought)

they have me wondering again